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Custom Suiting Toronto - Page 23

post #331 of 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by spiermackay View Post

Who are the shops in Toronto that are true bespoke? The only ones I'm aware of are Trend and Ferrigamo?

Raj Singh also does true bespoke (custom pattern; cut and sown by him in North York; multiple fittings, including basted fittings). Bespoke is actually his emphasis; but he also does mtm.

My last suit that he made for me (in grey Scabal fabric) is close to his bespoke level. I had a basted fitting. There is a lot of handwork. Overall, I'm very happy with it. And I'm still very happy with the first suit he made for me (the three piece in the wool/mohair I posted earlier in this thread).

I can show you the most recent comission the next time I come into your shop to get measured. He listened to me when I said I wanted a more traditional suit (less fitted; more drape;longer jacket; wider lapels).

The only downside is that his shoulders can get quite padded and structured. I think he executes that look well; but if you want Italian shoulders go elsewhere. Even asking him to use very little padding, his shoulders are by far the most padded shoulders in my regular rotation. It makes for a very business-ey suit; but that works for my profession. I spend a lot of time in court and in client meetings.

The blue jacket I posted earlier in this thread still isn't quite right (I was wearing it the last time I saw you), but it is OK. I'm happy enough with the two other suits that I'm willing to overlook the blue suit incident. Come bonus season, I'm going to stop nickel and diming him and commission a fully bespoke suit from him.
post #332 of 361
Also, I should mention that Raj made significant alterations to my first suit when I gained roughly 20 lbs. For the pants, he let out the waist, seat, hips and crotch. There was enough allowance in the seams to do all of that.
post #333 of 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by SamAdams59 View Post

I'm a little confused as to why you're convinced that Garrison's (bespoke) suits are made in China. I've had fairly substantial conversations with the staff and the owner as to what I was buying when I bought their product, and I have been assured that my suits are being manufactured right here in Toronto (not tailored after the fact, but manufactured). I understand that there are many MTM outfits around our city who are manufacturing in China (because it's inexpensive), and nothing against those businesses, but I have no reason to believe that I have been lied to.

Do you have some sort of evidence for this claim? If so I'm sure myself and others who have paid a premium for our Garrison suits would appreciate you sharing. Sorry, not trying to be confrontational, but if I've been directly told something by the owner of a business and someone has proof that it isn't true then I think as a consumer I have the right to know.

Sorry for the confusion. I would not try to convince anyone about the origin of their suits and I don't want to say bad about any business, I am just trying to explain, according to my knowledge and experience, as how to evaluate the process of making a suit. Different tailors may have a different approach.

As we all know, caveat emptor / let the buyer beware, I am trying to raise buyer's awareness. Suppliers/ sellers are supposed to disclose all information at buyer's request. If sellers misrepresented that would be another story ...All garments are supposed to have content's tag, country of origin tag (by law? I am not sure about this) so you can simply look for those tags inside your garments.
post #334 of 361
I've spoken with the owner of garrison and he's always worried about the shortage master tailors the the city. He says it's difficult to expand under such circumstances. This is more than enough to assure me they're made here.
post #335 of 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by akoustas View Post

I've spoken with the owner of garrison and he's always worried about the shortage master tailors the the city. He says it's difficult to expand under such circumstances. This is more than enough to assure me they're made here.

That is true. I heard that all master tailors in Canada now is in their 70-75 years old and there is a real shortage. The tailoring trade is a dying trade now at least in Canada.
post #336 of 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdrizzy View Post

I've heard some conflicting stories with sox from a few friends of mine (have bought suits from him before). Had to go back a few times to get fixed up.

They have changed systems lately, and there have been a few issues in terms of getting styling correct and fit. I'm not hating on sox, just what I've heard from personal experience. I've kept this fairly vague to protect the identity of the friend,.

