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Is my Barbour x TO KI TO Driving Jacket a fake?

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 
I'll include pictures if it will help, but I'm not really sure what parts of the jacket you will need to see. It's my first Barbour jacket, so I'm not sure what to look for. I emailed and am awaiting a reply from Barbour.

I recently purchased a Barbour x Tokito Driving Jacket from Ebay, pre-owned but without much wear.

Why I think it might be a fake:

1. The large Beacon Heritage patch which is usually on the inside backs of the Tokito jackets isn't there. Actually, I can't find any mention of TO KI TO anywhere on the jacket, though all of the other typical Barbour patches appear to be in their proper places.

2. The lining is not removable, though I have seen it listed as being removable in other places for this same style, I believe. What's even stranger is that it is possible to button down the bottom of the liner, as if you were going to remove it, but it's stitched in quite a lot along the sides and once in the arm hole or the arm on each side.

3. The collar closure has holes on the one side for a buckle-prong. The buckle mechanism isn't with a prong, but a sort of sliding clasp. It still works and everything, but I thought the mis-match was strange.

4.I believe the seller bought it on the Asian market (I think he said he bought it from Rakuten...but then, maybe they didn't have Beacon Heritage patches on those jackets, or it was a sample?)

I am contemplating returning it for a couple of reasons, besides possibly being fake:

1. The jacket is the Rustic version instead of the Olive version I was expecting (the seller used various product images, the most clear of which was in Olive; only one was actually his coat, which looked like it could have been either)

2. The lining was listed in the auction as being removable. It isn't. This is really the only thing I have to stand on in regards to the return, besides perhaps the clasp not being the same as it was pictured. It is kind of a big deal as I was hoping to be able to be able to wear it in slightly warmer weather.

That said, everything about it feels great. The double zipper gave me an issue when I first got it, but that's about the only thing that doesn't seem to work really great about it. Myself and the seller, who has had other experience with Barbour, both find it odd someone would go through the trouble of faking something so well and would just leave off a patch on the back. He's been phenomenal about the whole thing and I have no reason to believe he purposely sold me something wrong, but neither one of us really know what to look for in regards to it being a fake.

Any advice is welcome.
post #2 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by otacon View Post

I'll include pictures if it will help, but I'm not really sure what parts of the jacket you will need to see. It's my first Barbour jacket, so I'm not sure what to look for. I emailed and am awaiting a reply from Barbour.

I recently purchased a Barbour x Tokito Driving Jacket from Ebay, pre-owned but without much wear.

Why I think it might be a fake:

1. The large Beacon Heritage patch which is usually on the inside backs of the Tokito jackets isn't there. Actually, I can't find any mention of TO KI TO anywhere on the jacket, though all of the other typical Barbour patches appear to be in their proper places.

2. The lining is not removable, though I have seen it listed as being removable in other places for this same style, I believe. What's even stranger is that it is possible to button down the bottom of the liner, as if you were going to remove it, but it's stitched in quite a lot along the sides and once in the arm hole or the arm on each side.

3. The collar closure has holes on the one side for a buckle-prong. The buckle mechanism isn't with a prong, but a sort of sliding clasp. It still works and everything, but I thought the mis-match was strange.

4.I believe the seller bought it on the Asian market (I think he said he bought it from Rakuten...but then, maybe they didn't have Beacon Heritage patches on those jackets, or it was a sample?)

I am contemplating returning it for a couple of reasons, besides possibly being fake:

1. The jacket is the Rustic version instead of the Olive version I was expecting (the seller used various product images, the most clear of which was in Olive; only one was actually his coat, which looked like it could have been either)

2. The lining was listed in the auction as being removable. It isn't. This is really the only thing I have to stand on in regards to the return, besides perhaps the clasp not being the same as it was pictured. It is kind of a big deal as I was hoping to be able to be able to wear it in slightly warmer weather.

That said, everything about it feels great. The double zipper gave me an issue when I first got it, but that's about the only thing that doesn't seem to work really great about it. Myself and the seller, who has had other experience with Barbour, both find it odd someone would go through the trouble of faking something so well and would just leave off a patch on the back. He's been phenomenal about the whole thing and I have no reason to believe he purposely sold me something wrong, but neither one of us really know what to look for in regards to it being a fake.

