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The Watch Appreciation Thread (Reviews and Photos of Men's Timepieces by Rolex, Patek Philippe, Breitling, JLC etc...) - Page 1579  

post #23671 of 48312
Hi guys, Not sure why my computer isn't letting me multi quote! Sorry for the multiple single posts. Dopey, glad to hear everything worked out for the bezel replacement. Wow, 25 years with a watch is pretty impressive. I think m y oldest is 19. DDDrees, thanks. Glad you enjoyed my post on the OQ/quartz movement.
post #23672 of 48312
Quote:
Originally Posted by DLJr View Post

Frilly, what kind of camera are you screwing around with?

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by in stitches View Post

frill - great pic

 

Thanks, gents.  Just my clunky old Canon Rebel T1i (four years old!) but with a new lens: 100 macro / AV mode / f stop at 2.8 / ISO auto.  Playing around with how close I can get to capture detail, depth, etc.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by akatsuki View Post


Hmmm... I wonder if I could get them to switch it out - I really do prefer the blue.

 

It is not impossible, but usually Patek will do that for you during service time.  And sometimes it will require a long trip to Geneva; Patek in NYC will not switch out all dials in the USA.  I am really not sure you can do that with your AD before you purchase the piece.

post #23673 of 48312
Quote:
Originally Posted by wurger View Post

Dress watch? Or what type are you thinking about?

i'm planning on replacing an IWC portuguese, which I thought was a balance of dress & casual?
post #23674 of 48312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dino944 View Post

My vote is for the AP RO. I love Rolex watches and have a few, but I find the DJ II is a bloated homely version of the standard DJ. The bezel and case of the DJ look too bulbous. Go for a regular DJ or the AP RO (I love my RO...just look at a few of my recent posts.) Good luck.

+1 on the AP.

I personally like the DJII, but the RO is in a completely different class.
post #23675 of 48312
Quote:
Originally Posted by NonServiam View Post

Today I spent the day on the beach with my daughter. The only watch that takes saltwater, sand, food, sunscreen, ice cream and diaper changes without a whimper: G-Shock shog[1].gif

20130801_163206-1_zps65b2153f.jpg

Changed back to the MUT Moon for dinner though icon_gu_b_slayer[1].gif

1-DSC_6497_zpse0e0d314.jpg

Your new JLC is stunning! Congrats!
post #23676 of 48312
Quote:
Originally Posted by no frills View Post


It is not impossible, but usually Patek will do that for you during service time.  And sometimes it will require a long trip to Geneva; Patek in NYC will not switch out all dials in the USA.  I am really not sure you can do that with your AD before you purchase the piece.

Hi Frills, I'm not a Patek owner and have no experience with their service (although a friend of mine thought although friendly, they are a bit rigid). Anyway I'd be kind of surprised if Patek would change a dial on an existing watch to a dial not offered in that metal. A lot of companies will not modify a watch to have a dial that was not available for a particular version of a watch. In addition, in a recent interview with Thierry Stern, he made it clear that while they will not make custom watches from scratch, it sounded as though they may entertain a good customer requesting that they create a slightly modified watch, his example was a different dial. I don't have the article in front of me but it read as though a person could submit a request to order a particular change to a watch and they would consider it, rather than change the dial of a watch a customer already owned.

Mr. Stern raised the issue of not wanting to get into creating one off or individual pieces, that could end up on an auction block in a very short time just because an owner knows they have the only one of a particular model.

I would think Patek would want to charge a significant amount if they are accommodating a specific request, as it could become quite valuable as a single piece. However, you suggestion of them doing it at the time of service raises another interesting question, "what happens to the original dial?"

Rolex USA keeps original parts, and sells new parts as part of a trade( I hear its not so strict in Europe). Rolex does this to prevent owners from selling old parts on eBay to people that cobble together fakes using some real Rolex parts. In any event, I posed the question about the original dial, because the value of any collectible watch is tied partially to the dial. A watch with original dial is always worth more than one with a "service dial"/replacement, or a redial. So if Patek keeps the original, the owner doing the dial change could be devaluing his watch. Although, if Patek doesn't like doing one offs, that result in watches going to auction after a short time and selling for more than the owner paid, a later dial change after purchased (so its not in its original form) could dissuade an owner from flipping it , because he knows its worth less since its not the original dial and didn't come from the factory that way.

