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Apartment foo-nishing - Page 77

post #1141 of 2411
Rug money went into the wardrobe.
post #1142 of 2411
Thread Starter 
But, it's not purely a money issue. It's a matter of taste. A superficial copy is not the only cost-effective choice.
post #1143 of 2411
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post

What I don't understand is how people who care so much about whether their suits are canvassed or glued-together would be okay with a Pottery Barn copy of a tribal rug.

My take on this, as a father of a 4 year old, is that some things needs to be "cheaper" so you can actually live/use the thing. We have a pretty expensive sofa and sideboard but a cheap (but nice :)) carpet and armchair. The 4 year old mainly uses the armchair when having snacks etc, if he spills on the carpet then we can always buy a new one if it gets to messy and the armchair has removable fabric that we ourselves can wash.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post

But, it's not purely a money issue. It's a matter of taste. A superficial copy is not the only cost-effective choice.
 
In my case it's not a copy thou, it's just a cheaper and synthetic shag (?). 
post #1144 of 2411
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post

But, it's not purely a money issue. It's a matter of taste. A superficial copy is not the only cost-effective choice.

Really? I've never been in a Pottery Barn, but is an $1100 rug from them really more disposable than some handwoven $2500 run from XXXXX? Genuine question, because I'm not sure if you're talking 'quality' or simply paying heed do the 'original designers'. Disclaimer: ours are from Wal-Mart or Costco.
post #1145 of 2411
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post

What I don't understand is how people who care so much about whether their suits are canvassed or glued-together would be okay with a Pottery Barn copy of a tribal rug.

Those aren't really the same thing. A better analog is the choice to buy a canvassed suit from an Indian maker instead of from Savile Row.
post #1146 of 2411
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NiceToHave View Post

My take on this, as a father of a 4 year old, is that some things needs to be "cheaper" so you can actually live/use the thing. We have a pretty expensive sofa and sideboard but a cheap (but nice smile.gif) carpet and armchair. The 4 year old mainly uses the armchair when having snacks etc, if he spills on the carpet then we can always buy a new one if it gets to messy and the armchair has removable fabric that we ourselves can wash.

Sorry, maybe I wasn't clear. I totally get that. It's not being cheap that's the problem; it's fakeness. If I wanted to spend less money than it would take to get a real Beni Ourain, I simply wouldn't buy a Beni Ourain-style rug.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CBrown85 View Post

Really? I've never been in a Pottery Barn, but is an $1100 rug from them really more disposable than some handwoven $2500 run from XXXXX? Genuine question, because I'm not sure if you're talking 'quality' or simply paying heed do the 'original designers'. Disclaimer: ours are from Wal-Mart or Costco.

I cannot speak to the workmanship of the Pottery Barn rug. My point is that it is fake. Cheap or inexpensive does not have to mean inauthentic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarbutch View Post

Those aren't really the same thing. A better analog is the choice to buy a canvassed suit from an Indian maker instead of from Savile Row.

No, it is not the most granular analog, but it doesn't have to be here, does it? The bigger point is less about authenticity (which your analog doesn't capture), but about refinement of taste and discernment.

A better analog, along the lines of your example, would be buying an Indian-made "Savile Row-style" suit under the impression that it will be meaningfully similar to a suit actually made by a Savile Row tailor.
post #1147 of 2411
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post

What I don't understand is how people who care so much about whether their suits are canvassed or glued-together would be okay with a Pottery Barn copy of a tribal rug.
I think it is because there are some things people care about and some things they don't, and one needn't be consistent to be happy. Our sofa is from Ikea. It may be a copy of some iconic design or maybe not. I don't really care. I got sick of looking for sofas and my wife decided to order that one and be done with it. Five or so years later, it still works and I don't regret that it isn't something else. On the other hand, every time my wife comes home with a new Pucci dress, I get pissed because I think it is basically a cheap knock-off of old Pucci, which was beautfully made. The new stuff is junk and I would rather she bought cheaper cheap knock-offs from H&M.
post #1148 of 2411
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarbutch View Post

Those aren't really the same thing. A better analog is the choice to buy a canvassed suit from an Indian maker instead of from Savile Row.

