gennaro paone: former head tailor of rubinacci

With the frequency at which you buy new clothes you should be sending me some money.



patrickBOOTH said:

Well, that will happen, yes, but that's not all of it. Maybe I romanticize getting clothes made more than most, but it is a journey and I enjoy being a player in keeping the craft alive. I get a lot out of that.

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jedwards said:

Fair enough Sarto, and as someone who has great respect for tailors, am going to have respect your position.

I disagree with you though when you say there are only maybe 5 good tailors left in the world, or do you mean Italy? Or even just Naples?

Out of the several different tailors I've used over the years (I like to try different house styles) very few I have come away thinking "how awful"... But then I am an educated customer who will challenge the tailor if there is something I am not happy with during the fittings which always seems to provide the best outcome.


Some newbies here say nothing throughout and then go online to get feedback...

But Signore Sarto.... Sooner or later you will have to put your money where your mouth is and show us your own work on here...
As you learning this craft yourself, you must be willing to face the criticisms of your work that you have given to others online.

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I would say as I order more items and begin to wear my clothes day in and day out I begin to learn my likes and dislikes. I'm able to voice these to whoever is making my clothes and the pattern is eventually refined over multiple iterations. I'm under the impression that a majority of people who constantly switch tailors don't always speak up in voicing their wants and needs for an item. And since most customers don't know what they want the tailor creates a house style that he thinks is flattering to most men even if its not very flattering.



SartodiNapoli said:

I think so, just comparing it with going to a different hairdresser everytime with more chances of not getting what you expected or always to your familiar one.

My advise is going to one you know or have seen he does the cut you like. Per example don't ask a for a deconstructed light cut to a Madrid tailor who only delivers a several kilos armoured jacket, only go if you want a Reagan's cut. Or a skinny Prada fit to another specialiced on old politicians.

Chances to be dissapointed are big.

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This is some of the best advice ever given on styleforum. @dieworkwear This is the part where i curse at you for writing so well and putting me on to new tailors that I want to try. Sadly, I don't have the money to jump around to multiple tailors and work on getting my pattern adjusted.



lordsuperb said:

I would say as I order more items and begin to wear my clothes day in and day out I begin to learn my likes and dislikes. I'm able to voice these to whoever is making my clothes and the pattern is eventually refined over multiple iterations. I'm under the impression that a majority of people who constantly switch tailors don't always speak up in voicing their wants and needs for an item. And since most customers don't know what they want the tailor creates a house style that he thinks is flattering to most men even if its not very flattering.

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Yes, those Madrid tailors shilled by some bloggers who selfsay are better than Savile or Naples does even the same lapel width to a 250 kilos person than for a tall athletic one as the actual King of Spain and that is totally contrary to the basic principles of tailoring. They simply got rich selling the same pattern, fabric and everything at 2500e to all their clientele from size 48 to 56 is all the one fits all cut and pattern. You already know my usual word for this. I told them this on their face and got kicked of it, buti am proud of it.

For some tailors, their clientele are just a talking cashmachine. I have met enough...So never never pay full in advance by any reason. If he forces you, leave and look for another more honest.

lordsuperb said:

This is some of the best advice ever given on styleforum. @dieworkwear This is the part where i curse at you for writing so well and putting me on to new tailors that I want to try. Sadly, I don't have the money to jump around to multiple tailors and work on getting my pattern adjusted.

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Thanks.

Madrid has some excellent workmanship, but unfortunately you're right in that most tailors here make a way too structured coat, and few of them know how to cut a jacket that will actually flatter the customer. Lapel width, for example, seems to be a matter of fashion for them

May I ask where those €400 a jacket tailors are?



unbelragazzo said:

Maybe, but Astaire and the Dook, perhaps the two most idolized dressers of the 20th century, were not exactly adonises.

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But they both kept the weight off and that seems to be far more important.

The reason they're so well regarded, IMO, is that they're both examples of good tailors doing very good work for clients who naturally look good in clothes.

Part of what makes them stand out is how rare that is today - the groups of good tailors and thin men are both a lot smaller today than they used to be.



RDiaz said:

Madrid has some excellent workmanship, but unfortunately you're right in that most tailors here make a way too structured coat, and few of them know how to cut a jacket that will actually flatter the customer. Lapel width, for example, seems to be a matter of fashion for them

May I ask where those €400 a jacket tailors are?

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Whats wrong with a structured coat?



lordsuperb said:

Whats wrong with a structured coat?

