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Lawless Denim & Co (Phoenix, Arizona) - Page 20

post #286 of 434

I also received the confirmation email. I assumed it was because I posted negatively here and someone saw it lol

post #287 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by H Markopolos View Post
 

...

 

I will leave you with a striking statement (in my opinion) made on the selvedgestyle.com board with respect to a comparison of Gustin vs Lawless Denim. I think it was made by one of the "regulars" who goes by the name of Whiz-Dumb and held that Gustin were just profit mongers (paraphrasing) with no other allegiance, whereas Mr. Lawless was "principled." I was left dazed and confused how anyone could come to this conclusion, but the statement seemed to have popular appeal over there!!


hrm? That is most certainly not the popular opinion over there.

post #288 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam H View Post
 

I also received the confirmation email. I assumed it was because I posted negatively here and someone saw it lol

Well they seem to have changed to ldandco now and the website is down. After that I checked my email and I too have an order confirmation email and I've just been silently watching this whole thing unfold. It might just be damage control but who knows.

post #289 of 434

When an email I sent LD bounced back last week, I called and spoke w/ a customer relations person who said they'd recently redone their computer systems to handle increased volume, so it makes sense that that's the source of the recent emails.  (I got one too.) She also Roman said all outstanding orders would be out in a month or so, although, that's what she said about two months ago...  

 

I'm still hopeful, but it's getting increasingly difficult to be so.  I asked the question that's been asked here re. why they continue to advertise jeans at discounted prices when outstanding orders are long delayed, and she said it was part of Roman's committment to selling high quality jeans at prices ordinary people could afford.  It reminded me of the old adage: High quality, low price, short wait -- pick two. 

 

Part of why I still have hope is a similar experience w/ Ambrosi pants.  In that case, SA kept saying "two weeks."  Eventually, I got them, but it was several months.  We'll see how LD does.  I do want them to succeed.

post #290 of 434

wtf? they reopened their website again and my login doesn't work anymore. I requested a refund from my credit card company. Fucked up company.

post #291 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by H Markopolos View Post
 

The Lawless Denim & Co (aka, ldandco, LD&CO, LD, Lawless Denim, ra-denim.com, etc, etc) situation just keeps spiraling out of control by the day!  

 

Several weeks ago they changed their phone number, today they changed their email address. 

 

The YELP reviews keep getting more desperate. 

 

Kickstarter orders are still not fulfilled along with thousands of old and new website orders!

 

The Better Business Bureau has a red alert posted for them and removed their F rating and now will not even give them a rating.

 

They are closing their Arizona shops (one of which was supposedly set up less than 2 months ago.) and supposedly moving to California (where they can't be sued for Arizona miscalculations?). 

 

But it is all not bad.  The good old boys on selvedgestyle.com invited their good buddy James Roman Acevedo (aka, Mr. Lawless) to join them for a "pat on the butt marketing pitch" several days ago where Mr. Lawless dispensed some of his best BS to date.  The most interesting point he made was that $55 was arrived at after lots of "number crunching" as the lowest price point where he can make money. So the award winning sommelier and Arizona Biltmore chef  is now an award winning number crunching CPA????  I don't think so.

 

Just to put Mr. Lawless' recent accounting revelation into perspective, he has sold almost every pair of denim jeans in the last year or so at a loss!!!!  It is only a matter of time until the swirling in the drain will cease.

Not sure why you keep on referencing our forum with incorrect information. It is obvious you are on a Lawless rant as that is all you have posted about on Style Forum.

Lawless and their representatives are welcome on our forum just as are any other brand as long as it is something our members are interested in. We have had many brand representatives posting on our forum and welcome them.

 
We did not invite Roman to the forum, he came on and wanted to take questions etc. Many of out members have ordered from them so it makes sense for us to get information first hand. Why wouldn't we?

 

The majority of our members who have ordered from Lawless have received product. It is obvious they have had backlog issues with some orders not being delivered for over 6 months and customers waiting for refunds etc.  On the other hand there are members getting orders in every week and most are happy with the product. We can just try to be a place like Style Forum, for information to be exchanged and be a value for our members. We want to keep drama to a minimum though.  
 


