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Grenson masterpieces $250 - Page 3

post #31 of 80
I have read posts in the past speculating that both C&J and Alfred Sargent made shoes for Shipton. I even once read that Shipton really was C&J. I do not know what is correct as to these, but it appears likely to me that Grenson did make your Bedford for Shipton. Grenson must have sent Bennie's every return, reject, etc., that it had. You could have gotten the only Shipton that Bennies' has or maybe they have many more. I only looked in 5% of the boxes at Bennie's. This is likely to cause a flurry of calls to Bennie's, as the very similiar-looking Weymouth is extremely popular among forum members. I got a pair myself from PLAL a few months ago, before the $70 price increase, but I still paid about $325.
post #32 of 80
Thanks for the information. Curious as to the fact that the Shipton Bedford appears to be more expensive than the C&J Weymouth yet they look virtually identical and *may* be made by the same manufacturer. V-
post #33 of 80
I doubt that Bennie's got anything from C&J. Louie said that they were all Grensons. Although the C&J Weymouth now costs about $395 at PLAL, it is about $425 from C&J in London. Ben Silver's USA price for them is $495.00. Paul Stuart sells its Grensons for a bit more than the Ben Silver C&J price range, but it also sells Samuesohn suits for a higher price than most other stores.  However, Paul Stuart Samuesohn's are made of better cloth. I think C&J handgrades and Grenson Masterpieces are roughly equal in quality; any difference in price may be due to the fact that Paul Stuart is very fashionable and is on Madison Avenue, occupying some of the most expensive space on earth.
post #34 of 80
I have read posts in the past speculating that both C&J and Alfred Sargent made shoes for Shipton.
Having seen Shipton & Heneage shoes in person now at their showroom, I can confirm that both C&J and Alfred Sargent do make (some of the) shoes for them. The ones made by Alfred Sargent literally have "Alfred Sargent" printed on the soles. It's not just a case of C&J making the Premium range and AS making the Select range though, e.g. the Premium wholecuts are actually made by AS.
post #35 of 80
Unfortunately I cannot find the e-mail that Shipton sent me some months back. I asked who made about 8 of their styles and they gave me a list of who made what. All I can remember is that they said the Grosvenor and Bruton monkstrap shoes were made by C&J.
post #36 of 80
Should you come across that email, by all means, post it as I'm sure that some of us here will find this info quite interesting. V-
post #37 of 80
Curious as to the fact that the Shipton Bedford appears to be more expensive than the C&J Weymouth yet they look virtually identical and *may* be made by the same manufacturer.
I own a pair of the S&H Bedfords, in dark brown, which I bought from the Paris store about 2 months ago. The salesman told me that they were manufactured by C&J, although I suppose he could have been mistaken. Most of the other shoes they have are by C&J and the others by Sargent; I don't recall which ones though. BTW, the price of the Bedfords in the store were around 260 Euros. The online price of 349 includes "free" shipping. Although the Bedford looks similar to the Weymouth, the quality is definitely not as good. For example, the stitching on the soles aren't channelled. Still a nice shoe though.
post #38 of 80
Here you can see the difference in the soles of both shoes: This first one is the Grenson: This next one is the Shipton Bedford: They both appear to be channeled to my unrefined eye however there is clearly a difference in the construction of the sole. I do not profess to know just how substantial these differences are. V-
post #39 of 80
Thread Starter 
Keys - Actully, the Shipton Bedford's sole is not channeled but rather stitched aloft. If it is indeed made by C&J, it seems as though it is made to banchgrade and not handgrade standard.
post #40 of 80
The shoes at the top (Grenson) are channelled. The lower ones (S&H) are stitched aloft. The observable difference is that you can see the stitching in the latter and not the former (until worn).
post #41 of 80
Thanks for the clarification gentleman. I was under the impression that a "channeled sole" referred to the ridges along the top outer edge of the sole that protrudes past the upper. My bad. Is the stitched aloft method considered dramatically inferior? If this is the case I would suspect that the Shipton's, indeed, pale in comparison to the Grenson's. I would equally suspect that, regardless, they were a pretty good deal for $150. V-
post #42 of 80
Mr. Comolli and I went back to Bennie's at Piedmont Road today after our traditional "Fashion Friday" luncheon. That trip cost us $150 each. He got the 8002 punched cap toe oxford in Cognac and I got a model I have never seen before. It was #8102, a 4 eyelet chiseled toe whole-cut in very antiqued Cognac, completely plain except for a slender line of edge-type stitching running around the whole top portion of the shoe all the way from the front to the back, forming a "U" shape in the front, below the laces. A strikingly elegant and beautifully shaped slender looking shoe. Louie looked in the back and found it for me. Bennie's has a lot of the Grensons on the racks now and has an amazingly huge assortment of magnificent one-of-a-kind models. They are actually the best and most distinctive looking in the store. They have some real "finds." I was looking at the 10Ds and saw the following: (a) a dynamite double monk strap, very much like the EG Westminster, in the color EG calls acorn antique. (b) a beautiful penny loafer, the "Radley" (Grenson model number 8009) in the color EG calls acorn antique. Mr. Comolli tried on a size 13D plain monk strap, very much like the EG Falmouth in Cognac (the color EG calls chestnut antique). They also had a black patent oxford in his size. I saw a large assortment of different models on the racks in 9.5Ds. To see the huge variety they have, one really need to visit all three stores. I think it may be too much to ask, but if you are lucky, you may call and find a very patient salesman who will go to the racks and/or look in the back, and/or call the other two stores for a good description of exactly what they have in your size. I suggested to Louie that he post pictures of his one-of-a-kind, or nearly one-of-a-kind models with sizes. He asked if I thought the forum members might object, since he is a merchant, but I told him that I doubted it, as he has a true once-in-a-lifetime treasure trove here.
post #43 of 80
Good heavens, someone PLEASE post some pictures once your Grensons arrive. Take some pictures of these. (I wouldn't mind seeing pictures of the J&M handgrades some of you purchased as well).
post #44 of 80
I called yesterday and ordered a pair from Chris, who was very helpful. I'm an 11D, and figured there wouldn't be much left. He said he had a burgundy captoe with holepunching (I assumed the rugby), but I told him I was looking for more a dark brown, without the red of a burgundy color. He looked around for me, called back and said he'd found a pair of captoes without brogueing in what he called "chili", like the Allen Edmonds color. That color seems to be applied to a range of actual colors, so we'll see. I ordered them, but was a little worried, because scanning the sites that sell Grensons I didn't see any captoes in brown among the masterpiece models - not that I'm picky, I just need a new pair of brown shoes and figured this was a good deal. Anyway, I remembered that someone here said they might be made for Paul Stuart, so now I'm  hoping they'll be similar to these, or these, both of which are pretty darn sweet. Also, the Grenson website has the same claim about finest "french alpine calfskin." I don't have a digital camera, so I probably won't be able to post pics, but when they're delivered I'll be able to comment on them from a layman's perspective, never having had a premium pair of dress shoes before. Not that anyone wants a layman's perspective. Hoping I'm not too young to pull these off...
post #45 of 80
What Shoreman, say that again? I called Rob about 1.5 weeks ago and he didn't say he had any of those two models that you mentioned is size 11.In fact I called him again today, although I was just asking if there is any returns of Grenson Masterpieces.
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