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Daily CE Musings of Piob - Page 37

post #541 of 5129
Thread Starter 
It is actually kind of interesting. In Germany plants have councils made up of workers and management. Apparently the only way this can happen in the US is with a union (this is what I've read in recent articles). That's a shame as a plant council seems like a good idea to me. I know I have something similar that I put in place at my organization.

This was a two year campaign by the UAW, they had near unfettered access to the plant and the workers, and they still could not convince a majority of workers they would benefit from being unionized.
post #542 of 5129
This is nothing new. The Union has been trying to infiltrate Honda plants since they first moved over to the US, specifically Marysville, OH---IO. When I worked there years ago, the Union unsuccessfully tried to organize and has kept at it as I understand. Now moreso, many of the guys see through it as the Union simply wanting to take money from them to support the current brethren. Now that the Unions have destroyed Detroilet, I think the push to unionize in the automobile industry will be difficult.

The key is that these plants cannot allow the American way to creep in to operating the company. The key is to make your employees believe you care about them (even if you don't) and pay them wages that they do not want to risk a Union.
post #543 of 5129
Quote:
Originally Posted by zarathustra View Post

This is nothing new. The Union has been trying to infiltrate Honda plants since they first moved over to the US, specifically Marysville, OH---IO. When I worked there years ago, the Union unsuccessfully tried to organize and has kept at it as I understand. Now moreso, many of the guys see through it as the Union simply wanting to take money from them to support the current brethren. Now that the Unions have destroyed Detroilet, I think the push to unionize in the automobile industry will be difficult.

The key is that these plants cannot allow the American way to creep in to operating the company. The key is to make your employees believe you care about them (even if you don't) and pay them wages that they do not want to risk a Union.

I almost couldn't believe the slavish devotion to the auto union from the Ohio Democratic party. The UAW is obviously waning but in some states like OH they have a lot of pull.
post #544 of 5129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piobaire View Post

It is actually kind of interesting. In Germany plants have councils made up of workers and management. Apparently the only way this can happen in the US is with a union (this is what I've read in recent articles). That's a shame as a plant council seems like a good idea to me. I know I have something similar that I put in place at my organization.

This was a two year campaign by the UAW, they had near unfettered access to the plant and the workers, and they still could not convince a majority of workers they would benefit from being unionized.

I read some Bloomberg opinion piece that explained how the councils in Deutschland work. It actually sounds like a pretty good concept.
post #545 of 5129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piobaire View Post

In a move that quite surprised me the workers at the Tenn. VW plant rejected having the UWA come in an unionize them. Not sure what to make of this.

They may just want to keep having jobs.
post #546 of 5129
Why are liberals exempted from being anti-science? The most liberal states have the highest rates of non-vaccination. It seems to me that being anti-vaccine is anti-science. I'm also going to guess if you were to compare it to states that are most anti-gmo foods, they would be similar.




http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2014/02/vaccine-exemptions-states-pertussis-map
post #547 of 5129
Causation =\= correlation?
post #548 of 5129
Quote:
Originally Posted by indesertum View Post

Causation =\= correlation?

True, but all the anti-vaccination people I've ever met are liberals. Even the Amish get vaccinated.
post #549 of 5129
Quote:
Originally Posted by brokencycle View Post

Why are liberals exempted from being anti-science? The most liberal states have the highest rates of non-vaccination. It seems to me that being anti-vaccine is anti-science. I'm also going to guess if you were to compare it to states that are most anti-gmo foods, they would be similar.

Frankly, they don't get a free pass, at least on the national level. There's a huge movement fighting against these douches from much of the rest of the liberal wing of society and the entire scientific community.

To the extent that less energy is focused on the anti-vaxxers than the anti-AGW types, I think it's a matter of degrees. The anti-vaxx people are mostly grassroots. While they've done a lot of damage (that map as evidence), they don't have that much pull at the national level. There's not a core of big money and deliberate messaging behind it, just a bunch of dumb scared parents in general. How many in Congress buy in this? Not many, and some of them are Republican.

Anti-AGW, on the other hand, is being fueled by a deliberate high-level campaign and has nearly universal acceptance among Republican leadership. It's difficult to even be a Republican and openly consider AGW. Many in the scientific community feel this movement is a serious attack on the foundation of public attitude towards science in this country, and that's dangerous.

Also, there's a right-wing anti-vaxx movement as well. Mostly religious and distrust of all things recommended by government types. That diffuses the issue from being purely liberal.
post #550 of 5129
Quote:
Table 1
Belief that Astrology i s Scientific by Party
NORC GS S 2012; weighted N =917

% Scientific wtd N

Democrat 49.1% 317
Independent 48.1% 369
Republican 36.9% 231
post #551 of 5129
I'm sure you have a point there somewhere.
post #552 of 5129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibonius View Post

Frankly, they don't get a free pass, at least on the national level. There's a huge movement fighting against these douches from much of the rest of the liberal wing of society and the entire scientific community.

To the extent that less energy is focused on the anti-vaxxers than the anti-AGW types, I think it's a matter of degrees. The anti-vaxx people are mostly grassroots. While they've done a lot of damage (that map as evidence), they don't have that much pull at the national level. There's not a core of big money and deliberate messaging behind it, just a bunch of dumb scared parents in general. How many in Congress buy in this? Not many, and some of them are Republican.

Anti-AGW, on the other hand, is being fueled by a deliberate high-level campaign and has nearly universal acceptance among Republican leadership. It's difficult to even be a Republican and openly consider AGW. Many in the scientific community feel this movement is a serious attack on the foundation of public attitude towards science in this country, and that's dangerous.

Also, there's a right-wing anti-vaxx movement as well. Mostly religious and distrust of all things recommended by government types. That diffuses the issue from being purely liberal.

The only right-wing push against vaccinations was after Governor Perry signed a law in Texas mandating HPV vaccines. I would get my children vaccinated, but I don't like the idea of the government forcing me to especially against STDs.
post #553 of 5129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibonius View Post

I'm sure you have a point there somewhere.

Your stars are not in the proper alignment to understand that post. Try again during the next transit of Mercury.

If you want an example that involves public policy, how about genetically modified food?
Quote:
Republicans divide evenly on whether genetically modified foods are safe or unsafe. Independents rate them unsafe by a 20-point margin; Democrats, by a 26-point margin.

http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=97567
post #554 of 5129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ataturk View Post

Your stars are not in the proper alignment to understand that post. Try again during the next transit of Mercury.

If you want an example that involves public policy, how about genetically modified food?
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=97567

Its a good thing we have a Constitution preventing our federal government from mandating the labels demanded by such uninformed morons...
post #555 of 5129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ataturk View Post

Your stars are not in the proper alignment to understand that post. Try again during the next transit of Mercury.

And conservatives are much more likely to support literal Creationism (which also has public policy implications). Are we going to go issue for issue and compare how idiotic the general public is about scientific issues?
Quote:
If you want an example that involves public policy, how about genetically modified food?
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=97567

Yeah, I think they're stupid for that one too.

Aren't team sports politics grand?

Quote:
Originally Posted by brokencycle View Post

Its a good thing we have a Constitution preventing our federal government from mandating the labels demanded by such uninformed morons...

It would be nice if we could get country of origin labels. Would love to know if my fish was coming from horribly polluted Chinese waters.
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