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Japanese Shoes: Bespoke & RTW Super Thread - Page 33

post #481 of 3044
Are we complain about Alden quality in a Japanese shoe tread now biggrin.gif? Made in China can be good as long as you are willing to pay for it... (and know what you're getting in the first place)
post #482 of 3044
I've been living in Japan for several years now (during the time when Japanese goods were comparatively expensive), but will probably leave for my home country (the US) in 2013. I've been thinking that I might like to have some Japan-made shoes before I go. However, I'm not sure how much the sentimentalism is worth... it seems that US or British made shoes are much better quality for the price, if they're not bought in Japan (where their prices are steeply inflated). What do you guys think? How do Japanese shoes compete in this mid-range (Alden/C&J) price point? Sorry, I can never ask this directly to a Japanese person because they either know little about shoes, or I feel like I'm disrespecting them! Perhaps I am just being too stingy and should go for it without worrying.shog[1].gif
post #483 of 3044
From what I have seen, Japanese shoes are not particularly low cost, but certainly worth the price.
post #484 of 3044
Quote:
Originally Posted by nutcracker View Post

While the consumers obviously love them, these folks (from the Japanese shoe industry) seem to try making sense of it, and perhaps trying to figure out what they lack.

I think 'stigma' is something the western world created for the asian market. WIth my studying experience oversea, I believe everywhere has their own custom, so for Japan, their custom of perfectionism shall be kept, otherwise it is not Japanese.
post #485 of 3044
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by clee1982 View Post

Are we complain about Alden quality in a Japanese shoe tread now biggrin.gif? Made in China can be good as long as you are willing to pay for it... (and know what you're getting in the first place)

lol8[1].gif yes I suppose I am lol8[1].gif but I am complementing them too!!!

But you are very right. I`m not doubting Chinese craftsmen`s skills like folks at the Tianzi shoe shops in Shanghai, and if given a higher budget, I expect them to be able to show off more of what they got.

I`ve seen some quite lovely shoes being made in Laos, of all places. These are sample shoes of a Taiwanese brand that is being sold in Japan, made in Laos

CREATOR: gd-jpeg v1.0 (using IJG JPEG v62), quality = 100




from M`s Blog
Edited by nutcracker - 5/2/13 at 12:21am
post #486 of 3044
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by add911_11 View Post

I think 'stigma' is something the western world created for the asian market. WIth my studying experience oversea, I believe everywhere has their own custom, so for Japan, their custom of perfectionism shall be kept, otherwise it is not Japanese.

The Japanese are very fortunate to be perceived to have this quality intrinsic to their craft culture. Whether true or not.

I talked to a shoemaker who apprenticed both overseas and in Japan, and he said he was blown away by the obsessive nature of quality control in the Japanese factory, unseen in the Euro factory, where he says more emphasis was given to nurture the artistic sense of the apprentices.
post #487 of 3044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Makoto Chan View Post

Here are some shoes at a similar price point (around 40000yen, or $400 USD) from SHIPS, made by Hiroshi Tsubouchi. I think they keep the price low by only offering a few models in a few different leathers. I think the leather quality isn't that great, honestly, but in Japan it's a pretty good looking shoe for the price. I really like the shape. They also have cute details inside (little heart-shaped broguing).

I took some photos of a double-monk in the shop today, and I saw this: it seems they are faux-straps, with an elastic attachment so you can just slip them on and off!
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)



You can see some more pictures here, or see more just by google searching "Hiroshi Tsubouchi Ships"


Makoto-chan, I don't think that the elastic strap is so you can slip the shoe on and off without unbuckling the strap, as it would be very difficult for most people to do that, unless they had very small feet.

Rather, my understanding is that the elastic strap is there to provide a bit of "give" so that the strap on the upper leather strap isn't too stressed or stretched. I've actually seen a picture of a pair of double monks where the upper strap ripped due to too much strain and clearly the elastic strap helps to avoid that (as the strain is probably greatest during the buckling and unbuckling, rather than during the actual wearing of the shoe).

I have a pair of Santoni double monks with the same elastic attachment for the buckle, and I know that the Crockett & Jones Lowndes double monk uses an elastic strap, too.
post #488 of 3044
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Makoto Chan View Post

There's a shoe shop in Osaka called "Old Hat" that offers MTM shoes and boots for a similar price, about 40000 yen, or $400. I thought the shoes looked very good in person. I don't recall the maker unfortunately, but I do remember that they are "made in Tohoku," which is the same region that Miyagi Kogyo shoes are made. The owner of the shop in Osaka was trained in the UK and speaks very good English. He's also a super nice and helpful guy. Here's a google-translated webpage.