His VBC starting around $1500 from what I remember.
This is 2016. A bespoke suit with basted fitting only cost $1500 CAD? It's even hard to break even the labor cost.
post #337 of 361
There are many ways to make a bespoke jacket/suit
You can do everything by hand: pad chest canvas, collar, make all pockets and barchetta ( welt) by hand, top stitch by hand, buttonholes by hand.... Doing this way I think it will take at least 20-25 hours or more.
Or you can choose to make pockets by machine, buy already make canvas, machine button holes and top stitch .... This will reduce time and cost considerably.
So for $1500 CAD, say $400-500 for cloths, lining, buttons ... and $1000 for labor and markup ... I think doable !smile.gif
post #338 of 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinston View Post

There are many ways to make a bespoke jacket/suit
You can do everything by hand: pad chest canvas, collar, make all pockets and barchetta ( welt) by hand, top stitch by hand, buttonholes by hand.... Doing this way I think it will take at least 20-25 hours or more.
Or you can choose to make pockets by machine, buy already make canvas, machine button holes and top stitch .... This will reduce time and cost considerably.
So for $1500 CAD, say $400-500 for cloths, lining, buttons ... and $1000 for labor and markup ... I think doable !smile.gif
Thanks, so I can talk to the tailor about which part I want do by hand and add to the price accordingly right? Which part will be considerably different if finished by hand? I read a thread and I know button holes and shoulder pads will be much better finished by hand
post #339 of 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudLi View Post

Thanks, so I can talk to the tailor about which part I want do by hand and add to the price accordingly right? Which part will be considerably different if finished by hand? I read a thread and I know button holes and shoulder pads will be much better finished by hand

Sure, if your tailor is willing to do that it would be great. To me, definitely shoulder pads and sleeves head have to set in by hand. That would make the jacket a lot softer around armhole and you will feel a lot more comfortable wearing it. Also, I would get a chest welt pocket made by hand, by making it by hand you will have a barchetta look along with handmade buttons holes and especially Milanese lapel hole. Your jacket will look and feel like a $5000 jacket biggrin.gif Providing your tailor could accomplish this.
post #340 of 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudLi View Post

Thanks, so I can talk to the tailor about which part I want do by hand and add to the price accordingly right? Which part will be considerably different if finished by hand? I read a thread and I know button holes and shoulder pads will be much better finished by hand

This sounds like a terrible idea.
post #341 of 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRINI View Post


This sounds like a terrible idea.


Totally agree. First, many (most) tailors who take pride in their training and skills will resent your telling them how to make your jacket at a technical level. Asking for handmade buttonholes is one thing but specifying which parts of the jacket should be hand-finished and which should be machine-finished is completely another thing. It's not like deciding which options you want on a new car. If you are not careful and do not already have a good relationship with a tailor, don't be surprised if they refuse to work with you on those terms (or at all). Second, you may be asking for things that your tailor may be less familiar with, which often results in a worse outcome. It's like asking a heart surgeon who has a lot of experience performing a valve replacement a certain way to do it a different way because you read on the internet that it's a better technique. 

 

Just some unsolicited advice: in reading your various posts/questions you come across as someone who is overly fixated on 'value' in tailored clothing. Nothing wrong with wanting value, but of course value in clothing is inherently highly subjective and there are limits to how far you will be able to push this. It's as if you are trying to price the value of a step in jacket construction the same way you do a financial instrument (since you are in banking). You want a custom suit but you are again overly fixated on the value proposition--some parts you want hand finished, others you don't. It'll be very hard to find a skilled tailor who takes pride in their work who will willingly work a la carte. 


Edited by breakaway01 - 10/20/16 at 1:07pm
post #342 of 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by breakaway01 View Post


Totally agree. First, many (most) tailors who take pride in their training and skills will resent your telling them how to make your jacket at a technical level. Asking for handmade buttonholes is one thing but specifying which parts of the jacket should be hand-finished and which should be machine-finished is completely another thing. It's not like deciding which options you want on a new car. If you are not careful and do not already have a good relationship with a tailor, don't be surprised if they refuse to work with you on those terms (or at all). Second, you may be asking for things that your tailor may be less familiar with, which often results in a worse outcome. It's like asking a heart surgeon who has a lot of experience performing a valve replacement a certain way to do it a different way because you read on the internet that it's a better technique. 

