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Hong Kong Tailor- Empire Int'l Tailors- Help with the fit of my suit - Page 3

post #31 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by robetrw006 View Post

You also mention the coat is irretrievably short. The look I'm going for is not a 80s [laughably oversized] power suit. I'm looking for something conservative with a bit of a slim cut to it. Its why I didn't ask for a full blown slim suit. Perhaps our definitions of "slim" suits differ(you can see what I consider to be "slim" in the photo below). What I feel I have is a relatively conservative suit. Granted, I won't deny that the lapels should be slightly wider and the jacket length about an inch longer(but not "
irretrievably" short).





What GBR means is that once the length of the jacket has been finished/hemmed, it cannot be lengthened - hence irretrievable.
post #32 of 69
Thread Starter 

This is not what I was going for. I was going for something that is relatively standard with a slightly slim cut. I'm ignorant on many of the aspects of tailoring, but I'm not stupid; I realize only the gym will make me look like the above photo.

 

While I appreciate the recommendations on my next suit, my biggest concern now is to try and tailor this one as best as I can to give myself a look I'm more satisfying with. I only have about 3 weeks left in HK(plenty of time for a HK tailor), and I need to make any alterations to the suit within that period of time, so I can't discuss the matter too much more before needing to go back to the tailor.

 

 

So far I've got:

 

1) Take in the trousers in the thigh area. (does everyone(except GBR) agree on this?)

 

2) Ask to lengthen the jacket up to an inch(if possible)

 

3) Relax the waist? (this one still seems to be debated between people)

post #33 of 69
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dib View Post


What GBR means is that once the length of the jacket has been finished/hemmed, it cannot be lengthened - hence irretrievable.

Really? I was under the impression(from an earlier post) that it could be lengthened to a certain extent. I always knew you couldn't ask them to put on inches, but I though perhaps as much as an inch could be added

post #34 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by robetrw006 View Post

Really? I was under the impression(from an earlier post) that it could be lengthened to a certain extent. I always knew you couldn't ask them to put on inches, but I though perhaps as much as an inch could be added

I dont think it can be lengthened actually, i've discussed this with tailors before and they've always advised it's not really possible at this stage.

Regarding your questions above, I would advise against letting the waist out. One of your main concerns seems to be that the suit isn't slim enough and doesnt have any shape around the waist - letting the waist out is only going to exacerbate this problem obviously.
post #35 of 69
GBR might be right about the trousers - it's not necessarily that there's too much cloth, it's just that they're not hanging correctly. In the profile shot they seem to be hugging the backs of your legs - they shouldn't do that, they should hang in a much straighter line from your ass to your to heel (see in your photo how they hang in a straight line down the front , without hugging the fronts of your legs - they should do the same at the back). I don't know how you'd go about fixing that in your example, but it may need more cloth not less, so I wouldn't just go in asking for cloth to be taken out there.

post #36 of 69
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dib View Post


I dont think it can be lengthened actually, i've discussed this with tailors before and they've always advised it's not really possible at this stage.

Regarding your questions above, I would advise against letting the waist out. One of your main concerns seems to be that the suit isn't slim enough and doesnt have any shape around the waist - letting the waist out is only going to exacerbate this problem obviously.

 

No, its not that I feel there is no shape, its that I feel the shape isn't right. The first photo below is what I believe is the best looking silhouette. It also graphically shows the "flow" of the outline I mentioned a few times before. The second photo is my suit jacket with what I see the silhouette being. This photo representation of my jacket silhouette is the thing I've been trying to address this whole time. Perhaps I should have just gotten into MS paint at the beginning and fixed the following photos...

 

 

 

 

 

post #37 of 69
Confine yourself to having the coat taken in at the waist, Describe your concerns about the trousers to the tailor and see if he knows what to do. However buying yourself some more appropriate shoes would help enormously with the trousers.

Then go to a better tailor in future.
post #38 of 69
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by E,TF View Post

GBR might be right about the trousers - it's not necessarily that there's too much cloth, it's just that they're not hanging correctly. In the profile shot they seem to be hugging the backs of your legs - they shouldn't do that, they should hang in a much straighter line from your ass to your to heel (see in your photo how they hang in a straight line down the front , without hugging the fronts of your legs - they should do the same at the back). I don't know how you'd go about fixing that in your example, but it may need more cloth not less, so I wouldn't just go in asking for cloth to be taken out there.
 

 

 

I'm not tailor, but perhaps the waistline(in the rear) of my trousers is too low/too much fabric makes the pants droop in the back. Perhaps this can be fixed by pulling my pants higher in the back as seen in figure A and figure B(not a long term solution). Again, I'm not a tailor, but perhaps taking fabric from figure C area would help lift the pants?

