The Watch Appreciation Thread (Reviews and Photos of Men's Timepieces by Rolex, Patek Philippe, Brei

[apropos]



Maybe it's just me, but girls liking what I wear is a good thing. Versus the SF mentality of just trying to impress other.. uh.. dudes..

The lesser of 2 evils, yes, and with some potentially... uh, gratifying effects too!

 

[RogerP]

all thing's considering, this thread has been on fire of late!

Agreed, good discussion.

 

[TheFoo]



Agreed. IMO the real value in this thread comes from posts, not photos.

Photos you can find anywhere on the internet easily - you can set up an RSS aggregator to stream feeds from various tumblrs and blogs and have literally 100s of new watch photos to sift through each day.

Quality discussion about watches from opinionated and (sometimes, hehe) knowledgeable folk? Now that's a little less common.

+1

To reiterate, you need to understand a watch's provenance and lineage to get a picture of its desirability. So, discussion and knowledge are key to refining one's taste for these things. Oooooing and aaaaahing at pictures doesn't get you anywhere. The 3531 doesn't have a very good story behind it and it's mechanically pedestrian. The design is also a strange hodge-podge of compromised downsizing and generica, as I previously illustrated. Hence, one can strongly suspect its lower desirability even before doing a price check.

Now, that's not to say anything is wrong with liking the 3531. But I think the more you inform yourself about it, the less likely you are to like it. The secondary market prices show this pretty clearly.

 

[ahdaeeeee]

It depends on which Portuguese you're talking about. The Portuguese chrono (as posted above) does not use an in-house movement. The upside of that is that it is likely to be more accurate. Whether it is foolish to expect your high end watch to run accurately is a question I will leave to you.

Thanks for clarifying. Still an amateur on these watches. I thought all of the Portuguese uses in-house movements. Isn't that the reason people are willing to pay a higher price for? The in-house movements which resulted in accuracy?

 

[Allez Allez]

Foo - I really don't find all of your arguments totally persuasive, but let's agree to disagree on the 3531. This is getting tedious.

What do you think about the merits of collecting smaller watches in general? I am of the view that the recent trend towards larger watches is depressing the market for smaller watches in the secondary market. I think the prices of these watches will eventually rebound to the collector's benefit when that trend reverses. By smaller, I guess I mean under 38mm. Yes? No?

 

[Kaplan]

.

 

[david3558]

 

[rnguy001]

Badness. Love to see what else is on the winder

 

[rnguy001]

Dp

 

[david3558]



Badness. Love to see what else is on the winder

Thanks man - haha, guess you'll just have to wait

 

[nttdocomo]

More pedestrian Speedy here

Lovely! What strap is it?

 

[Dino944]



I thought all of the Portuguese uses in-house movements. Isn't that the reason people are willing to pay a higher price for? The in-house movements which resulted in accuracy?

No, not all Portugese models use an in house movement. Some have used JLC movements and the chronographs have used Valjoux 7750s. An inhouse movement does not mean a watch is more accurate. However, in today's market place many people prefer an in house movement. Some may feel its more exclusive and getting more value for what you pay, (if spending x amount on a watch, do you want what's inside to also power a bunch of less expensive pieces also?). But some great watches have used movements from other companies. Patek and VC have used Lemania bases in chronographs such as the 5070, 3970, and Historique and Malte Chronographs. In addition, the movement in PPs first Jumbo Nautilus, APs RO Jumbo, and VCs 222 were all based on JLCs cal 920. So I personally would not be against an outsourced movement, depending on the quality, price point,and type of watch.

What do you think about the merits of collecting smaller watches in general? I am of the view that the recent trend towards larger watches is depressing the market for smaller watches in the secondary market. I think the prices of these watches will eventually rebound to the collector's benefit when that trend reverses. By smaller, I guess I mean under 38mm. Yes? No?

My advice would be buy what you like and what you are comfortable wearing. The big watch preference has been around for quite a while now. I occasionally hear people say the trend will or is moving toward watches that are not so large. But that remains to be seen. There are still lots of large watches out there and new ones being released each year. Like anything if the trend strongly toward larger watches prices on smaller to normal sizes will remain depressed. It can represent a bargain for some buyers, but like anything they shouldn't buy with the idea they will see an increase in value soon or possibly ever. It depends on what buyers want in the future and there are never any guarantees. Buy what you like, and if values stay the same you won't be disappointed and you will have something you like, and should values increase well that's just an added benefit.

