Originally Posted by snowmanxl
Great contributions sip-san; really well worded.
Can we have a "Sipang's thoughts on helmut Lang versus raf Simons" segment?
I've always thought the two were similar in regards to relaxedness and techy fabrics. (Early raf)
My Helmut Lang knowledge is very limited but u asked so... bullshiting ahead
HL had a pretty big influence on young Raf but it's not so much about specific features as it is about the way to 'approach' fashion (obviously this will/can result in similarities down the line). HL (and Margiela (and others but let's keep this relevant to the topic at hand)) expanded the playing field, sort of. 90s minimalism promoted a concept of simplicity (in reaction to the excess of the 80s) that was as much about clean lines and bare designs as it was about introducing casual (unadorned by nature) and sportswear-inspired elements (functional and pragmatic by nature, the techy fabrics were a key ingredient of 90s minimalism: Jil, Prada,...) and mixing them with formal/fashion pieces. Jeans, tshirts, basics were elevated to fashion items and in turn fashion became more down-to-earth. What sets HL apart though is that he merely used this new language, this blurring of the lines, as a tool to explore and present themes of sensuality, fragility, aggression and the tension between the two (notions that would be central tof Raf's work a couple years later): the fabrics (leather, nylon, plastic), the sheer tops and cut outs exposing the skin, the bondage elements, the military inspired items; there's something of a contained menace coexisting with vulnerability (a sheer sleeveless shirt, an almost evanescent coat pit against a chainmail butcher apron or a bulletproof-like vest). It's been qualified as punk although Helmut himself found the term inadequate, in any case the ambiguous tone that ran through the collections was cultivated down to the choice of models ( [...]but there was also something "broken" about him, a word once used to describe what he wanted his male models to look like--interesting in a slightly fucked-up way.
) All of this to say that, from that point on, fashion stopped being some disconnected and artificial world of glamour, supermodels, tans and fakes smiles and became something real that you (Raf) could relate to, something with humanity.
Raf built on those foundations and added his own layers of exploration of teenage isolation/teenage tribes (and the cultural references that shape them).
Originally Posted by Parker
Originally Posted by sipang
SLP was truly awful and very good, best SLP collection to date.
Hopefully, we'll witness a progressive Thom Browneisation (intentional or not) with the next few collections.
What parts did you think were awful and what good? I'm all for mods & rockers, but it was really cartoonish to me -- like Glee meets Grease. The casting was freaky, I'll give him that.
I think it was all awful but I liked it. To be clear, I'm only talking about the show as spectacle (hence Thom Browne), I initially dismissed it as yet another offensively unimaginative regurgitation but it grew on me. I absolutely don't give a fuck about the label so I'm just here to be entertained and entertained I was. As you said, it was cartoonish, there was a grotesque element to it all, a weird queasy vibe that I found a bit arresting (and yes, it's probably 90% thanks to the casting) and that was something new for a SLP show. That's all.