Just some unsolicited advice: in reading your various posts/questions you come across as someone who is overly fixated on 'value' in tailored clothing. Nothing wrong with wanting value, but of course value in clothing is inherently highly subjective and there are limits to how far you will be able to push this. It's as if you are trying to price the value of a step in jacket construction the same way you do a financial instrument (since you are in banking). You want a custom suit but you are again overly fixated on the value proposition--some parts you want hand finished, others you don't. It'll be very hard to find a skilled tailor who takes pride in their work who will willingly work a la carte. 
Interesting. So I should not ask whether the tailor set shoulder pad by hand or machine? I don't think a cheap bespoke will be 100% handmade. Just like some cheap suits are made in China and consumers have the right to know where it's made. What's the difference between asking the construction method and location it's made? The tailor is obviously more knowledgeable than I am, but I should be able to decide how much hand work I want with my suits right? Some tailors offer different levels of mtm and bespoke then charge different price for that, some only do bespoke and only difference is fabric. So I should treat tailors accordingly like choose which level I want with the former and let bespoke only tailor do their work without question?
Edited by CloudLi - 10/20/16 at 2:13pm
post #343 of 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudLi View Post


Interesting. So I should not ask whether the tailor set shoulder pad by hand or machine? I don't think a cheap bespoke will be 100% handmade. Just like some cheap suits are made in China and consumers have the right to know where it's made. What's the difference between asking the construction method and location it's made? The tailor is obviously more knowledgeable than I am, but I should be able to decide how much hand work I want with my suits right? Some tailors offer different levels of mtm and bespoke then charge different price for that, some only do bespoke and only difference is fabric. So I should treat tailors accordingly like choose which level I want with the former and let bespoke only tailor do their work without question?


It's not that you shouldn't ask how the jacket is made and where it's made. That's entirely fine. What you might find difficult is stipulating exactly how different parts of the jacket and trousers should be constructed. My advice is just to be careful about not coming across as wanting to micromanage how your tailor makes your clothing, or else you might find that they don't want your business.

post #344 of 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRINI View Post

This sounds like a terrible idea.

Somethings matter more than others. A good fit matters. Some hand sewing doesn't matter, it maybe luxury, depending on how well it is done. How many tailors handsew pockets? Or, maybe the question is, how much is handsewn, and, where? Handsewn button holes are better, if soft. That means the purls are pulled just tight enough to lock. Tighter is decreasing value. Some tailors add according to pay, or the other way around, depending on where the conversation starts. It also depends on the skills of the tailor how much they can add or subtract. Does each lapel need a thousand pad stitches? Maybe 100 is plenty. That should cut some time, like 90% for that part! Some tailors say you need the whole nine yards. Another tailor looks at that and says, "then my work is 12 yards". If four yards of work is fine, then more is extra luxury. Bottom of sleeves is all by hand, or, very little machine. Shorter time if fake button holes on sleeves. If you never use the outside hip pockets on the coat a couple of flaps is fine. Ask what he can do. You will have two fittings where he can explain a bit. What's important is that the cloth falls pleasantly from the shoulder, collar is close to the neck, the sleeves are useful, and the lapels hang nicely from the collar. A canvas in the chest to support the coat cloth and hide unwanted bumps, or whatever. So, the canvas is the foundation to keep the front looking splendid.

Edit, this is only for bench made, and only what each tailor is capable of. Some ways of making there are no choices.
post #345 of 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by breakaway01 View Post


It's not that you shouldn't ask how the jacket is made and where it's made. That's entirely fine. What you might find difficult is stipulating exactly how different parts of the jacket and trousers should be constructed. My advice is just to be careful about not coming across as wanting to micromanage how your tailor makes your clothing, or else you might find that they don't want your business.
I agree. I hate other people question my proficiency. And a trusted relationship with tailor should be essential to make a bespoke garment. But there should be a fine line between suggestions and expressing needs rather than manage every details. I should be able to ask whether the tailor set shoulder by hand, if not, is he capable of doing that for a higher price points.
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