Edited by winterland - 6/14/15 at 9:58pm
post #292 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by winterland View Post
 

Not sure why you keep on referencing our forum with incorrect information. It is obvious you are on a Lawless rant as that is all you have posted about on Style Forum.

Lawless and their representatives are welcome on our forum just as are any other brand as long as it is something our members are interested in. We have had many brand representatives posting on our forum and welcome them.

 
We did not invite Roman to the forum, he came on and wanted to take questions etc. Many of out members have ordered from them so it makes sense for us to get information first hand. Why wouldn't we?

 

The majority of our members who have ordered from Lawless have received product. It is obvious they have had backlog issues with some orders not being delivered for over 6 months and customers waiting for refunds etc.  On the other hand there are members getting orders in every week and most are happy with the product. We can just try to be a place like Style Forum, for information to be exchanged and be a value for our members. We want to keep drama to a minimum though.  
www.selvedgestyle.com   


I will let the reader judge if I am guilty of providing incorrect information concerning the Lawless thread on YOUR forum. Your unfailing support of Mr. Lawless in the face of demonstrable evidence that contradicts your assertions at every turn gives new meaning to the phrase "useful idiot." To say that "The majority of our members who have ordered from Lawless have received product" is simply stunning in its lack of truthfulness! One needs to look no further than the Lawless Kickstarter page, Yelp and BBB reviews, as well as this thread to KNOW that you are either delusional or have some other ulterior motive to make such a baseless statement. 

 

In fact, you might want to review your own Lawless Denim thread on YOUR selvedgestyle.com forum under the sub-thread "Order Update Thread" to educate yourself with what others feel and have experienced with regard to Lawless Denim. I suggest you start on page 79 (out of 109) of that thread where your own co-moderator (owner) stated the following: "30,000 thousand posts on this forum, 20,000 of them bitching about LD." (and that was 30 pages ago!!!).

post #293 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by H Markopolos View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by winterland View Post
 

Not sure why you keep on referencing our forum with incorrect information. It is obvious you are on a Lawless rant as that is all you have posted about on Style Forum.

Lawless and their representatives are welcome on our forum just as are any other brand as long as it is something our members are interested in. We have had many brand representatives posting on our forum and welcome them.

 
We did not invite Roman to the forum, he came on and wanted to take questions etc. Many of out members have ordered from them so it makes sense for us to get information first hand. Why wouldn't we?

 

The majority of our members who have ordered from Lawless have received product. It is obvious they have had backlog issues with some orders not being delivered for over 6 months and customers waiting for refunds etc.  On the other hand there are members getting orders in every week and most are happy with the product. We can just try to be a place like Style Forum, for information to be exchanged and be a value for our members. We want to keep drama to a minimum though.  
www.selvedgestyle.com   


I will let the reader judge if I am guilty of providing incorrect information concerning the Lawless thread on YOUR forum. Your unfailing support of Mr. Lawless in the face of demonstrable evidence that contradicts your assertions at every turn gives new meaning to the phrase "useful idiot." To say that "The majority of our members who have ordered from Lawless have received product" is simply stunning in its lack of truthfulness! One needs to look no further than the Lawless Kickstarter page, Yelp and BBB reviews, as well as this thread to KNOW that you are either delusional or have some other ulterior motive to make such a baseless statement. 

 

In fact, you might want to review your own Lawless Denim thread on YOUR selvedgestyle.com forum under the sub-thread "Order Update Thread" to educate yourself with what others feel and have experienced with regard to Lawless Denim. I suggest you start on page 79 (out of 109) of that thread where your own co-moderator (owner) stated the following: "30,000 thousand posts on this forum, 20,000 of them bitching about LD." (and that was 30 pages ago!!!).

We neither support or are against Lawless.
I have seen the Yelp BBB reviews etc. Yes there is much complaining about Lawless on our forum including from myself.
That has nothing to do with the fact that of our members who have ordered, the majority, as I have stated, have received product.
If you read through the threads it is fairly easy to deduct that.

Over zealous promoters and haters of brands makes it harder for people looking for facts to desipher information.
post #294 of 434

Lawless is fucking goat shit how the hell is this even up for debate.

post #295 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by 00Schneider View Post
 

wtf? they reopened their website again and my login doesn't work anymore. I requested a refund from my credit card company. Fucked up company.