No, it is not the most granular analog, but it doesn't have to be here, does it? The bigger point is less about authenticity (which your analog doesn't capture), but about refinement of taste and discernment.

A better analog, along the lines of your example, would be buying an Indian-made "Savile Row-style" suit under the impression that it will be meaningfully similar to a suit actually made by a Savile Row tailor.

I think Thomas Mahon would assert that his made-in-India line is meaningfully similar to something made by a SR tailor.
post #1149 of 2411
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dopey View Post

I think it is because there are some things people care about and some things they don't, and one needn't be consistent to be happy. Our sofa is from Ikea. It may be a copy of some iconic design or maybe not. I don't really care. I got sick of looking for sofas and my wife decided to order that one and be done with it. Five or so years later, it still works and I don't regret that it isn't something else. On the other hand, every time my wife comes home with a new Pucci dress, I get pissed because I think it is basically a cheap knock-off of old Pucci, which was beautfully made. The new stuff is junk and I would rather she bought cheaper cheap knock-offs from H&M.

This does and doesn't make sense.

Sure, people can pick what they care about. Yet, it seems to me that real taste is somehow transcendent, no? To me, it is about understanding and appreciating the intrinsic good in a thing--yet, such intrinsically good qualities tend to flow across different contexts. If I care about authenticity in one area, under the pretense that authenticity is fundamentally virtuous, it seems odd that I would not value it highly in other areas as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarbutch View Post

I think Thomas Mahon would assert that his made-in-India line is meaningfully similar to something made by a SR tailor.

I can't speak to that specific example. I hope you understand the bigger point, though.
post #1150 of 2411
Thread Starter 
Also, Ikea is so startling cheap for new furniture, that it is almost always impossible to find an equally inexpensive alternative. Sometimes, cheap is cheap.

A $500-1,000 rug from Pottery Barn is a different matter.
post #1151 of 2411
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post

This does and doesn't make sense.

Sure, people can pick what they care about. Yet, it seems to me that real taste is somehow transcendent, no? To me, it is about understanding and appreciating the intrinsic good in a thing--yet, such intrinsically good qualities tend to flow across different contexts. If I care about authenticity in one area, under the pretense that authenticity is fundamentally virtuous, it seems odd that I would not value it highly in other areas as well...
I can't dispute that it seems odd to you, but it seems perfectly sensible to me. There is so much in the world that I don't care about very much, and for those things, authenticity or inauthenticity are just another dimension about which I don't care. For me, authenticity isn't a thing in and of itself. It is an attribute of something else. If I care about the something else then I might cae about the attributes, and if I don't care about the thing then I don't fixate much on the attributes. In any case, I am reporting my own experience and not suggesting it has to be yours.

By the way, how many experts or masters of a field have you met who are absolutely rigorous and maniacal about perfection and authenticity in their field of interest but who completely ingnore those same factors in other fields? It seems pretty common to me. Certainly, in my experience, with musicians and writers and artists.
post #1152 of 2411
Thread Starter 
I don't disagree that people are typically inconsistent in applying priorities to aesthetic things (particularly experts and masters of particular fields, now that you ask), but that doesn't make me think better of it.

Part of having taste is overcoming prejudice and looking for intrinsic good even where you wouldn't expect to find it. So, I don't see how one can exert taste if he confines that approach to a pre-defined category (clothes, furniture, food, etc.). Being a really expert collector or adept hobbyist is not the same thing as being a tasteful person.
post #1153 of 2411
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post

Part of having taste is overcoming prejudice and looking for intrinsic good even where you wouldn't expect to find it.

Like in a rug made in India?
post #1154 of 2411
You have set yourself an ambitious goal.
Have you read À rebours? I am not sure you would like it (I didn't), but you are reminding me of it now. It is also worth reading if you want to push your aesthetic views out along the lines you have been doing.
post #1155 of 2411
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarbutch View Post

Like in a rug made in India?

Are you keeping track?

Dopey and I broadened the discussion to cover quality more generally. The issue with an Indian-made Beni Ourain is not that it is necessarily poorly made, but that it is necessarily fake.
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