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Absolutely nothing, but it goes against iGent received wisdom.

It's worth noting that a soft, unstructured look does not look great on everyone. If you have large traps, sloping shoulders, etc., an unstructured look will simply make you look egg shaped.



RDiaz said:

Madrid has some excellent workmanship, but unfortunately you're right in that most tailors here make a way too structured coat, and few of them know how to cut a jacket that will actually flatter the customer. Lapel width, for example, seems to be a matter of fashion for them

May I ask where those €400 a jacket tailors are?

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That is a myth that Spanish famous tailors got good handwork, actually is poor as their fit. I have seen Larrainzar suits, the one who use the fact of being the tailor of the King as it only that gives them the tailoring superpowers he lacks of and the sewing was poor, ugly buttonholes, made by apprentises on maybe their first week, no shoulder height correction, plenty of fails on the breast, collar, lapels and no idea of cutting and sewing sleeves apart of having the armhole as low as your stomach that goes again the basic rules of tailoring as well.

Well, even for the King he knows to do a proper fit or does the anti protocole of twin lapel buttonholes on the same lapel, as seen on last X-mas 24th December speech. Also delivering 4 sizes more jackets and trousers where two men do fit on it, not talking about making a skinny trouser here, but not a horrid one plenty of wrinkles. For me is the worst and most pretentious tailor, who got no clue about cutting or fabrics, dares to say Gorina, a cheapo stiff and harsh poorly finished fabric beats Piana, jaja. No wonder he is bankrupted as fooled half the country delivering that low product on Gorina 20euros/meter at 2500 e. He said he beats Savile or Naples as well. An applause for his ignorance.

Also is unable to do a jacket without literally 10 cms. Shoulder padding that is the trick to fit easily everybody. I have seen his attemps to do a unstructured ones and were laughlable and i am being serious, sadly have not hete the pics with me. He even sold them at full price instead of having the honour to say, i am unable of doing it, sorry. The victim was a well know person of mine who was hooked by the fact of being the tailor of the King, not a good tailor instead. Maybe he has a web where you can see his creations. On Facebook he was and was horrid. Deserves to be watched. Ugly vest and poor cuts even on the Manekin.

Look him under the name Herbon and cia.

On another interview he invents the story of random vip person giving him measures and then it was a gift for Reagan who was pleased. Listen, if he is unable to fit in person after several fits, imagine to a perfectionist as Reagan with perhaps wrong measures and without any fit. No way this story was for real! Just using again celebrity names to hook people. Oh i go to the Reagan's and the Kings tailor do you know? Wow you are true elegant then... sic.

You all know i disslike Rubinacci but the dignity of this Larrainzar is so low to say who are their celebrity clients in order to attract low knowledge ones or to show on camera patterns of the King of Spain ( I wonder where his corpse would be if done this with any Saudi King patterns instead) and to invite Rubinacci to Madrid on a well know shill blog meeting, to then lie saying his low product beats Rubinacci after they inspected it. That is the most dishonourable thing to invite any to dishonour and bash him to hype themselves around and even is fake they do better than Rubinacci or any medium Neapolitan.

For the economic good tailors are plenty of good unknow ones on the center.



Grammaton Cleric said:

Absolutely nothing, but it goes against iGent received wisdom.

It's worth noting that a soft, unstructured look does not look great on everyone. If you have large traps, sloping shoulders, etc., an unstructured look will simply make you look egg shaped.

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+1 i think one of the best threads for English garments is the david reeves thread. I wish some these well known bloggers would do a write up or try a structured coat. I think SF is too caught up on the soft cuts.



SartodiNapoli said:

I think so, just comparing it with going to a different hairdresser everytime with more chances of not getting what you expected or always to your familiar one.

My advise is going to one you know or have seen he does the cut you like. Per example don't ask a for a deconstructed light cut to a Madrid tailor who only delivers a several kilos armoured jacket, only go if you want a Reagan's cut. Or a skinny Prada fit to another specialiced on old politicians.

Chances to be dissapointed are big.

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That is the truth. Start with a "house style" that you like.



Grammaton Cleric said:

Absolutely nothing, but it goes against iGent received wisdom.

It's worth noting that a soft, unstructured look does not look great on everyone. If you have large traps, sloping shoulders, etc., an unstructured look will simply make you look egg shaped.

Click to expand...

Absolutely.

I've never understood why structured tailoring is criticised - at it's best it's the height of English military based tailoring?