 

 

post #39 of 69
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GBR View Post

Confine yourself to having the coat taken in at the waist, Describe your concerns about the trousers to the tailor and see if he knows what to do. However buying yourself some more appropriate shoes would help enormously with the trousers.

Then go to a better tailor in future.

I have proper dress shoes at home(in the states), but not here in HK.

post #40 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by robetrw006 View Post

No, its not that I feel there is no shape, its that I feel the shape isn't right. The first photo below is what I believe is the best looking silhouette. It also graphically shows the "flow" of the outline I mentioned a few times before. The second photo is my suit jacket with what I see the silhouette being. This photo representation of my jacket silhouette is the thing I've been trying to address this whole time. Perhaps I should have just gotten into MS paint at the beginning and fixed the following photos...









Yes, I understood quite clearly what you were saying - you want the silhouette to be more waisted/more waist suppression (and that is what I meant by more "shape" - it's a pretty common way of saying the same thing).

Anyway, that obviously won't be achieved by letting more fabric out, will it? That effect is typically achieved by taking fabric away from the waist and, as i've said above, I'm not sure if there is sufficient allowance left in your suit to do this.

Do you have anyone you know personally in HK who knows about suits/tailoring etc? There's not a huge amount that can be done to the suit at this stage, but given how little you seem to know and understand about tailoring I honestly think your best bet is to take someone along with you who knows a little and who can help you talk to the tailors to see what they can do at this stage. Canvassing opinions on this thread really just seems to be confusing you further and when all is said and done, i'm not convinced it is going to equip you with the tools you need to go back to the tailors and appear as though you know what you're talking about.
post #41 of 69
I should add, if you don't have anyone you can take with you then, as GBR has said quite clearly above, you should simply go back to the tailor and:

(i) ask them if it's possible to add more waist suppression to the jacket; and
(ii) fix the bunching at the back of the trousers (I agree with GBR that this isn't going to be fixed by taking the trousers in more, but point the problem out to the tailors and see what they suggest).
post #42 of 69
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dib View Post


Yes, I understood quite clearly what you were saying - you want the silhouette to be more waisted/more waist suppression (and that is what I meant by more "shape" - it's a pretty common way of saying the same thing).

Anyway, that obviously won't be achieved by letting more fabric out, will it? That effect is typically achieved by taking fabric away from the waist and, as i've said above, I'm not sure if there is sufficient allowance left in your suit to do this.

Do you have anyone you know personally in HK who knows about suits/tailoring etc? There's not a huge amount that can be done to the suit at this stage, but given how little you seem to know and understand about tailoring I honestly think your best bet is to take someone along with you who knows a little and who can help you talk to the tailors to see what they can do at this stage. Canvassing opinions on this thread really just seems to be confusing you further and when all is said and done, i'm not convinced it is going to equip you with the tools you need to go back to the tailors and appear as though you know what you're talking about.

 

 

Yes, you're right. I'm completely new to this. First trip to the tailor and first time owning bespoke. I am the first to admit I have no well rounded idea of anything beyond the most basic concepts of tailoring, and I really mean basic. I was honestly hoping the tailor would provide a little better feedback and help me through the process a little more than they did.

 

At this point I think I may just leave the whole thing alone. Conflicting opinions and the recurring theme of "its kind of too late to do much at this point" have sort of turned me off to making any further alterations. The good news is my fiance is a Hong Konger and I'l certainly be back to HK once or twice every few years. After a job and a regular income is secured, I can just head to Simpson Sin and experience a what a better tailor has to offer. Perhaps I may even make the journey to W.W. Chan.

post #43 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by robetrw006 View Post

No, its not that I feel there is no shape, its that I feel the shape isn't right. The first photo below is what I believe is the best looking silhouette. It also graphically shows the "flow" of the outline I mentioned a few times before. The second photo is my suit jacket with what I see the silhouette being. This photo representation of my jacket silhouette is the thing I've been trying to address this whole time. Perhaps I should have just gotten into MS paint at the beginning and fixed the following photos...









Dude, this is a body issue, not a suit issue. If your body doesn't have any waist supression, its pretty difficult to get a suit that will. Sure, you can add suppression which will open the quarters and cause the button to pull, but then you'll end up with a suit that looks too tight and likely isn't comfortable.

Right now, you have a suit that fits fairly snugly to your (no offense) not at all slim body.

I think you're missing the forest through the trees. Judge the suit on how it looks on your body. Don't try to change it to look like a slim fit suit on a slim guy.
post #44 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by robetrw006 View Post


After a job and a regular income is secured, I can just head to Simpson Sin and experience a what a better tailor has to offer. Perhaps I may even make the journey to W.W. Chan.