Theres also an OLD HAT store in Harajuku Tokyo, that place is crazy, filled with everything UK, saw some vintage suits of 1930`s in mint? condition lol8[1].gif
Yeah not sure where their MTO shoes are made, but maybe its Miyagi Kogyo,
Quote:
Originally Posted by Makoto Chan View Post

I've been living in Japan for several years now (during the time when Japanese goods were comparatively expensive), but will probably leave for my home country (the US) in 2013. I've been thinking that I might like to have some Japan-made shoes before I go. However, I'm not sure how much the sentimentalism is worth... it seems that US or British made shoes are much better quality for the price, if they're not bought in Japan (where their prices are steeply inflated). What do you guys think? How do Japanese shoes compete in this mid-range (Alden/C&J) price point? Sorry, I can never ask this directly to a Japanese person because they either know little about shoes, or I feel like I'm disrespecting them! Perhaps I am just being too stingy and should go for it without worrying.shog[1].gif

For mid-range, like ¥50K, I won`t dare say Japanese shoes are better than Alden or C&J. However, they do offer something different, in my opinion. Take Miyagi Kogyo RTW shoes for example (now available in Osaka`s Mitsukoshi Isetan!!!!). Their Dover-lookalike I posted before, looks like an English knockoff at first right? However, the last used on those shoes are quite peculiar. It is inspired by ALDEN`s dress comfort last like the Modified, and thus is banana~shaped. These may look English, but the fit may actually be closer to American shoes. Quite fascinating.
post #489 of 3044
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Makoto Chan View Post

There's a shoe shop in Osaka called "Old Hat" that offers MTM shoes and boots for a similar price, about 40000 yen, or $400. I thought the shoes looked very good in person. I don't recall the maker unfortunately, but I do remember that they are "made in Tohoku," which is the same region that Miyagi Kogyo shoes are made. The owner of the shop in Osaka was trained in the UK and speaks very good English. He's also a super nice and helpful guy. Here's a google-translated webpage.

Yeah, Mr.Takai, the shop keeper and repair magician, apprenticed under James Amesbury in UK. Along with all kinds of standard repair services, he can also re-welt Bespoke/handsewn welted shoes.
post #490 of 3044
Quote:
Originally Posted by nutcracker View Post

lol8[1].gif yes I suppose I am lol8[1].gif but I am complementing them too!!!

But you are very right. I`m not doubting Chinese craftsmen`s skills like folks at the Tianzi shoe shops in Shanghai, and if given a higher budget, I expect them to be able to show off more of what they got.

I`ve seen some quite lovely shoes being made in Laos, of all places. These are sample shoes of a Taiwanese brand that is being sold in Japan, made in Laos

CREATOR: gd-jpeg v1.0 (using IJG JPEG v62), quality = 100




from M`s Blog

Those looks very nice, where I can get my hands on outside Japan?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nutcracker View Post

The Japanese are very fortunate to be perceived to have this quality intrinsic to their craft culture. Whether true or not.

I talked to a shoemaker who apprenticed both overseas and in Japan, and he said he was blown away by the obsessive nature of quality control in the Japanese factory, unseen in the Euro factory, where he says more emphasis was given to nurture the artistic sense of the apprentices.

The QC factor in Japan is something good to be kept. Both world has its own strengths and weaknesses, however, from a customer point of view, Japanese bespoke shoes are a better package than the British once. I guess it is just the part of culture.

On a side note, back in the days, japanese electronic are made in a very high standard. My home telephone is brought from Japanese after the first wave of cordless handhelds, it has been at least 15 years and we are still using it. I think our family swap televisions more frequently than home phone.
post #491 of 3044
Quote:
Originally Posted by nutcracker View Post

lol8[1].gif yes I suppose I am lol8[1].gif but I am complementing them too!!!

But you are very right. I`m not doubting Chinese craftsmen`s skills like folks at the Tianzi shoe shops in Shanghai, and if given a higher budget, I expect them to be able to show off more of what they got.

