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Do you wear a pocket square? - Page 7

post #91 of 140

Regardless of whether I'm wearing a suit or sports jacket, tie or no tie/ unbuttoned collar, I always wear a pocket square.

(FWIW, I wear more odd jackets and slacks than suits because I like to mix it up a little and throw in some extra colours or patterns)

In the rare event that I might forget to wear one, I feel like something is missing. As if I left home with only one sock on^^

 

Getting into pocket squares may take some time to grow confident in. The easiest (and by no means wrong) way is to go the white linen TV fold route.

But if you are trying to add some colour to your wardrobe and want to go with silk squares, you can start off by buying a few squares in colours that match your wardrobe.

Paisleys or dots are generally pretty easy to work with as long as you aren't wearing a similar tie. If you're just starting out and don't feel comfortable matching PS, suit, shirt and tie yet, you might want to consider starting to wear your pocket squares in more casual settings with just a sports jacket and shirt and no tie to worry about. Your choice.

 

As for sizes, many on SF feel that the smaller sized squares keep their shape less well and easily slide down and get lost in their pockets. I guess this depends on your jackets.

For me personally it's the exact opposite, most of my jackets have fairly small chest pockets and work better with squares up to about 32cm or 12" like the ones Kent Wang makes or most pocket squares that are commonly sold in stores here in my country.

Perhaps the small pockets are because many of my jackets are italian, I don't know. But the larger Drake's, Ralph Lauren, Rubinacci squares that measure around 42cm are too large for my pockets.

So consider that.

 

Hand rolled edges are nice to have and a sign of quality/ workmanship. It's only worth bothering with, if you feel that the rest of your wardrobe is on par with it.

No point in chasing hand rolled pocket squares if you're wearing cheap and worn out shoes IMHO.

White linen square in a TV fold being an exception because the edges will be exposed. So the edges should look nice… or it'll look like a napkin (again, my opinion)

 

A pocket squares function was also discussed in this thread at some point. In my case it's purely ornamental. I carry a neatly folded cotton hankie and perhaps one or two more paper kleenex tissues in my inner right chest pocket just in case. I wouldn't dream of handing someone my pocket square to sneeze in or doing so myself:p

 

I generally wear silk pocket squares in a simple puff and linen ones in a TV fold. Very rarely do I expose the edges or tips on silk squares. It generally seems a little 'too much' for my taste, but can work sometimes… maybe a puff and one corner.

I don't see much point in finding a million fancy ways to fold a square and try to keep it simple. Hold it, puff it, stick it in there.

 

The 'when or whether to wear a pocket square' question is probably something that you will have to decide on your own.

In my case wearing a square doesn't really affect me in any negative way. I have no OCB guidelines… but for a job interview perhaps I'd tone it down a notch and keep my outfit simpler.

If you know your work environment won't have any issues with you suddenly wearing a PS other than a few surprised remarks, then go for it.

 

Good luck.

post #92 of 140
Bravo!

PS: I don't recognise your country, but your experience 12" x 12" (30cm x 30cm) is better has consequence for my decision that or the bigger size. My jackets are all English made N&L. The smaller square a foot's length and width is made in England according to duchamp. Simon Crompton's Permanent Style and the pocket square vendor from LA here on Style Forum, however, favor the larger measurement. 😣 Budd's doesn't specify their pocket square size, but maybe cotton is better than silk, but then I need an iron. But do silk pocket squares need ironing, too?
Edited by Naive, Jr. - 1/8/14 at 4:54pm
post #93 of 140
Quote: Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Originally Posted by daDudeson View Post
 

Regardless of whether I'm wearing a suit or sports jacket, tie or no tie/ unbuttoned collar, I always wear a pocket square.

(FWIW, I wear more odd jackets and slacks than suits because I like to mix it up a little and throw in some extra colours or patterns)

In the rare event that I might forget to wear one, I feel like something is missing. As if I left home with only one sock on^^

 

Getting into pocket squares may take some time to grow confident in. The easiest (and by no means wrong) way is to go the white linen TV fold route.

