or Connect
Styleforum › Forums › General › Current Events, Power and Money › ethan's Musing on the Near East
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

ethan's Musing on the Near East - Page 55

post #811 of 2699
Three Somali Moslems just murdered a Somali Christian in Maine. Bashed his skull.

Keep 'em coming.

Celebrate diversity! smile.gif
post #812 of 2699
Bullshit military already takes up half our salaries.
post #813 of 2699
Thread Starter 

post #814 of 2699
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lighthouse View Post

Three Somali Moslems just murdered a Somali Christian in Maine. Bashed his skull.

Keep 'em coming.

Celebrate diversity! smile.gif


Two Eritrean "refugees" killed to random people in Ikea in Sweden a couple weeks ago, because they got refused asylum and now they can stay.

http://www.thelocal.se/20150813/cctv-shows-ikea-suspect-tried-to-kill-himself
post #815 of 2699
Quote:
Originally Posted by ethanm View Post

The U.S. is going to accept 8k Syrian refugees. I wish we could take them all.

So does Europe and the middle east, UAE, Bahrain, Qatar etc. have taken 738 combined and will deport them if caught. Europe has taken millions.

The ones you guys are getting are by a vast majority the 1%'s "of the opposition", who are willing and able to support themselves, just like the Koreans, Jews, Japanese, Iranians etc. you have received previously and will more than likely become millionaires by the end of the decade.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ethanm View Post


Tell me, what makes you think it would take half of everybody's salary?

We have had multiple cases in the media recently of people, who have come here only the suck on the tit of free health care. Over a 3rd of all non western immigrants in Denmark are on early retirement, so they are not contributing anything at all and never have. Where I grew up there was people who have lived here since the 80's who still don't speak anything but their native tongue.

There was a guy on BBC today from the train station in Budapest, who claimed that Europe should let them all in, as we can easily afford it. I don't know where they think the money comes from, but it seems like they think it's a bottomless piggybank.
post #816 of 2699
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Find Finn View Post


So does Europe and the middle east, UAE, Bahrain, Qatar etc. have taken 738 combined and will deport them if caught. 

 

While I think refugee camps are entirely counterproductive, the Gulf has mostly financed camps in Jordan. I'm pretty sure the lion's share of the funding for Za'atari is from the UAE. 

 

 

Then you have Kuwait saying they can't take any because they have PTSD and won't be able to integrate. Because the transition from Shaam to the Gulf is much harder than to Germany. Oy. 

post #817 of 2699
They also claim that they can't take them, as they only have citizenships and you can't live there without one, funnily enough the UAE is 90% expats.

Lebanon has taken almost 2 million Syrians and about the same palestinians, in a country of 5 million.
post #818 of 2699
Quote:
Originally Posted by Find Finn View Post

So does Europe and the middle east, UAE, Bahrain, Qatar etc. have taken 738 combined and will deport them if caught. Europe has taken millions.

The ones you guys are getting are by a vast majority the 1%'s "of the opposition", who are willing and able to support themselves, just like the Koreans, Jews, Japanese, Iranians etc. you have received previously and will more than likely become millionaires by the end of the decade.
We have had multiple cases in the media recently of people, who have come here only the suck on the tit of free health care. Over a 3rd of all non western immigrants in Denmark are on early retirement, so they are not contributing anything at all and never have. Where I grew up there was people who have lived here since the 80's who still don't speak anything but their native tongue.

.

Which is why I hope that this mass migration will finally trigger a policy debate on how we structure our welfare states. The times that our nations could afford to give anyone a basic income that couldn't or wouldn't work are over, we could only do that due to a demographic fluke and resources that were found that we are now on the verge of exhausting. If you can't work, fine we'll support you to the point that you can live a dignified life. If you can contribute in any meaningful way, get to work, any work, and you get only the minimal amount of support so you won't starve.

The same way with the migrant debates, its utterly insane that we keep those people locked up, only to provide them with housing and government subsidies after a long administrative process. Given the demographics in Europe we need the workers (we didn't have the steady influx of mexicans to fill up the gap behind the boomer generation). So let them stay, force them through language school and if they don't know a trade, teach them one. The german employers federation proposed exactly that some months ago...

And at the same time this shitstorm might finally force our politicians to see that we can't keep cutting our military budgets without far reaching integration of the armed forces in Europe. The eastern border with russia demands a general and coherent effort. The same with the mediterranean, we should be able to project enough force to engage the countries in the north of Africa. Not to invade them, but enough to intervene to prevent a disintegration of the regime there. Now its Syria that is causing this influx of migrants. From what I hear Libya is well on its way to become the next Syria if we don't do something, and libya will really be pandoras box.
post #819 of 2699
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Find Finn View Post

They also claim that they can't take them, as they only have citizenships and you can't live there without one, funnily enough the UAE is 90% expats.

Lebanon has taken almost 2 million Syrians and about the same palestinians, in a country of 5 million.


Yes and the current crisis is because many have given up on the war ever being solved. All of the Syrians I know say the same thing, we saw what the US did in Libya and we figured we'd wait in Lebanon, Turkey, Jordan etc until then. Now that t's clear that is never going to happen they are seeking more permanent solutions. 

post #820 of 2699
Quote:
Originally Posted by nootje View Post


Which is why I hope that this mass migration will finally trigger a policy debate on how we structure our welfare states. The times that our nations could afford to give anyone a basic income that couldn't or wouldn't work are over, we could only do that due to a demographic fluke and resources that were found that we are now on the verge of exhausting. If you can't work, fine we'll support you to the point that you can live a dignified life. If you can contribute in any meaningful way, get to work, any work, and you get only the minimal amount of support so you won't starve.