I guess the only way to know what Patek would actually do is to submit a request to Patek and wait for their response.
post #23677 of 48312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dino944 View Post


Hi Frills, I'm not a Patek owner and have no experience with their service (although a friend of mine thought although friendly, they are a bit rigid). Anyway I'd be kind of surprised if Patek would change a dial on an existing watch to a dial not offered in that metal. A lot of companies will not modify a watch to have a dial that was not available for a particular version of a watch. In addition, in a recent interview with Thierry Stern, he made it clear that while they will not make custom watches from scratch, it sounded as though they may entertain a good customer requesting that they create a slightly modified watch, his example was a different dial. I don't have the article in front of me but it read as though a person could submit a request to order a particular change to a watch and they would consider it, rather than change the dial of a watch a customer already owned.

Mr. Stern raised the issue of not wanting to get into creating one off or individual pieces, that could end up on an auction block in a very short time just because an owner knows they have the only one of a particular model.

I would think Patek would want to charge a significant amount if they are accommodating a specific request, as it could become quite valuable as a single piece. However, you suggestion of them doing it at the time of service raises another interesting question, "what happens to the original dial?"

Rolex USA keeps original parts, and sells new parts as part of a trade( I hear its not so strict in Europe). Rolex does this to prevent owners from selling old parts on eBay to people that cobble together fakes using some real Rolex parts. In any event, I posed the question about the original dial, because the value of any collectible watch is tied partially to the dial. A watch with original dial is always worth more than one with a "service dial"/replacement, or a redial. So if Patek keeps the original, the owner doing the dial change could be devaluing his watch. Although, if Patek doesn't like doing one offs, that result in watches going to auction after a short time and selling for more than the owner paid, a later dial change after purchased (so its not in its original form) could dissuade an owner from flipping it , because he knows its worth less since its not the original dial and didn't come from the factory that way.

I guess the only way to know what Patek would actually do is to submit a request to Patek and wait for their response.

 

Oh yeah - I forgot to mention that it won't be something that's always accommodated and it will actually be for exceptional circumstances - like for some of their most reliable repeat customers.  In the past they would actually let customers keep the original dial, believe it or not. That's why you'll still see the somewhat rare pre-owned piece with two dials because the original owner had the original dial replaced. 


If you're a reliable repeat customer with a history with the brand, and the parts are generally available, I suspect the request can be accommodated.  Switching out a 3970 white dial for, say, a black dial, has to be done in Geneva - but according to Patek USA they can still certainly accommodate it.  I didn't ask about the price/cost, though - although the suggestion that it was going to be sent to Geneva already implied extra time and potentially additional costs.  I also know a few collectors who've had dials replaced for their 5205s recently, because the darker dial was found to be not so legible.  So I think it does happen - but it may cost extra and it will certainly take more time.  


I do not know what Patek will do to the original dial at this point in time.  I'd have to think that savvy owners would want it back, since that's what's written on the Certificate of Origin and it would be tough to sell a piece at a good price if the papers did not match the piece.

post #23678 of 48312
Quote:
Originally Posted by taxgenius View Post

Pardon if this question was already covered, but are German made watches cheaper in Germany?

I consistently see the best prices on Nomos etc from German dealers at Chrono24, so potentially yes.
post #23679 of 48312
Quote:
Originally Posted by bawlin View Post


+1 on the AP.

I personally like the DJII, but the RO is in a completely different class.

 

This.  I like the DJII well enough, but if I could swing the AP I would not hesitate.

post #23680 of 48312
Quote:
Originally Posted by no frills View Post

Oh yeah - I forgot to mention that it won't be something that's always accommodated and it will actually be for exceptional circumstances - like for some of their most reliable repeat customers.  In the past they would actually let customers keep the original dial, believe it or not. That's why you'll still see the somewhat rare pre-owned piece with two dials because the original owner had the original dial replaced. 


If you're a reliable repeat customer with a history with the brand, and the parts are generally available, I suspect the request can be accommodated.  Switching out a 3970 white dial for, say, a black dial, has to be done in Geneva - but according to Patek USA they can still certainly accommodate it.  I didn't ask about the price/cost, though - although the suggestion that it was going to be sent to Geneva already implied extra time and potentially additional costs.  I also know a few collectors who've had dials replaced for their 5205s recently, because the darker dial was found to be not so legible.  So I think it does happen - but it may cost extra and it will certainly take more time.  