As far as I can see, Liverano, loved on here, is heavily structured too? Some people on here are the classic iGents, who, with all due respect have probably never ordered a hand made suit by an English or Italian tailor in their lives but they have so many opinions on this or that.

Both structured and unstructured have their place. Of course, poor tailoring has no place anywhere.

But I'm sure there are some great Spanish tailors - might not be the style that is currently popular or fashionable outside of Madrid / Spain, but that doesn't mean the workmanship is poor.

SartoDiNapoli my friend - my challenge remains now.
You must display your work on the internet for all to see, because you are very quick to publicly criticise other tailors' work. Can't have one without the other.

Minnis fresco 558




I'm surprised that nobody has noticed the incredibly bad fit of the waistcoat! This might just as well be OTR -
Assuming that this is the finished product - it is appears not only too short, but doesn't cling to the body as it is supposed to.

Mind you, this observation is made by someone who has used Gennaro (at LH) with excellent results.

I knew the iGent topic was going to come out. Well, there's absolutely nothing wrong with a structured coat and most of my coats are structured. But we are talking about overly structured with old school spanish tailoring. There are, of course, tailors who can do better here.

SartodiNapoli said:

That is a myth that Spanish famous tailors got good handwork, actually is poor as their fit. I have seen Larrainzar suits, the one who use the fact of being the tailor of the King as it only that gives them the tailoring superpowers he lacks of and the sewing was poor, ugly buttonholes, made by apprentises on maybe their first week, no shoulder height correction, plenty of fails on the breast, collar, lapels and no idea of cutting and sewing sleeves apart of having the armhole as low as your stomach that goes again the basic rules of tailoring as well.

Well, even for the King he knows to do a proper fit or does the anti protocole of twin lapel buttonholes on the same lapel, as seen on last X-mas 24th December speech. Also delivering 4 sizes more jackets and trousers where two men do fit on it, not talking about making a skinny trouser here, but not a horrid one plenty of wrinkles. For me is the worst and most pretentious tailor, who got no clue about cutting or fabrics, dares to say Gorina, a cheapo stiff and harsh poorly finished fabric beats Piana, jaja. No wonder he is bankrupted as fooled half the country delivering that low product on Gorina 20euros/meter at 2500 e. He said he beats Savile or Naples as well. An applause for his ignorance.

Also is unable to do a jacket without literally 10 cms. Shoulder padding that is the trick to fit easily everybody. I have seen his attemps to do a unstructured ones and were laughlable and i am being serious, sadly have not hete the pics with me. He even sold them at full price instead of having the honour to say, i am unable of doing it, sorry. The victim was a well know person of mine who was hooked by the fact of being the tailor of the King, not a good tailor instead. Maybe he has a web where you can see his creations. On Facebook he was and was horrid. Deserves to be watched. Ugly vest and poor cuts even on the Manekin.

Look him under the name Herbon and cia.

On another interview he invents the story of random vip person giving him measures and then it was a gift for Reagan who was pleased. Listen, if he is unable to fit in person after several fits, imagine to a perfectionist as Reagan with perhaps wrong measures and without any fit. No way this story was for real! Just using again celebrity names to hook people. Oh i go to the Reagan's and the Kings tailor do you know? Wow you are true elegant then... sic.

You all know i disslike Rubinacci but the dignity of this Larrainzar is so low to say who are their celebrity clients in order to attract low knowledge ones or to show on camera patterns of the King of Spain ( I wonder where his corpse would be if done this with any Saudi King patterns instead) and to invite Rubinacci to Madrid on a well know shill blog meeting, to then lie saying his low product beats Rubinacci after they inspected it. That is the most dishonourable thing to invite any to dishonour and bash him to hype themselves around and even is fake they do better than Rubinacci or any medium Neapolitan.

For the economic good tailors are plenty of good unknow ones on the center.

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Thanks a lot for your reply. I actually hate Larrainzar, but Calvo de Mora does a nice work in my opinion (some people around the place I work at wear suits made by him, and they look good). Still overly expensive though, and I'm still learning so it might happen not to be as good as I think.

If there are plenty of good tailors on the center (where I work at) I should go looking for them... don't know where to start, though. There's a place called "Sastrería el 91" which seems to be decent and actually know how to flatter the customer, as well as listen to his wishes. Don't know what prices they're moving at.

Are you living in Madrid now? (no need to answer in the thread, there's the PM system)

Regards