But if you are trying to add some colour to your wardrobe and want to go with silk squares, you can start off by buying a few squares in colours that match your wardrobe.

Paisleys or dots are generally pretty easy to work with as long as you aren't wearing a similar tie. If you're just starting out and don't feel comfortable matching PS, suit, shirt and tie yet, you might want to consider starting to wear your pocket squares in more casual settings with just a sports jacket and shirt and no tie to worry about. Your choice.

 

As for sizes, many on SF feel that the smaller sized squares keep their shape less well and easily slide down and get lost in their pockets. I guess this depends on your jackets.

For me personally it's the exact opposite, most of my jackets have fairly small chest pockets and work better with squares up to about 32cm or 12" like the ones Kent Wang makes or most pocket squares that are commonly sold in stores here in my country.

Perhaps the small pockets are because many of my jackets are italian, I don't know. But the larger Drake's, Ralph Lauren, Rubinacci squares that measure around 42cm are too large for my pockets.

So consider that.

 

Hand rolled edges are nice to have and a sign of quality/ workmanship. It's only worth bothering with, if you feel that the rest of your wardrobe is on par with it.

No point in chasing hand rolled pocket squares if you're wearing cheap and worn out shoes IMHO.

White linen square in a TV fold being an exception because the edges will be exposed. So the edges should look nice… or it'll look like a napkin (again, my opinion)

 

A pocket squares function was also discussed in this thread at some point. In my case it's purely ornamental. I carry a neatly folded cotton hankie and perhaps one or two more paper kleenex tissues in my inner right chest pocket just in case. I wouldn't dream of handing someone my pocket square to sneeze in or doing so myself:p

 

I generally wear silk pocket squares in a simple puff and linen ones in a TV fold. Very rarely do I expose the edges or tips on silk squares. It generally seems a little 'too much' for my taste, but can work sometimes… maybe a puff and one corner.

I don't see much point in finding a million fancy ways to fold a square and try to keep it simple. Hold it, puff it, stick it in there.

 

The 'when or whether to wear a pocket square' question is probably something that you will have to decide on your own.

In my case wearing a square doesn't really affect me in any negative way. I have no OCB guidelines… but for a job interview perhaps I'd tone it down a notch and keep my outfit simpler.

If you know your work environment won't have any issues with you suddenly wearing a PS other than a few surprised remarks, then go for it.

 

Good luck.

 

GREAT post!!  more information is needed on here, and with a well mannered tone.  well done. :worship2:

post #94 of 140
The day after PinkestFlamingo posted his homage to Hardy Amies on pocket squares (Post 77), I received for the first time in my life an email from Hardy Amies announcing "The new Hardy Amies website and ABC Blog". This thread had the honor of PinkestFlamingo's first post. I have no idea how Hardy Amies got my email address - and I don't recall having been asked for it by HRM.
PS: Did Amies reveal the name of his tailor to Philby, and who was his tailor?
Edited by Naive, Jr. - 1/8/14 at 5:08am
post #95 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by size 38R View Post

GREAT post!!  more information is needed on here, and with a well mannered tone.  well done. worship2.gif

Does this adoration mean you agree 12" x 12" is ideal?
post #96 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naive, Jr. View Post

Bravo!

PS: I don't recognise your country, but your experience 12" x 12" (30cm x 30cm) is better has consequence for my decision that or the bigger size. My jackets are all English made N&L. The smaller square a foot's length and width is made in England according to duchamp. Simon Crompton's Permanent Style and the pocket square vendor from LA here on Style Forum, however, favor the larger measurement. 😣 Budd's doesn't specify their pocket square size, but maybe cotton is better than silk, but then I need an iron. But do silk pocket squares need ironing, too?

 

Silk needs ironing too when creased real bad. There's one upside to silk though, if properly ironed, you won't have to do it very often. When you puff the squares and make no deep folds or creases and store them rolled up or hanging on a clip, they won't need much ironing generally speaking.