I do not know what Patek will do to the original dial at this point in time.  I'd have to think that savvy owners would want it back, since that's what's written on the Certificate of Origin and it would be tough to sell a piece at a good price if the papers did not match the piece.

I figure it would be reasonably straightforward since it is essentially a part for part replacement. As far as resale value, I think it is a bit silly to worry about - either you can afford the watch or you can't. If I can't afford to buy a luxury good outright, I don't buy it.
post #23681 of 48312
Quote:
Originally Posted by akatsuki View Post

I figure it would be reasonably straightforward since it is essentially a part for part replacement. As far as resale value, I think it is a bit silly to worry about - either you can afford the watch or you can't. If I can't afford to buy a luxury good outright, I don't buy it.

 

Resale value really shouldn't be the primary criterion for buying a watch.  "Buy what you like, and can reasonably afford" - you'll hear this often.  However, it would be somewhat naive IMHO if you didn't consider it at all, given the price point of this luxury good and the fact that certain pieces do retain value more than others (and certain pieces can be resold for higher values depending on how you care for them).

 

At the very least resale value ought to play a part in future purchases: that luxury good you want to buy in the future but can't afford?  Well, it might suddenly be affordable if you traded in a watch with good resale value.


But - as for your original question - yes, I too prefer the blue/grey dial. smile.gif

 

post #23682 of 48312

^^^

 

Only way to go.

 

cheers.gif

post #23683 of 48312
Quote:
Originally Posted by akatsuki View Post

I figure it would be reasonably straightforward since it is essentially a part for part replacement. As far as resale value, I think it is a bit silly to worry about - either you can afford the watch or you can't. If I can't afford to buy a luxury good outright, I don't buy it.
Hmmm....sounds like some unnecessary snobbery. I don't want to speak for Frills (without his consent), but I didn't bring up resale with any reference to what you can or can't afford, and I'd be willing to guess neither did Frills.

To suggest people who consider resale value or who trade or sell a watch, do it because they can't afford a watch is a bit silly and unfounded.

A person might choose to sell a watch because after some time they find its not well suited for their life style, or because they have other watches and one piece isn't getting much wrist time so they decide to sell it or trade it toward something they believe they would get more use from, or because a persons taste has changed, or they don't keep watches for very long and they like to try out different pieces, or because they want to upgrade to a finer or more complicated watch and keeping the old piece would be redundant since they won't wear it. None of those reasons have anything to do with inability to afford a watch. To suggest that people who would be concerned about resale value can't afford a watch, is nonsense.

Personally, I'm rarely moved by watches in WG, so I find the idea of buying a WG watch and paying to get the dial of a SS model a bit silly. Just buy it in steel, and use the additional funds toward something else. The gray dial is what distinguishes the WG model from the steel...so it loses some of its identity. But if it makes you happy and PP is willing to do a parts swap go for it.

Swapping out a dial ( if Patek keeps the original dial) a not only reduces its value, but it also reduces the number of people that would even consider buying it, should you unexpectedly need money, or you tire of the watch. I would never purchase a preowned or vintage watch that does not have the original dial. I'm just 1 person, but I know other collectors who are the same way.

If you want to devalue a product, and changing its dial makes you happy, just go for it. No need to ask us what Patek would do, just call an AD or boutique and make your request. Good luck with whatever you decide.
post #23684 of 48312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dino944 View Post


To suggest people who consider resale value or who trade or sell a watch, do it because they can't afford a watch is a bit silly and unfounded.

A person might choose to sell a watch because after some time they find its not well suited for their life style, or because they have other watches and one piece isn't getting much wrist time so they decide to sell it or trade it toward something they believe they would get more use from, or because a persons taste has changed, or they don't keep watches for very long and they like to try out different pieces, or because they want to upgrade to a finer or more complicated watch and keeping the old piece would be redundant since they won't wear it. None of those reasons have anything to do with inability to afford a watch. To suggest that people who would be concerned about resale value can't afford a watch, is nonsense.

 

 

+1

post #23685 of 48312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dino944 View Post

Personally, I'm rarely moved by watches in WG, so I find the idea of buying a WG watch and paying to get the dial of a SS model a bit silly.

Ahem...

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