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I need feminism because tumblr - Page 333

post #4981 of 5586
I'm not a student. I don't know the bathrooms in the whole building, just that one in particular. The point is now they have created a situation where most everyone would be uncomfortable using the bathroom. It's really stupid.

Politically I think if bathrooms are gendered or not should be a choice left up to the property owner.
post #4982 of 5586

It is amazing how traumatized so many people were by their potty training. Its just going wee wee and poo poo . God get a grip!

post #4983 of 5586
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reggs View Post

I'm not a student. I don't know the bathrooms in the whole building, just that one in particular. The point is now they have created a situation where most everyone would be uncomfortable using the bathroom. It's really stupid.

Politically I think if bathrooms are gendered or not should be a choice left up to the property owner.

 

Basically any store I go into has a "family friendly" bathroom that is open to everyone.  This has been going on long before this whole nonsense.  Seriously, Sam's Club, Walmart, Target, Best Buy, etc.

What the fuck is wrong with you?  There are hundreds of issues that are far more important than this.  Shut the fuck up.  No one except you gives a shit about bathrooms.  We literally have more debt/citizen than the average household income.  We have members of the military dying in some sandy shit hole for no fucking reason.  We have a government who forcing you to buy products.  The government is engaged in unprecedented levels of monitoring its citizens and warrant-less searches.  The government is in charge of airport screening where they miss 95%+ of threats, but somehow cost us almost $10 billion/year.  Both major party candidates are trying to undo centuries of progress on international trade.  Both major party candidates are historically unlikable frauds. 

 

All this and you're in here bitching about one fucking bathroom in one fucking university in California?

Etc, etc.

post #4984 of 5586
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kai View Post

For folks who complain about disparity of salaries between men's and women's soccer:


Australian Olympic women's soccer team beaten Beaten 7-0 By Newcastle Jets Under-15 Boys Team


http://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/2016/05/25/matildas-beaten-7-0-by-newcastle-jets-under-15-boys-team/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jr Mouse View Post

The point that I believe you are trying to make here is exceptionally weak.
Buried in this is sort of a point.
The difference in athleticism does have some relevance.

I follow squash which has been moving pretty aggressively to gender equity in prize money. So far that has worked out o.k. because as small-time as the money is in the game, it mostly comes from sponsors and not ticket sales. For the moment, that is working out great as gender equity is new and fashionable and sponsors are happy to bask in the glow. But ticket sales for women's events are pretty low and for good reason. I am a huge fan of the women's game because I know the players and appreciate the slowed-down version of the game, which is closer to what I can do (I can't, but I can't even delude myself with the men). But I would never take a non-fan to a women' match. It is just too unimpressive athletically. In contrast, even a low level men's pro match is physically spectacular. I love it as a fan and know that even a non-fan will be blown away by it. In short, as much as squash is a niche sport, women's squash is a sub-niche sport. Most women's squash fans are either fanatic players or young girls competing in the juniors whose parents bring them. When sponsors are no longer excited by the novelty of parity, gender equity is, long term, likely to become un-economic and things may get ugly. As in the tennis game, some men on the pro tour complained about equal prize money and were quickly shut down by the tour. Same with some journalists who also noted that not only do fewer people bother to watch the women, but, because they are so much less athletic, they are less able to defend the court so their matches are over in much less time (they run, typically, two thirds to half the length of a men's match). Since the men's and women's tours are under one professional body, the tour is able to squelch complaints for now but i doubt that will last.
post #4985 of 5586
Quote:
Originally Posted by dopey View Post


Buried in this is sort of a point.
The difference in athleticism does have some relevance.

I follow squash which has been moving pretty aggressively to gender equity in prize money. So far that has worked out o.k. because as small-time as the money is in the game, it mostly comes from sponsors and not ticket sales. For the moment, that is working out great as gender equity is new and fashionable and sponsors are happy to bask in the glow. But ticket sales for women's events are pretty low and for good reason. I am a huge fan of the women's game because I know the players and appreciate the slowed-down version of the game, which is closer to what I can do (I can't, but I can't even delude myself with the men). But I would never take a non-fan to a women' match. It is just too unimpressive athletically. In contrast, even a low level men's pro match is physically spectacular. I love it as a fan and know that even a non-fan will be blown away by it. In short, as much as squash is a niche sport, women's squash is a sub-niche sport. Most women's squash fans are either fanatic players or young girls competing in the juniors whose parents bring them. When sponsors are no longer excited by the novelty of parity, gender equity is, long term, likely to become un-economic and things may get ugly. As in the tennis game, some men on the pro tour complained about equal prize money and were quickly shut down by the tour. Same with some journalists who also noted that not only do fewer people bother to watch the women, but, because they are so much less athletic, they are less able to defend the court so their matches are over in much less time (they run, typically, two thirds to half the length of a men's match). Since the men's and women's tours are under one professional body, the tour is able to squelch complaints for now but i doubt that will last.