Same

 

@winterland it seems like you want to enforce neutrality on the issue but a lot of people don't buy into Kickstarter nonsense or dogmatic brand loyalty and simply ordered (and paid for) clothing that they haven't received in a timely fashion. That is fraudulent, on the part of Lawless. Anyone looking for a legitimate take on the brand should be beaten over the head with the reality that the clothing will not ship in the normal amount of time one would expect denim products to ship in. Furthermore, the acknowledgement of this by the company is untruthful as well; they acknowledge longer production times that still do not reflect reality but conveniently push the envelope on credit card purchase protection windows. People who have waited 4 weeks when they know it might be 6 weeks might have already decided they want to cancel, but fall into the trap of the sunk cost or the gambler's fallacy (I've already spent all this time/it's been 4 weeks it hasn't shipped it will definitely be shipping in the next 2).

 

This is absolutely what new potential customers should be hearing and the idea that it is polluting discourse is utterly biased in favor of Lawless and rooted in the fallacy of balance. Whether people receive their goods or not *eventually*, and whether the money spent was a hardship or simply the cost of entry to perplexing sideshow of mismanagement, the majority (if not all) of the customers were defrauded to a degree and so when someone goes to Google trying to figure out if it's worth buying jeans from company X, they certainly deserve to know the answer to the most pressing issue for 99% of people buying jeans: are they actually going to arrive in a timely fashion.


Edited by Sam H - 6/14/15 at 3:19pm
post #296 of 434
8 months in and no denim for me. Personally, I think the shittiest part of LD is actually deleting comments in their IG -- it reveals the heart of the business and its leadership.

Actions don't lie in business: RA runs him company in a way that effectively operates off the abuse his customers and his employees are willing to take. He takes what he needs with false promises and then, for all intents and purposes, drops you or feeds you lines ... you are not a priority. Only your money or what you can give (ideas, time, etc.). Hence the refusal to give refunds (bogus stories about 'processing'); overambitious promises about factories, capability and deadlines; elimination of criticism from the IG feed, shutting down the affiliate thread here, the 1 month opening and closing of the Tucson plant (one feels for the workers), continually phony efforts at sounding upbeat and productive in the face of all this frustration (see IG) ... the list goes on. It's the behavior of someone who is effectively a sociopath. I don't mean that in any exaggerated sense or to mean LD is 'evil'. I mean that LD's actions are unfeeling and not considered -- to the point of being abusive.

The product, if you can get it, is great for the price. What you don't count however is the wait and the frustration and uncertainty. Many here will never get what they ordered because LD didn't keep records of fabric, and effectively misled the customers regarding how much or what they had. The pattern keeps repeating itself: deals, which are great financially, followed by incredible waits or product switches or simply product not appearing.

The last time I tried to contact LD I was 'on hold' on chat for 30 mins. Then on the phone for 45. I learned nothing, only the same lines I'd been fed for 7 months: 45 days and you'll have your denim. Then I got an email that said: We're out of the denim you ordered. This is 3 months after I was told the fabric was cut.

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post #297 of 434
I got the "out of fabric" email too, and now they're trying really hard to get me to take store credit so I can buy an RTW pair from the collection that is "2-3 weeks" out.

Ugh, at least just send me a pair of jeans to fulfill the order I placed even if it's RTW and a different fabric, rather than trying to clear my order out with some store credit. What is store credit even worth with the fluctuating prices and status of their operations?
post #298 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by prozach1576 View Post

I got the "out of fabric" email too, and now they're trying really hard to get me to take store credit so I can buy an RTW pair from the collection that is "2-3 weeks" out.

Ugh, at least just send me a pair of jeans to fulfill the order I placed even if it's RTW and a different fabric, rather than trying to clear my order out with some store credit. What is store credit even worth with the fluctuating prices and status of their operations?

I would tell them to give you a store credit to cover the full cost of the jeans you want.  So if u paid $35 but they now cost $98, u should get a $98 or atleast a discount code to bring the price down to your needs.  

post #299 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by aschup View Post
 

You guys should take a lesson from the TOJ saga and file chargebacks immediately.

 

Just going to quote myself and remind you that CCs will go to bat for you but not if you sit on your hands for 9 months hoping product will magically show up like a sucker.

post #300 of 434
The best thing I did was ask my credit card company to process a refund, 5 months in.
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