The same way with the migrant debates, its utterly insane that we keep those people locked up, only to provide them with housing and government subsidies after a long administrative process. Given the demographics in Europe we need the workers (we didn't have the steady influx of mexicans to fill up the gap behind the boomer generation). So let them stay, force them through language school and if they don't know a trade, teach them one. The german employers federation proposed exactly that some months ago...

And at the same time this shitstorm might finally force our politicians to see that we can't keep cutting our military budgets without far reaching integration of the armed forces in Europe. The eastern border with russia demands a general and coherent effort. The same with the mediterranean, we should be able to project enough force to engage the countries in the north of Africa. Not to invade them, but enough to intervene to prevent a disintegration of the regime there. Now its Syria that is causing this influx of migrants. From what I hear Libya is well on its way to become the next Syria if we don't do something, and libya will really be pandoras box.

It has never been sustainable to support people who don't want to work and never will be, people who can't deserve help, so they can live a respectable life. Sadly most of the immigrants on early retirement are about as sick or less than you and I.

Around here we have 1.3m private sector worker (including government supported industries like wind), 1m government workers and the rest of the 5.5m are on some sort of government funded pay (pension, student pay, wellfare etc.).

It's essentially 23% of the public who are funding the rest of the nations wages and spending including school, hospitals etc.. with the amount of refugees coming in who need housing, schooling and health care are society will tumble and is already well on the way, as the money and homes need to come from somewhere, which is currently student housing.

The problem at least here, which made Ethan call me a Fascist wink.gif, is that our government has made us uncompetitive, so all our production jobs have been exported to Asia and EE, so there are no jobs to give the uneducated ones, so..... uhoh.gif

Libya has been a problem for a loooooooong time, as it's the source of all of the african boat immigrant, who are 90% wellfare tourists. I have heard of people who have jobs, who flee to get a better paying job, there was even a documentary about 5 from Cameron who thought they could go to France and become pro footballers, while being illegals.

We are also getting a lot of Nigerians and Nigerian is the worlds 3rd biggest consumer of champagne and a large growth economy, so I don't understand why. Asia was in the same place as Africa 30 years ago, the only difference is that Asia found away out Africa chose to keep on their asses and now they are relying on Chinese investments. I also read that we are getting Indonesian, Pakistani refugees etc. at the moment as well, WTF are they running from.

The european countries should follow the dutch immigration model and tell people they have 3 years to become fluent and force them to see a video of gays kissing etc., so they know what they are going into.



Quote:
Originally Posted by ethanm View Post


Yes and the current crisis is because many have given up on the war ever being solved. All of the Syrians I know say the same thing, we saw what the US did in Libya and we figured we'd wait in Lebanon, Turkey, Jordan etc until then. Now that t's clear that is never going to happen they are seeking more permanent solutions. 

I personally think it's too soon to give up, a lot of Europe (Including Denmark) was occupied by Nazi Germany for 5 years during the 40's. Only the people who needed to flee fled, the rest stayed and put up a fight. They should do the same if they love their country, if all of the 4 million'ish refugees did that the opposition wouldn't have a chance.
post #821 of 2699
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Find Finn View Post

I personally think it's too soon to give up, a lot of Europe (Including Denmark) was occupied by Nazi Germany for 5 years during the 40's. Only the people who needed to flee fled, the rest stayed and put up a fight. They should do the same if they love their country, if all of the 4 million'ish refugees did that the opposition wouldn't have a chance.

 

Look I don't know what your understanding of this conflict is but there is no "their country" anymore. There is regime Syria, Jihadi Syria, IS Syria, and Kurdish Syria. Where do those who are none of those things go? Maybe they would return if Asad's air force were grounded but with Russian and Iranian backing that is not going to happen. 

post #822 of 2699
From what I understand there are "safe" places in Syria just like in Afghanistan and Iraq. If they got rid a Assad I think they have taken a good step in the right direction and if Turkey stops bombing the Kurds who are fighting IS even bigger.

A Syrian refugee told the news the other day, that he wanted to bring his wife up, when the reporter asked if she was in danger, he said nope.
post #823 of 2699
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Find Finn View Post

From what I understand there are "safe" places in Syria just like in Afghanistan and Iraq. If they got rid a Assad I think they have taken a good step in the right direction and if Turkey stops bombing the Kurds who are fighting IS even bigger.


Damascus is safe-ish and the YPG controlled areas are safe-ish. But you say stand and fight. Who is there to fight for? Khamenei? Nasrallah? Asad? Zawahiri? Baghdadi? Alloush? These men are reprehensible to most Syrians.

post #824 of 2699
A safe democracy, with non of them, it should be possible.
post #825 of 2699
Quote:
Originally Posted by Find Finn View Post

A safe democracy, with non of them, it should be possible.

Not with the old borders. Only solution Imho is to redraw the lines on sectarian grounds, then help enforce them, and blow to kingdom come any army that crosses it to attack a different "new" country. Kinda worked in Yugoslavia.

It would not stop the terrorism immediately, nor stop the fighting. But give direction to the fighting and an anchor (or tie em down, whatever metaphor you'd prefer) to some of those groups.

Sadly, as long as Erdogan is around, and the EU not willing to unitedly strong-arm him, Turkey will never allow a kurdish state, which would be the first to start with..
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Current Events, Power and Money
Styleforum › Forums › General › Current Events, Power and Money › ethan's Musing on the Near East