 

When ironing a silk pocket square, do it on the lowest setting possible and try to keep it dry. Also don't iron the edges if hand rolled, there's a possibility you'll press them flat.

I find it best to lay a cotton cloth over the square, and ironing that to prevent anything bad from happening.

 

 

Regarding size:
I think this is all dependant on the pocket size, fold or puff, thickness of the suit fabric as well as the square's fabric, cut of the suit etc. etc.

It's all down to how many space there is without creating a bulge.

post #97 of 140
Dear Chopper88,

Thanks very much - you are a practical advisor and I need some time to think about this, especially because I haven't bought any pocket squares yet. I did notice your advice seems based on silk. Do you have any rating for mousseline de soie, organza, chiffon, voile within the sphere of silk, and do you have experience with cotton and linen? Good grief, am I derailing this thread, or may I qualify as following 38R: more information is needed on here?

PS: daDudeson made a comparison: napkin. Why shouldn't pocket squares look like napkins? Could a silk pocket square resemble a napkin? Napkin as cloth or napkin as form. Napkins are of cotton or linen. Napkins might be puffed? A criticism, in well mannered tone, of Isolation's roll and 38R's fold or Hardy Amies' decree?
Edited by Naive, Jr. - 1/8/14 at 6:08am
post #98 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naive, Jr. View Post

Dear Chopper88,

Thanks very much - you are a practical advisor and I need some time to think about this, especially because I haven't bought any pocket squares yet. I did notice your advice seems based on silk. Do you have any rating for mousseline de soie, organza, chiffon, voile within the sphere of silk, and do you have experience with cotton and linen? Good grief, am I derailing this thread, or may I qualify as following 38R: more information is needed on here?

PS: daDudeson made a comparison: napkin. Why shouldn't pocket squares look like napkins? Could a silk pocket square resemble a napkin? Napkin as cloth or napkin as form. Napkins are of cotton or linen. Napkins might be puffed? A criticism, in well mannered tone, of Isolation's roll and 38R's fold or Hardy Amies' decree?

 

You're welcome. My main objective was to tell you about the ironing.

 

I must admit, I also don't have that much knowledge on pocket squares, but I do love the silk ones. My advice was based on all types of squares by the way, silk, cotton or linen. This also applies for the different types of silk you mention. A thinner silk square has a different effect opposed to a thick silk one. I've read that some people dislike Hermes silk squares because they find them too thick. causing them to be bulky. Again, like daDudeson says, I also think this relates to your suit's pocket, fabric and cut (a very slim skin tight cut will bulge easier of course). Besides that, Hermes also makes mousseline pocket squares which are paper thin, I can't imagine them being bulky though I must say I don't own one as I like the vibrant thicker silk ones more. While we're on the bulky subject, I don't really like the roll, as it causes a bulge.

 

I think daDudeson means that if you use a white square with a clean fold the edges are what 'makes' the square because it's just plain and white. Without a nice edge, it might look like a folded tissue.

 

I'm actually surprised Spoo hasn't been more active in here, I've read through this entire thread:
http://www.styleforum.net/t/228536/pocket-squares-a-discussion-thread-questions-opinions-suggestions

And he's one of the pocket square maniacs together with PocketSquareGuy that sparked my interest. I'd suggest you check that thread if you haven't done yet, it's awesome! It shows the dos and don'ts when pairing a square with an outfit, how to fold/puff, and gives a great impression on the diversity of squares there are.

post #99 of 140
Dear Chopper,

Thanks very much again, I need time to read what you wrote in quiet. But you misunderstand me i.e. my relation to pocket square in your last paragraph. I am not at all in need of advice about the relationship of the pocket square to the outfit or worried about folding or puffing. As far as diversity goes, I want to support human labor, not sweatshop. Although Hermes is not known for exploitation, I exclude Hermes as too expensive. But you identified my source for this question about kinds of silks - not the advertisements for pocket squares online, which are mostly deficient in description, rather the other thread about pocket squares, where my questions strictly speaking belong, whereas here the thread initiator simply asked if one wears pocket squares or not. duDudeson expressed my feeling that without pocket square in my jacket pocket I feel something is missing, although sock is too strong. Maybe belt presuming belt loops. That's why Isolation's photograph looks better with pocket square, even rolled. Simplicity is important, but somehow pocket square is better than none, a sort of necessary differentiation. To speak of fanaticism is incorrect and unfair, correct is those who strive for consciousness about pocket squares are serious and consequent.
Edited by Naive, Jr. - 1/8/14 at 3:14pm
post #100 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naive, Jr. View Post