That's all perfectly sensible but Mouse's point still holds, no?
First off, some random outlier data point doesn't even prove the difference in athleticism, assuming there's any meaningful disagreement about it. I mean, a depleted Globetrotters team relying on super-subs Gilligan and Skipper once beat a team of super robots. Shit happens.

And if we're talking about the national teams, I would think that the institutional goals are (or should be) significantly different from straight commercial venture. Which is not to say that absolute equivalence is obviously and necessarily the the correct approach, but there are a couple million steps missing from the syllogism A Boys' Team Beat An Ostensibly More Advanced Womens' Team in Australia - - > ha those American feminazis should shut up!!!!!!! And Mouse never said there was no logical connection whatsoever. I understood him to be suggesting that the post to which he responded was a very weak attempt at establishing a point, which is certainly was.
post #4986 of 5586
It's not really "Men's soccer" and "Women's soccer," though, is it? It's more like soccer and no-men-allowed soccer.
post #4987 of 5586
I don't know if there is really any point in discussing the differences in athleticism at the professional level. The differences are huge. In squash, mid-level, over the hill club pros can handle the very top women on the tour. I know from talking to college tennis players that the top women pros were no competition for them. At the lower skill levels there is certainly enough noise that skill can compensate for physicality, but even in racket sports, where pure strength and power are not at a premium, once you get very competent players, the physical differences become more than overwhelming. There can be outliers, though. There is a 14 year old American girl who is something of a squash prodigy and she is currently the top ranked junior girl, even in the under-19s. She played in an adult tournament in New York and won a skill-level division, against adult males, that is roughly the equivalent of second/third rate varsity players (meaning good players who can play varsity for a top thirty team, but not a top 20 team or thereabouts). That was a very big deal. People were shocked. If she were eligible today, she might be the best female college player in the country. But she would be smoked by any of the men on a top tier team's roster. Here is a little write-up on her (second half): http://squashmagazine.ussquash.com/2016/05/two-for-the-ages/

The main point I was making above, though, is that if you think of pay in sports as relating to entertainment value, athleticism matters. But I will be happy to admit that it is not all that matters. The women's tennis tour is certainly popular even if the women are not as athletic as the men. The game is still a good product. What matters for pay is (and should be) revenue. If people want to pay to watch women's sports (or buy the stuff that sponsors it), then the athletes should be paid accordingly. If not, then I think it is stupid to pay them more out of principle and is likely to be toxic. As long as there is lots of money to go around, the problems can be ignored, but I don't think it is sustainable long term.

As for national teams, that is really not where the money is anyway - other than maybe world cup in soccer. No other sport cares much about it.
Edited by dopey - 6/6/16 at 2:17pm
post #4988 of 5586
Sorry Dopey, but that's just too many words to read about squash.
post #4989 of 5586

I hate squash except maybe zucchini and then only the small ones 

post #4990 of 5586
How to... beat both Williams sisters in one afternoon


http://www.theguardian.com/observer/osm/story/0,,543962,00.html



In just about every sport, the differences in skill and athleticism are so pronounced that it isn't even close. Watching women's sports is boring, unless it's something like beach volleyball.
post #4991 of 5586

I remember a simpler -- some would say better -- times when this thread was about making at dumb people with a tumblr.

 

post #4992 of 5586
Quote:
Originally Posted by brokencycle View Post

I remember a simpler -- some would say better -- times when this thread was about making at dumb people with a tumblr.


I'd think leggings would be inconvenient when using a urinal, regardless of the gender specificity or inclusiveness of the restroom. But I haven't worn them since working as a waiter at a Shakespeare-themed cocktail party thrown by the Theater Department back when I was in college, so perhaps the UE technology has improved since then.
post #4993 of 5586

I wear em' with me kilt

post #4994 of 5586
Quote:
Originally Posted by Numbernine View Post

I wear em' with me kilt
Doesn't that defeat the purpose?
post #4995 of 5586
Thread Starter 
Jesus fuck lawyerdad a fucking Gilligan's Island Globetrotters special reference? You've gone up a rung in my mind, sir. Well done.
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