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ethan's Musing on the Near East - Page 115

post #1711 of 2698
Quote:
Originally Posted by tesseract View Post

I know i just saw merkel is giving turkey 3 billion dollars. NATO is fighting itself basically.

And visa free travel for turks apparently
post #1712 of 2698
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Erdogan’s victory in the elections was very convenient for Syrian Sunni Arab rebels, because the long and, as they say, “porous” border between Turkey and Syria can get a lot more porous (think sieve with a big hole punched in it) if the Turkish rulers are in the mood. And Erdgoan’s Islamists, preaching Sunni unity and nursing old grudges against Assad’s Alawite sect, basically installed a JO (“Jihadis Only”) lane along all 1200km of the Syrian border. Turkish border guards’ arms got tired, waving so many Toyota pickups full of heavily bearded young men through the border crossings. Their necks got cramped from nodding like they believed it when the young men in those trucks told them there was nothing but old scrap under the tarp in the truck bed. And, no doubt, their pants pockets got frayed from the wads of cash those well-financed jihadis slipped them to make sure no inconvenient inspections were carried out. After all, ideology isn’t everything, and a border guard without a few coffee cans of cash buried in his yard isn’t really a proper border guard at all.


https://pando.com/2015/02/24/the-war-nerd-tomb-raiders-of-kobane/


http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2015/11/27/world-view-russia-accuses-turkey-of-industrial-scale-oil-purchases-from-isis/


http://mobile.nytimes.com/2014/09/14/world/middleeast/struggling-to-starve-isis-of-oil-revenue-us-seeks-assistance-from-turkey.html?referer=http://r.search.yahoo.com/RV=1/RE=1448943375/RB=/RO=8/RU=http%3a%2f%2fwww.nytimes.com%2f2014%2f09%2f14%2fworld%2fmiddleeast%2fstruggling-to-starve-isis-of-oil-revenue-us-seeks-assistance-from-turkey.html/RS=%5EADAVWk5VfMQH_X4TSDxuuS0PSVbSDg-


http://www.buzzfeed.com/mikegiglio/this-is-how-isis-smuggles-oil#.bj3QX8Kjq6
post #1713 of 2698
If turkey closes its border isis is dead within monthes
post #1714 of 2698
Quote:
Originally Posted by alan View Post

If turkey closes its border isis is dead within monthes

That's how I feel too, I have a feeling erdogan will never do that.
post #1715 of 2698
It's fine to accuse the Turks of turning a blind eye or even enabling conveniences, but what you've linked is a very different proposition than "primary funder."
post #1716 of 2698
Quote:
Originally Posted by the shah View Post

It's fine to accuse the Turks of turning a blind eye or even enabling conveniences, but what you've linked is a very different proposition than "primary funder."
Yeah an average of 1 million dollars a day wouldn't make them a prime funder. Get real.
post #1717 of 2698
Quote:
Originally Posted by alan View Post

If turkey closes its border isis is dead within monthes

Erdogan is a fucking idiot, I don't understand how people can vote for him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by alan View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by tesseract View Post

I know i just saw merkel is giving turkey 3 billion dollars. NATO is fighting itself basically.

And visa free travel for turks apparently

I mentioned this a couple of weeks ago, Merkel at her best.
post #1718 of 2698
Quote:
Originally Posted by tesseract View Post

Yeah an average of 1 million dollars a day wouldn't make them a prime funder. Get real.

Look , none of what you posted shows Turkey sending any amount of funds to ISIS, which was your original claim when you said "primary funder." Letting ISIS sell on the black market is not the action of a primary funder, that would be writing a check or in this instance sending trucks of cash from the Turkish government to the offices of ISIS.
post #1719 of 2698
Quote:
Originally Posted by the shah View Post

Look , none of what you posted shows Turkey sending any amount of funds to ISIS, which was your original claim when you said "primary funder." Letting ISIS sell on the black market is not the action of a primary funder, that would be writing a check or in this instance sending trucks of cash from the Turkish government to the offices of ISIS.
Quote:
Over in Turkey, the gendarmerie would clear a path in the hills, lighting it with the floodlights on their armored trucks. Back in Syria, a small army of vehicles bearing oil drums would arrive: buses, pickup trucks, taxis. Omar would take a drum, tie it to a rope, and drag it 100 yards across the border to the vehicles waiting on the other side.
post #1720 of 2698
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkish_Gendarmerie

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/Default.aspx?pageID=517&nID=77136&NewsCatID=344

So turkeys version of the national guard make and light pathways and turkey taxes oil at 66%. Hmmm… doesn't seem like erdogan profits from this at all.
post #1721 of 2698
Its pretty much as fact as anyone can prove in politics. Not sure how much proof youcan get when all the weapons, money and fifhters go through there withot any effort to stop them.

Russia has shown tons of satellite photos and the opposition in turkey mentioned many times and journalists were jailed there when they talked about it. Some cops were even jailed because they dared search a weapons truck (cant remember if it was going to nusra or isis)
post #1722 of 2698

I don't want to come across as offensive so please don't take it as such. But I'm not sure if you understood what you've written. These quotes aren't proving your point. It's not Turkey that's paying for this oil, Erdogan or his cabinet members or anyone affiliated with Turkey isn't anywhere listed in your articles. What's said is that some shady business deals are happening at border crossings that help ISIS sell its exports to outside buyers, and the Turks are turning closing eyes or letting it happen. But it even says "police have targeted smuggling routes, seizing oil drums and digging up pipelines," which just makes it even less of a claim to call Turkey the primary funder of IS. When you list a country's name, that implies officials associated with the government, not random merchants, are sending funds to ISIS. This is not what's happening here, no matter how much you want to believe and repeat it.
post #1723 of 2698
The russians have said that erdogans family and many officials are directly implicated.

If were gonna wait for obama to announce it then its another issue
post #1724 of 2698
Quote:
Originally Posted by the shah View Post

I don't want to come across as offensive so please don't take it as such. But I'm not sure if you understood what you've written. These quotes aren't proving your point. It's not Turkey that's paying for this oil, Erdogan or his cabinet members or anyone affiliated with Turkey isn't anywhere listed in your articles. What's said is that some shady business deals are happening at border crossings that help ISIS sell its exports to outside buyers, and the Turks are turning closing eyes or letting it happen. But it even says "police have targeted smuggling routes, seizing oil drums and digging up pipelines," which just makes it even less of a claim to call Turkey the primary funder of IS. When you list a country's name, that implies officials associated with the government, not random merchants, are sending funds to ISIS. This is not what's happening here, no matter how much you want to believe and repeat it.

No, you are being obtuse. Who has he power to create pathways and deploy armored vehicles in the gendarmerie? Where has erdogan spoke out against this or taken any actual measures to stop this? Yeah obviously erdogan isn't loading jerry cans into his mercedes but he's letting this happen and he's profiting through taxes and is allowing Turkish refineries to refine the crude oil without a single mention of sanctions against these companies.
post #1725 of 2698
This is not obtuse, this is going by the definition of what you claimed. The gendarmerie hasn't even sent funds. There is nothing about any government-related entitiy sending money. Anyway, I'm not saying it's impossible, just that based on the links thus far shared there's nothing that implicates Turkey, directly or otherwise, of "primary funder" status.
Quote:
Originally Posted by alan View Post

The russians have said that erdogans family and many officials are directly implicated.

If were gonna wait for obama to announce it then its another issue

You'll have to excuse me if I don't believe a word the Russians say
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