I`ve seen some quite lovely shoes being made in Laos, of all places. These are sample shoes of a Taiwanese brand that is being sold in Japan, made in Laos

CREATOR: gd-jpeg v1.0 (using IJG JPEG v62), quality = 100




from M`s Blog

What brand?
post #492 of 3044

il Micio by Hidetaka Fukaya

The Usual Suspects

 

http://beijing1980.tumblr.com/post/49345103620/il-micio

 

post #493 of 3044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fang66 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by nutcracker View Post

lol8[1].gif yes I suppose I am lol8[1].gif but I am complementing them too!!!

But you are very right. I`m not doubting Chinese craftsmen`s skills like folks at the Tianzi shoe shops in Shanghai, and if given a higher budget, I expect them to be able to show off more of what they got.

I`ve seen some quite lovely shoes being made in Laos, of all places. These are sample shoes of a Taiwanese brand that is being sold in Japan, made in Laos

CREATOR: gd-jpeg v1.0 (using IJG JPEG v62), quality = 100




from M`s Blog

What brand?

 

Is this the same one with the brand name with the meaning of "Godhand masterpiece" or "Divine Craftsmanship"? Is it pronounced "Shinsho"? I suspect the one what I mean here is basically the same factory as the one sold in US from one of SF sponsor.
post #494 of 3044
Quote:
Originally Posted by nutcracker View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Makoto Chan View Post

There's a shoe shop in Osaka called "Old Hat" that offers MTM shoes and boots for a similar price, about 40000 yen, or $400. I thought the shoes looked very good in person. I don't recall the maker unfortunately, but I do remember that they are "made in Tohoku," which is the same region that Miyagi Kogyo shoes are made. The owner of the shop in Osaka was trained in the UK and speaks very good English. He's also a super nice and helpful guy. Here's a google-translated webpage.


Theres also an OLD HAT store in Harajuku Tokyo, that place is crazy, filled with everything UK, saw some vintage suits of 1930`s in mint? condition lol8[1].gif
Yeah not sure where their MTO shoes are made, but maybe its Miyagi Kogyo,
Quote:
Originally Posted by Makoto Chan View Post

I've been living in Japan for several years now (during the time when Japanese goods were comparatively expensive), but will probably leave for my home country (the US) in 2013. I've been thinking that I might like to have some Japan-made shoes before I go. However, I'm not sure how much the sentimentalism is worth... it seems that US or British made shoes are much better quality for the price, if they're not bought in Japan (where their prices are steeply inflated). What do you guys think? How do Japanese shoes compete in this mid-range (Alden/C&J) price point? Sorry, I can never ask this directly to a Japanese person because they either know little about shoes, or I feel like I'm disrespecting them! Perhaps I am just being too stingy and should go for it without worrying.shog[1].gif

For mid-range, like ¥50K, I won`t dare say Japanese shoes are better than Alden or C&J. However, they do offer something different, in my opinion. Take Miyagi Kogyo RTW shoes for example (now available in Osaka`s Mitsukoshi Isetan!!!!). Their Dover-lookalike I posted before, looks like an English knockoff at first right? However, the last used on those shoes are quite peculiar. It is inspired by ALDEN`s dress comfort last like the Modified, and thus is banana~shaped. These may look English, but the fit may actually be closer to American shoes. Quite fascinating.


You are such a knowledgeable man.  I did not know about the last of  Miyagi.  Where in Tokyo can I see the better range of Miyagi?  I believe there are some grades among their offer.

post #495 of 3044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Makoto Chan View Post

I've been living in Japan for several years now (during the time when Japanese goods were comparatively expensive), but will probably leave for my home country (the US) in 2013. I've been thinking that I might like to have some Japan-made shoes before I go. However, I'm not sure how much the sentimentalism is worth... it seems that US or British made shoes are much better quality for the price, if they're not bought in Japan (where their prices are steeply inflated). What do you guys think? How do Japanese shoes compete in this mid-range (Alden/C&J) price point? Sorry, I can never ask this directly to a Japanese person because they either know little about shoes, or I feel like I'm disrespecting them! Perhaps I am just being too stingy and should go for it without worrying.shog[1].gif

 

For CJ, Alden price point, Ohtsuka M-5 or Miyagi are good candidates.   You can see and try Ohtsuka M-5 on at their shop in Roppongi Hills.  I hear both Ohtsuka and Miyagi have various grades, so I think you should look for the better one.  M-5 is not sold at department store I think. 

 

I love Alden.  Each country has its own tradition and flavor and it is one of the reason I enjoy this hobby.

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