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Leather Quality and Properties - Page 30

post #436 of 1279
DW. I came across a UK company selling pure mutton tallow dubbin as a boot treatment. What are your thoughts on the efficacy of using this as a conditioner/protector and would you be for or against its use on calf leather?

Thanks in advance!
post #437 of 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by JermynStreet View Post

I'm just kidding around. No meaningful contribution. A poor attempt to make a play on words regarding the mineral oil conversation and the topic of "bulling" toes.

No problem. the thing that bothers me about VC is that it has a poison warning on the side of the box and a disclaimer that it contains petroleum distillates and turpentine. I wonder why they would reference petroleum distillates AND turp if they aren't two different ingredients.So what is the other ingredient? It could, I suppose, be mineral oil. Which might explain Horween's preference for it.

PS (on edit) now that I think about it turpentine is a distillate of wood products...seems to me I recall Rausch Naval Yards talking about turpentine being a by-product of pitch and pine rosin manufacture.

--
Edited by DWFII - 8/21/13 at 10:33am
post #438 of 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by OzzyJones View Post

DW. I came across a UK company selling pure mutton tallow dubbin as a boot treatment. What are your thoughts on the efficacy of using this as a conditioner/protector and would you be for or against its use on calf leather?

Thanks in advance!

Great for work boots. Use sparingly for dress shoes and only when nothing else is available.

Do you have a link for the dubbin?
post #439 of 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post

Great for work boots. Use sparingly for dress shoes and only when nothing else is available.

Do you have a link for the dubbin?

Thanks!
Here's the link: http://www.trestleshop.com/mutton-tallow-boot-grease/

but its horrendously expensive from this company.
You can get the same stuff (I presume) in the states for 3 bucks a tin
post #440 of 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by OzzyJones View Post

Thanks!
Here's the link: http://www.trestleshop.com/mutton-tallow-boot-grease/

but its horrendously expensive from this company.
You can get the same stuff (I presume) in the states for 3 bucks a tin
Curious...where in the states?
post #441 of 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post

Curious...where in the states?

http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/page.aspx?p=69309&cat=1,43415,43440&ap=1
post #442 of 1279

As an alternative to dubbin is Dr Marten's Wonder Balsam. The UK address is:

 

http://store.drmartens.co.uk/p-6832-dr-martens-wonder-balsam.aspx

post #443 of 1279

I wondered...I have some of that. I've been using it on my tools--just as the write-up says it should be used. I like it fine for tools, never tried it on leather. That said, I have a pint of rendered sheep's tallow that I use occasionally for softening waxes and so forth. I have used it on leather but as I say only on leather that was already stuffed.
Thanks...
post #444 of 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post

I wondered...I have some of that. I've been using it on my tools--just as the write-up says it should be used. I like it fine for tools, never tried it on leather. That said, I have a pint of rendered sheep's tallow that I use occasionally for softening waxes and so forth. I have used it on leather but as I say only on leather that was already stuffed.
Thanks...

So, good for chromexcel and featherstone, not so much for boxcalf?
post #445 of 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by OzzyJones View Post

So, good for chromexcel and featherstone, not so much for boxcalf?

That would be my take. It's not even so much that it would damage the calf but rather that subsequent waxes would not adhere or, esp., shine up. The tallow might have a tendency to darken some leathers as well and such products tend to collect dirt and other fines and hold them in the creases of the shoe. I believe that contributes to cracking.
post #446 of 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post

That would be my take. It's not even so much that it would damage the calf but rather that subsequent waxes would not adhere or, esp., shine up. The tallow might have a tendency to darken some leathers as well and such products tend to collect dirt and other fines and hold them in the creases of the shoe. I believe that contributes to cracking.

Makes sense, thanks
post #447 of 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post

I'm a bit late to the game here as I have been in Seattle for the last week or so, but I would be very curious to hear what DW says about Glens products. I said not long ago that I am kind of off the renovateur bandwagon in favor of lexol, but I am curious as to the migration issue with Glen's products. For example, Lexol states that they designed their conditioners to stay where they are applied so it doesn't get into adjacent clothing and such and I wonder if this holds true for flexing as well. I have always wondered whether many natural products, while great conditioners don't simply get "wrung out" as soon as the leather is flexed, whereas a Lexol stays in place and keeps conditioning. I'm curious on the thoughts of both Glen and DW.

Patrick,

I finally got my first look at GlenKaren products. I'm more impressed than ever. The paste wax goes on so smooth and yet builds up so quickly. Glenjay had a pair of Lobbs that he spit-shined with the GlenKaren paste and they looked terrific. Lots of carnuba.

The cream waxes are a little stiffer than Saphir or Meltonian but they went on my alligator/calf balmorals easily and a minute or two later I was buffing it to a good shine. The GK creams use orange oil as a solvent and it evaporates three (?) times faster than turpentine, but is a better solvent and cleaner than turp.

The cleaner and conditioner took a little longer than the cream to penetrate the leather...as would be expected...but when it dried, it buffed up nicely. It also picked up dead/oxidized black polish from the shoe (cleaning) which I saw on my fingers. I used my fingers to apply all of the product...except the paste while spit shining...and it was nice to know that I wasn't absorbing petroleum distillates through my skin.