Dear Chopper,

Thanks very much again, I need time to read what you wrote in quiet. But you misunderstand me i.e. my relation to pocket square in your last paragraph. I am not at all in need of advice about the relationship of the pocket square to the outfit or worried about folding or puffing. As far as diversity goes, I want to support human labor, not sweatshop. Although Hermes is not known for exploitation, I exclude Hermes as too expensive.

 

No problem. And I wasn't suggesting you need any advice, I was just wondering if you had already seen the information there as it's interesting to read if you want to know more about pocket squares.

By the way, do you use some sort of translator? With diversity I meant that there are a lot of different pocket squares :) I'm not trying to offend you by commenting on your language, but I wonder how you came up with human labor and tied that to Hermes.

post #101 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naive, Jr. View Post


Does this adoration mean you agree 12" x 12" is ideal?


the squares i make are 9" x 9".    i find by larger ones bulge the pockets, upsetting the look.  but smaller ones can also look like a tissue. so try some. try to make one. and see what works for you. :fonz:

post #102 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chopper88 View Post

No problem. And I wasn't suggesting you need any advice, I was just wondering if you had already seen the information there as it's interesting to read if you want to know more about pocket squares.
By the way, do you use some sort of translator? With diversity I meant that there are a lot of different pocket squares smile.gif  I'm not trying to offend you by commenting on your language, but I wonder how you came up with human labor and tied that to Hermes.

Dear Chopper,

My formulation perhaps shouldn't have included the word "advice" in regard to how a pocket square as part relates to a whole (imagine only two pocket squares, and I cannot imagine any combination as offensive, dissonance is musical dialectic), and why get uptight about the shape of the square - can you go wrong as Aristotelian between extremes? I need and seek advice, the better the better. I don't get offended by comments on my language or language - language is my daily concern, and I wish I knew far, far more. I employ any translator who cooperates, but my favorites are Larry Horn for negation and I took Auden's recommendation to consult Barfield.

You wonder how I came up with human labor and tied that to Hermes. If you read what interviews with Hermes' leadership, they are very concerned about craftmanship. I don't have the feeling Hermes exploits people i.e., laborers, but I admit I don't know. Hermes claimed recently - sorry, I didn't save the article - most
craftmanship to make Hermes' articles is in Europe. I have not inquired into this matter because I cannot afford Hermes. I remember that Huntsman salesman who couldn't afford to wear Huntsman and perhaps as psychological compensation wore the belt with the H buckle.

Diverse literally di - vertere. Vertere is an etymological orphan abused by Callum Coats: Living Energies - Viktor Schauberger's brilliant work with natural energy explained,
in good old Mother Nature (vertebra) a kind of movement. Di+verse refers to the basic relation between identity and non-identity (A, Not-A). Genus Pocket Squares (artefacts?) are of two species: those made by exploiting human beings, and those made in a just society in which everybody can develop to help everybody.. I can't quote Amies (17 July, Schauberger 30 June), but Goethe asserts it's important to think what, but more important is consider how..
Edited by Naive, Jr. - 1/8/14 at 5:41pm
post #103 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by size 38R View Post


the squares i make are 9" x 9".    i find by larger ones bulge the pockets, upsetting the look.  but smaller ones can also look like a tissue. so try some. try to make one. and see what works for you. fing02%5B1%5D.gif

That I S a surprise! 9" x 9" !

Your enthusiasm for handwork recommends you for instructor in a school which encourages development of not just intellect. Such a talented fellow you are, Mr 38R!