 

[Dino944]



Clearly you guys do not follow auctions at all. Auction results are the best determinant of a watch's "value" as a function of "desirability". This desirability is not set in stone though - it waxes and wanes, like anyone who has followed the "value" of Jaguar E types will attest.

And "discontinued small dress watches" from a certain house are amongst the best consistently performing class of auctioned watches, so that comment doesn't quite add up. I imagine the effect is slightly different for IWC though as it is not known or valued for its small dress watches, not even the old Ingenuier line.

Finally I am also not sure why "chicks digging" a watch is of any value in this discussion, let alone this thread. They are an exceptionally unlettered population when it comes to watches, and its somewhat akin to saying hey guidos dig my aldos... so they must be good.

I think you took the part about chicks digging their watches a bit too seriously... may be some truth there, but I thought it was a bit of having fun and joking around.

As for car and watch auctions, while they are indicators of price and desirability, there can be big variations, and car have certain factors that affect their auction estimates and prices.

As for variations, Antiquorum just sold a pump pusher steel exotic/Paul Newman dial Daytona for roughly 3 times its estimate or about $215,000 IIRC correctly. Whether it was a few insane collectors that got into a bidding war, and someone grossly over paid, or whether values will head there remains to be seen. It's a nice watch but I think the guy grossly overpaid ( I'd prefer a PN dial Daytona with screw down pushers anyway).

Perhaps ive read you automobile auction a bit too seriously, however i would note car auctions differ from watch auctions in that people are often searching out the dream car of their youth. So as certain generations of buyers reach a point where they have disposable fun money, interest and prices drastically increase in various vintages of cars. I'm not really sure this has really been seen or has been sited by many collectors as to why they have bought a particular watch. In addition, as the generation of people that saw Duesenbergs as the ultimate automobile have died off, prices dropped significantly. Whether that will happen with some watches in the future who knows.

 

[ahdaeeeee]

No, not all Portugese models use an in house movement. Some have used JLC movements and the chronographs have used Valjoux 7750s. An inhouse movement does not mean a watch is more accurate. However, in today's market place many people prefer an in house movement. Some may feel its more exclusive and getting more value for what you pay, (if spending x amount on a watch, do you want what's inside to also power a bunch of less expensive pieces also?). But some great watches have used movements from other companies. Patek and VC have used Lemania bases in chronographs such as the 5070, 3970, and Historique and Malte Chronographs. In addition, the movement in PPs first Jumbo Nautilus, APs RO Jumbo, and VCs 222 were all based on JLCs cal 920. So I personally would not be against an outsourced movement, depending on the quality, price point,and type of watch.

Thanks for that. What you said is true, the reason people prefer in house movement is because it is more exclusive, I mean I can say that for me. Nonetheless, that does not make the Portuguese an inferior watch. What's your take on the Portuguese Chrono?

 

[apropos]



You are so literal, it's laughable. 

But I'll take chicks digging something over your perpetual scoffing disapproval any day.

I think you took the part about chicks digging their watches a bit too seriously... may be some truth there, but I thought it was a bit of having fun and joking around.

Wouldn't it be hilarious/awesome if I was a chick?

Nah, you guys are right, I totally misjudged that one. RogerP, with regards to the "perpetual scoffing disapproval", you're lucky I left my monocle and cane at home today so it's actually more like "annual scoffing disapproval" actually. (terrible WIS joke)

Perhaps ive read you automobile auction a bit too seriously, however i would note car auctions differ from watch auctions in that people are often searching out the dream car of their youth. So as certain generations of buyers reach a point where they have disposable fun money, interest and prices drastically increase in various vintages of cars. I'm not really sure this has really been seen or has been sited by many collectors as to why they have bought a particular watch. In addition, as the generation of people that saw Duesenbergs as the ultimate automobile have died off, prices dropped significantly. Whether that will happen with some watches in the future who knows.

Oh, I only used the E type as an example because it's relatively well known, and given it was produced in relatively large numbers, rarity becomes less of an factor influencing price.