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HOF: What Are You Wearing Right Now - Part IV (starting May 2014) - Page 2587

post #38791 of 44981
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claghorn View Post

Why are there European (continental) and Asian iGent i-cons but there are none really from the Anglophone countries? I guess Simon Crompton, but he isn't really in the business in the same way as the Armoury, Liverano, B&T type guys are. And the closest America has is Beckett & Rob.

Are Americans too fat and British too stuffy to have the requisite steez? (and what of Oceania and Canada?)

This forum is VERY Anglo oriented, in the sense of taste that is regarded positively.
And, for the purposes of classic menswear style, and all other purposes IMHO, Canada is another Anglo region.
post #38792 of 44981

Off to worship - the God I don't know if exist. 

 

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

post #38793 of 44981
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claghorn View Post

American in America.

Though I lived in South Korea for several years, been back Stateside for a while. So who is the American Mark Cho or Alan See or Luca or Chad Park or Ethan or Takahiro Osaki? I don't know how well known the Shibumi guys are outside of this forum and the German forum, but I often see them on tumblrs and IG accounts from people around the world. I just can't think of an American equivalent, though I see the Beckett & Robb guys reblogged regularly

Same with bloggers. Mostly European.

The most popular American blog I can think of, PTO, has no single personality (to its credit, maybe). Certainly no iGent icon.

---

Please note, I am not suggesting Anglophone countries dress poorly, though I suppose an argument could be made for America. Don't know I'd buy that.

Just that there are relatively few American iGent icons given out wealth, population, and level of technology. None of the people I can think if with significant cross-national appeals and followings are American.

Those are just your style icons, not mine. I think Liverano makes great garments, but those guys do nothing for me and many others. And the BNTailor imitation strikes me as charmless and boring even if technically serviceable. Here is what I see living in NY: there are a lot of well-dressed people out there who aren't posting on bulletin boards and aren't reading blogs. And they don't sell clothes. They aren't playing dress up and they aren't wearing what they wear to get thumbs up from their buddies on Styleforum. They do however work in jobs where appearance matters and so they dress in certain ways for certain circumstances. And they look great. They've never heard of any of the people that you mention. They just took hints from others senior to them in the same circumstance. Again - your just extrapolating from your own experience. Anyone wearing a Neapolitan suit with spalla camicia looks out of place on Wall Street or in any other business capital outside of Italy. So from my perspective of someone who dresses in a certain way because the context demands it and not just for kicks, anyone in a garment like that isn't a style icon. Those are guys on the internet trying to sell the latest fad.
post #38794 of 44981
Thread Starter 
Not necessarily my icons, just those who I see most often in blogs/tumblrs/grams and other online mediums run by people from all over the world.

The people who you see in real life are totally irrelevant to this discussion. From the outset, I was wondering about (and specified) iGents. People with online presences focused on tailored clothing. That's all this discussion has been about. Why there are few, if any, Anglophone (but amended to American and maybe Canadian) iGents with significant presence.
post #38795 of 44981
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claghorn View Post

Not necessarily my icons, just those who I see most often in blogs/tumblrs/grams and other online mediums run by people from all over the world.

The people who you see in real life are totally irrelevant to this discussion. From the outset, I was wondering about (and specified) iGents. People with online presences focused on tailored clothing. That's all this discussion has been about. Why there are few, if any, Anglophone (but really, American) iGents with significant presence.

You seemed to question whether Americans were too fat and lazy to have the requisite style to be style icons. That is what I was responding to. And how does someone with as many posts as you miss the ejaculatory celebration everytime Vox says "tini time", or Mafoofan bashes someone's pocket square, or spoopoker puts on a thrifted kiton jacket? I could go on and on but if you can't see that your premise is nonsense then you're just being stubborn and I'm never going to be able to convince you.
post #38796 of 44981

The only iGents I know are the folks who post in WAYWRN.

:-)

post #38797 of 44981
Thread Starter 
Yeah, but none of us are iconic :-)
post #38798 of 44981
Quote:
Originally Posted by agjiffy View Post


Those are just your style icons, not mine. I think Liverano makes great garments, but those guys do nothing for me and many others. And the BNTailor imitation strikes me as charmless and boring even if technically serviceable. Here is what I see living in NY: there are a lot of well-dressed people out there who aren't posting on bulletin boards and aren't reading blogs. And they don't sell clothes. They aren't playing dress up and they aren't wearing what they wear to get thumbs up from their buddies on Styleforum. They do however work in jobs where appearance matters and so they dress in certain ways for certain circumstances. And they look great. They've never heard of any of the people that you mention. They just took hints from others senior to them in the same circumstance. Again - your just extrapolating from your own experience. Anyone wearing a Neapolitan suit with spalla camicia looks out of place on Wall Street or in any other business capital outside of Italy. So from my perspective of someone who dresses in a certain way because the context demands it and not just for kicks, anyone in a garment like that isn't a style icon. Those are guys on the internet trying to sell the latest fad.

 

I actually you think you are extrapolating from your own experience. In my experience a Neapolitan style suit, perhaps excluding the most fashion forward ones, would work perfectly well in almost all business capitals in the world apart from the US. And do you really see a lot of well dressed people on Wall Street? I dont live in NY but I am there on a fairly regular basis and most business people there are dressed in whatever luxury brand they can find at an airport. I have never seen so many Zegna suits in my life as I do in NY. Nothing wrong with that, but whenever I see great dressed people in NY its usually not business people.


Edited by DiplomaticTies - 6/11/16 at 2:29pm
post #38799 of 44981
never seen spalla camicia on a business suit in London or NY. Where else matters?
post #38800 of 44981
Quote:
Originally Posted by agjiffy View Post

never seen spalla camicia on a business suit in London or NY. Where else matters?