One nice thing, too, is that there's two to three times as much product in the little jars as with either Saphir or Meltonian. Yet the amounts needed (and recommended) are probably half of what you need for other products. And if you use your fingers you won't be applying more cream to the cloth than to the shoe. One of these demi-jars is gonna last a good long time.

I am quite enthusiastic about GlenKaren products and intend to include a jar with every shoe order.

Anyway...first impressions...but I just don't see a downside.
post #448 of 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post

Patrick,

I finally got my first look at GlenKaren products. I'm more impressed than ever. The paste wax goes on so smooth and yet builds up so quickly. Glenjay had a pair of Lobbs that he spit-shined with the GlenKaren paste and they looked terrific. Lots of carnuba.

The cream waxes are a little stiffer than Saphir or Meltonian but they went on my alligator/calf balmorals easily and a minute or two later I was buffing it to a good shine. The GK creams use orange oil as a solvent and it evaporates three (?) times faster than turpentine, but is a better solvent and cleaner than turp.

The cleaner and conditioner took a little longer than the cream to penetrate the leather...as would be expected...but when it dried, it buffed up nicely. It also picked up dead/oxidized black polish from the shoe (cleaning) which I saw on my fingers. I used my fingers to apply all of the product...except the paste while spit shining...and it was nice to know that I wasn't absorbing petroleum distillates through my skin.

One nice thing, too, is that there's two to three times as much product in the little jars as with either Saphir or Meltonian. Yet the amounts needed (and recommended) are probably half of what you need for other products. And if you use your fingers you won't be applying more cream to the cloth than to the shoe. One of these demi-jars is gonna last a good long time.

I am quite enthusiastic about GlenKaren products and intend to include a jar with every shoe order.

Anyway...first impressions...but I just don't see a downside.

Good to hear, maybe I will try it next time when my current Saphir runs out (in like 2 years...?)
post #449 of 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post

Patrick,

I finally got my first look at GlenKaren products. I'm more impressed than ever. The paste wax goes on so smooth and yet builds up so quickly. Glenjay had a pair of Lobbs that he spit-shined with the GlenKaren paste and they looked terrific. Lots of carnuba.

The cream waxes are a little stiffer than Saphir or Meltonian but they went on my alligator/calf balmorals easily and a minute or two later I was buffing it to a good shine. The GK creams use orange oil as a solvent and it evaporates three (?) times faster than turpentine, but is a better solvent and cleaner than turp.

The cleaner and conditioner took a little longer than the cream to penetrate the leather...as would be expected...but when it dried, it buffed up nicely. It also picked up dead/oxidized black polish from the shoe (cleaning) which I saw on my fingers. I used my fingers to apply all of the product...except the paste while spit shining...and it was nice to know that I wasn't absorbing petroleum distillates through my skin.

One nice thing, too, is that there's two to three times as much product in the little jars as with either Saphir or Meltonian. Yet the amounts needed (and recommended) are probably half of what you need for other products. And if you use your fingers you won't be applying more cream to the cloth than to the shoe. One of these demi-jars is gonna last a good long time.

I am quite enthusiastic about GlenKaren products and intend to include a jar with every shoe order.

Anyway...first impressions...but I just don't see a downside.

Thanks for taking the time to post a review DW, I really appreciate it.

in regard to evaporation speed: One of the main factors in determining evaporation speed is the Vapor Pressure (in millimeters of mercury) it takes for the ingredient to evaporate. The vapor pressure for turpentine is 4 mmHg, and the vapor pressure for orange oil is 1.4 mmHg (both at 68F/20C).

How well a solvent works is measured by its Kauri-Butanol (Kb) value (the higher the number the stronger the solvent). Turpentine has a Kb value of 56, while orange oil has a Kb value of 67.

The purpose of solvent in shoe polish is to keep in relatively soft (not a solid block of wax) so that it can be applied to a shoe and spread around. Once the polish is on the shoe you want the solvent to evaporate so as no to impede the wax from setting. The faster the evaporation the better the wax sets up because of the cooling effect related to evaporation heat transfer.

This also means that the polish can use less solvent to accomplish the same thing (or better) than polish using turpentine or naphtha.
post #450 of 1279
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by VegTan View Post

To DWFII,
I'm sure nobody has interest in our back-and-forth conversation. Let's drop it.

We're not having a "conversation" (you don't do "conversation")...you're not reading anything I've said to you and you're not saying anything--you're just hiding behind someone else's words. And I've got a dollar that says VegTan is your second username on this board. More hiding, IMO.

I totally understand your complain. Accepting it means asking an administrator to delete this thread. I thought you knew how this thread started, but you don't seem to know it.

It was suggested to me at The Official Shoe Care Thread to gather my excerpts on that thread together and post them as a new thread for convenience. I try to select as accurate information as possible. If you find mistakes, please correct them. If you still dislike and feel uncomfortable about this thread, how about posting a new thread? I promise I'll never post on your thread.
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