But you don't explain this surprising measurement 9" x 9": how can you prevent the pocket square from vanishing down into the abyss of your jacket pocket? What's wrong with 12" x 12"? Are you just trying to save cloth and money? How do you explain the often favored 16" x 16"?

PS: Now after your revelation it's clear your visible iceberg has awesome little left concealed below the horizon of your jacket pocket upper edge! No surprise you're so modest!
Edited by Naive, Jr. - 1/9/14 at 4:07pm
post #104 of 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naive, Jr. View Post

NDear Pinkest Flamingo,
Cédric Villani wears a broach which resembles a spider.

Hasn't the Hardies Amies ERROR! Harvey Nichols has been assimilated by duchamp?

Your criticism is not evident. Pocket square in itself must be differentiated from the ugly pocket square and from ugly use of the pocket square.

Where is pocket square on a downward slope and why? in Buckingham Palace I see no indication to support you view? On Savile Row? Why does Huntsman sell pocket squares? On Jermyn Street? Why do New & Lingwood sell pocket squares? Budd still uses the expression Blow or show. Is Hardy Amies' view incoherent - You must mean here on Style Forum pocket squares are dusky, but you subscribe to diplomatic language.


The border between decoration and use is unclear and you offer no examples.
Of course, decoration can be viewed as affectation.
ERROR! DISTINCTION BETWEEN DECORATION AND ORNAMENTATION UNCLEAR!
You contradict Amies yourself in a later sentence - I'm afraid your text is too cryptic for me to decipher unless you state your own position more clearly, and I don't think it quite fair to use Amies without supplying the context. For example, does Hardy Amies assume bespoke?

Who wants to be on a downward slope as fashion victim? Mercy!

You're going to have to refine your choice of syntax and grammar before you harp on about cryptic and hard-to-decipher messages, Jr.

 

I suppose I can't be too derisive as English is very clearly your second language, so I will offer a constructive answer. By "pocket square" I meant a handkerchief folded as a simple square, a la Don Draper (perhaps I did not choose my words correctly). Read my post again with that in mind and you should grasp my point: the square fold is fast becoming the tired hallmark of people who try too hard, it just looks... too crisp.

 

What I would concede is that I am thinking about all this in the context of my own age group. I am sure those going into their thirties and older can pull off a square fold beautifully, but for those my age (early to mid-twenties) it looks far too much like you've watched a few seasons of Mad Men and want to play the big boy. Keep it relaxed but refined as demonstrated very well in Isolation's earlier picture.

post #105 of 140
E
Quote:
Originally Posted by PinkestFlamingo View Post

You're going to have to refine your choice of syntax and grammar before you harp on about cryptic and hard-to-decipher messages, Jr.

I suppose I can't be too derisive as English is very clearly your second language, so I will offer a constructive answer. By "pocket square" I meant a handkerchief folded as a simple square, a la Don Draper (perhaps I did not choose my words correctly). Read my post again with that in mind and you should grasp my point: the square fold is fast becoming the tired hallmark of people who try too hard, it just looks... too crisp.

What I would concede is that I am thinking about all this in the context of my own age group. I am sure those going into their thirties and older can pull off a square fold beautifully, but for those my age (early to mid-twenties) it looks far too much like you've watched a few seasons of Mad Men and want to play the big boy. Keep it relaxed but refined as demonstrated very well in Isolation's earlier picture.

Dear PinkestFlamingo,

Welcome back to responsibility, but television hypnosis won't cure your superficial grasp of language. If your inclination is to quote Hardy Amies, you'd be better off not merely changing channels. Isolation's example deserves a deeper comprehension.. I'm sure Hardy Amies wants you to stand on your own, and you are quite right that it would be wise to understand how age is a condition for what's ripe and what requires more time.

PS: Who drew that charming flamingo you use as avatar and why do flamingos keep a leg free, and is it always the right foot?
Edited by Naive, Jr. - 1/8/14 at 6:00pm
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