 

Well, I have certainly seen it in London. And Hong Kong, Tokyo, Shanghai, Singapore. You know, the business centers that already are or soon will be bigger than London or NY...

 

Not saying that those places are crawling with neapolitan style suits, but you can certainly find them and I don't think people will regard them as out of place.

post #38801 of 44981
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by agjiffy View Post


You seemed to question whether Americans were too fat and lazy to have the requisite style to be style icons. That is what I was responding to. And how does someone with as many posts as you miss the ejaculatory celebration everytime Vox says "tini time", or Mafoofan bashes someone's pocket square, or spoopoker puts on a thrifted kiton jacket? I could go on and on but if you can't see that your premise is nonsense then you're just being stubborn and I'm never going to be able to convince you.


The comments that Americans are too fat and the British are too stuffy were tongue and cheek, but clearly rubbed you the wrong way (understandable if for some reason you thought I wasn't American and didn't notice that I live in one of the most overweight states in the United States).

 

You also assume that I say "iGent icon" with some sort of positive connotation, when I mean it neutrally and gave no indication otherwise. These are people who spend time and effort building a following and gaining influence (within the #menswear culture and its affiliated offline culture). Whether or not they have influence in those outside that subculture is a different discussion (and I'd argue they have very little, in part for reasons you've mentioned).

 

Foo doesn't have an active blog any more, and I don't think he has an instagram or a tumblr. Vox has far less than 10k followers on Instagram (and again, that isn't a bad or a good thing...it doesn't speak to his style or the quality of his clothes) and has a Tumblr dedicated to old (and awesome) pictures and Americana. Neither Foo nor Vox are particularly active on SF anymore, and like I said in my first reply to you, SF is a very small part of #menswear. Again, not a bad or a good thing. I happen to think SF is one of the better part of the #menswear universe.

 

I don't know what premise you are imagining. That iGents have (or don't) any meaningful influence outside the #menswear universe isn't anything I am assuming. As far as I can tell, the only thing we actually disagree on is that you think that Foo and Vox are iGents with significant influence in the #menswear universe and I don't (though they certainly have a lasting one on SF). And I doubt that either of them desires that wider influence.

post #38802 of 44981
I of course have no idea what type of business you are in but I have a pretty good view of of what's going on in the places I'm mentioning and I'm just telling you what I'm seeing. Are you seeing people in the street in spalla camicia and asking them what they do for a living? Are you in the meetings? Or are you just kind of guessing? I'm having a hard time understand how your experience is so different than mine, particularly in New York but in all the major world financial centers.
post #38803 of 44981
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by agjiffy View Post

I of course have no idea what type of business you are in but I have a pretty good view of of what's going on in the places I'm mentioning and I'm just telling you what I'm seeing. Are you seeing people in the street in spalla camicia and asking them what they do for a living? Are you in the meetings? Or are you just kind of guessing? I'm having a hard time understand how your experience is so different than mine, particularly in New York but in all the major world financial centers.


I think your argument (and I hold that it's unrelated to my question) is that iGentry has little influence on the world outside of #menswear, right?

 

If so, I do not disagree with this.

 

The only people I ever saw in suits with spalla camicia in Seoul were those who were clearly hobbyists.

post #38804 of 44981
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claghorn View Post


I think your argument (and I hold that it's unrelated to my question) is that iGentry has little influence on the world outside of #menswear, right?

If so, I do not disagree with this.

The only people I ever saw in suits with spalla camicia in Seoul were those who were clearly hobbyists.

Sorry - I was responding to Diplomatic Ties in that post and our posts crossed. But to answer your question, kind of. I think what I would say is that outside the world of igentry there are impeccably dressed people who are dressed that way for different reasons than your typical igent and wouldn't consider your typical igent to be much of a style icon.

I suppose my argument would be best summarized like this in styleforum terms. Let's posthulate that you can get an amazing suit from any one of 15 different tailors on savile row (debatable - but not crazy) who are never mentioned here or in the blogosphere and who appear have fewer than 3 customers each on this board and the internet in general. Where are all the customers of those places? Who buys enough suits so that huntsman, kilgour, a&s, Poole, dege, etc can make four trips a year to multiple US cities? It isn't the Igents, right, because if it were then they would be blogging about it and posting it. Igent and well-dressed are not the same.
post #38805 of 44981
Quote:
Originally Posted by agjiffy View Post


Those are just your style icons, not mine. I think Liverano makes great garments, but those guys do nothing for me and many others. And the BNTailor imitation strikes me as charmless and boring even if technically serviceable. Here is what I see living in NY: there are a lot of well-dressed people out there who aren't posting on bulletin boards and aren't reading blogs. And they don't sell clothes. They aren't playing dress up and they aren't wearing what they wear to get thumbs up from their buddies on Styleforum. They do however work in jobs where appearance matters and so they dress in certain ways for certain circumstances. And they look great. They've never heard of any of the people that you mention. They just took hints from others senior to them in the same circumstance. Again - your just extrapolating from your own experience. Anyone wearing a Neapolitan suit with spalla camicia looks out of place on Wall Street or in any other business capital outside of Italy. So from my perspective of someone who dresses in a certain way because the context demands it and not just for kicks, anyone in a garment like that isn't a style icon. Those are guys on the internet trying to sell the latest fad.

3/4 pages of this, with no Suit and Tie, please, can we move on, you guyz just go on and on and on...

Spot on: They aren't playing dress up and they aren't wearing what they wear to get thumbs up from their buddies on Styleforum. 

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