I really fear you haven't learnt anything from this thread despite a lot of the good advice people have been offering. In particular:

(1) Going to Simpson Sin isn't going to be the magic answer to your problems. Admittedly I haven't seen a huge amount of their work, but if someone is charging HK$4,000 for a suit then they are operating at the lower end of the HK bespoke spectrum (i.e. around the same level as Empire). My general observation of tailors working in this price bracket is that they don't produce suits that look great, and on the rare occasions they do it is because the client understands tailoring and has been able to give them very detailed and accurate instructions as to what they want.

(2) I get the impression that you think if you simply go and drop a bunch of cash at a tailor and tell them roughly what you want/show them a picture, then they will do the rest and produce a great looking suit. Maybe it should be this easy, but in practice it rarely is. The reality is you need to have a good understanding of what you want and be able to articulate it. There are some tailors who left to their own devices have a good sense of style and will produce a great looking suit, but there are even more that don't (or will have taste that differs to yours) hence the need for direction.

(3) As i've mentioned before, bespoke is an iterative process that involves trial and error. This has been the case with all bespoke products I have commissioned (from shoes and ties through to shirts and suits). You won't get perfect results all of the time, and unless you are prepared to work with this risk bespoke is never really going to be well suited to you. Going to a top tailor isn't a perfect solution either (i've had chan produce some great suits for me, but also a few shockers, likewise i've seen some of the best tailors in Naples produce suits that just didn't fit their clients very well). As I say, trial and error and an element of risk.

I fear a few years down the line once you have started earning and have paid Simpson Sin or Chan a visit you will start a similar thread showing your new suit complete with colourful annotations asking why it doesn't look like the Tom Ford suit on the model that you showed to the tailor! You need to understand the limitations of bespoke and also the limitations of your own body.

My general view is that the bespoke process is never really going to live up to one's expectations (or be an enjoyable one at that) until you have thought about and understood the above issues.

Just my 2 cents to try and manage your expectations going forwards.
post #45 of 69
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dib View Post


I really fear you haven't learnt anything from this thread despite a lot of the good advice people have been offering. In particular:

(1) Going to Simpson Sin isn't going to be the magic answer to your problems. Admittedly I haven't seen a huge amount of their work, but if someone is charging HK$4,000 for a suit then they are operating at the lower end of the HK bespoke spectrum (i.e. around the same level as Empire). My general observation of tailors working in this price bracket is that they don't produce suits that look great, and on the rare occasions they do it is because the client understands tailoring and has been able to give them very detailed and accurate instructions as to what they want.

(2) I get the impression that you think if you simply go and drop a bunch of cash at a tailor and tell them roughly what you want/show them a picture, then they will do the rest and produce a great looking suit. Maybe it should be this easy, but in practice it rarely is. The reality is you need to have a good understanding of what you want and be able to articulate it. There are some tailors who left to their own devices have a good sense of style and will produce a great looking suit, but there are even more that don't (or will have taste that differs to yours) hence the need for direction.

(3) As i've mentioned before, bespoke is an iterative process that involves trial and error. This has been the case with all bespoke products I have commissioned (from shoes and ties through to shirts and suits). You won't get perfect results all of the time, and unless you are prepared to work with this risk bespoke is never really going to be well suited to you. Going to a top tailor isn't a perfect solution either (i've had chan produce some great suits for me, but also a few shockers, likewise i've seen some of the best tailors in Naples produce suits that just didn't fit their clients very well). As I say, trial and error and an element of risk.

I fear a few years down the line once you have started earning and have paid Simpson Sin or Chan a visit you will start a similar thread showing your new suit complete with colourful annotations asking why it doesn't look like the Tom Ford suit on the model that you showed to the tailor! You need to understand the limitations of bespoke and also the limitations of your own body.

My general view is that the bespoke process is never really going to live up to one's expectations (or be an enjoyable one at that) until you have thought about and understood the above issues.

Just my 2 cents to try and manage your expectations going forwards.

 

 

You mention I haven't learned anything, but I don't see anything on your list that I haven't already mentioned except for the idea that you don't always get what you pay for, which is something that goes against what others in this thread have suggested, just like much of the other suggestions. Some say take it in, others say relax it. Its hard to learn when everyone seems to have a different opinion.

 

My foremost goal here was to get suggestions on this suit in regards to ways that make it look better/fit my body type better, not a future suit. When the time comes for another suit I will certainly do a lot more reading and possibly consult this forum again, despite the polarized suggestions.

 

If you really fear I will show up again at a later date with my "colorful annotations" asking why my new tailored suit doesn't make me look 80 pounds lighter, you need to pay more attention to what I write and re-read my previous comments.

 

I have mentioned multiple times that I am a complete newbie at bespoke suits. All I came here for was advice on attempting to salvage a suit and instead I get chastised from you because I didn't "learn" things that are quite obvious such as 1) another tailor might not solve all my problems and 2) you don't always get what you pay for(which I agree with, but believe is usually untrue, at least in matters outside of tailoring).

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