Any advice is welcome.

 

Put up photos and the listing. 

 

Maybe someone merge this with the Barbour thread?

post #3 of 15
Thread Starter 
Listing: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Barbour-Tokito-Driving-Jacket-size-M-Beacon-Heritage-Collection-coat-/290844789502?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT&nma=true&si=oMGdu%252BENR%252BWOEZlj%252FrIJTEDmPTM%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

pics:

1. Jacket opened, displaying the lack of Beacon Heritage patch



2. Buckle/clasp for neck closure



3. Barbour care tag



4. Jacket opened, lining down



5. Jacket opened, lining up (notice the buttons where it connects)



6. Jacket opened, lining up, unbuttoned



7. Lining underside, near the neck (stitching detail)



8. Double zipper



9. Barbour tag (those crowns look a little funny to me)



10. Another picture for varying detail



11. White from inside pocket, side 1



12. White tag from inside pocket, side 2



13. More stitching detail (that's really ugly carpet in the corner, not the jacket)



14. The liner, connected to the corduroy/lapel



15. Neck closure (notice the wholes for a pronged buckle on the longer, skinnier end)



16. Another picture of the Barbour tag
post #4 of 15
Hard to tell - I looked at mine and it looks like what you have as a liner is the inner liner attached to the coat. My inner liner has the same label as yours and the "Original Tartan" tag. My zip out liner has the ToKiTo label sewn in and zips out. It is the same fabric as the inner liner and only goes half way down while the inner liner is full length. You may be missing the zip out liner?

The neck closure does look a little strange. Mine has no holes and is attached to a double D ring to close.

Pocket tags look very similar.
post #5 of 15
Thread Starter 
Would it be possible to get a picture of that? I'll look at some images online to see if I can find where that extra zipper is, but I am pretty certain mine does not have it.
post #6 of 15
I'll give it a try.

First pick is with liner in.

Second pick is with the liner out

Third pick is side shot with zipper

Fourth pick is just liner when zipped out






Your "inner" liner (if that's what it is) is different from mine as mine does not have the button on the bottom - it is just sewn in all around. Also - I can't tell from your picks but my zip out liner has zippers on both sides of the jacket but also a button tab at the top above the label.
post #7 of 15

Bertie getting here before me.  Here's my take on it.  Oh wait.  Let me ask, are there zippers to add another lining?  On the sides of the inside?  Because on a couple of my To Ki To's from this year it's the zip out liner that has the Barbour Beacon tag, so when the liner is zipped out the coat doesn't have that tag on it. 

 

Second thought, and now looking at the pics I think this could be the case, is that it's early To Ki To and they didn't use the Barbour Beacon at that time.  I just discovered the line this year, but I think it started in 08.  Maybe they didn't have Barbour Beacon tags back then.  Your pic 12 has 08/09 on it and I know some companies do put what year/season and year the garment is from. 

 

At the end of the day did you contact Barbour?  You might want to try that.  Anyway, I think you have enough to stand on for a return.  Hopefully you haven't left feedback yet.  Anyway, I would move quickly. 

 

One more thing, do you see any tag anywhere, in a pocket even, that says something like "MW96451651"?  The AW12 Collection all have a specific style number and when I've done searches I've just typed in that number.  So if you coat has a tag like that you might be able to do a search and see what comes up. 

post #8 of 15

I hope you didn't pay good money for this thing....

It looks like an older model to me, not sure about a fake.

post #9 of 15
My guess is sample or more likely older model.
post #10 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bertie View Post

I'll give it a try.

First pick is with liner in.

Second pick is with the liner out

Third pick is side shot with zipper

Fourth pick is just liner when zipped out






Your "inner" liner (if that's what it is) is different from mine as mine does not have the button on the bottom - it is just sewn in all around. Also - I can't tell from your picks but my zip out liner has zippers on both sides of the jacket but also a button tab at the top above the label.

Thanks a lot. No, there isn't a zipper on the one I have, so it's not made to accept a zip-out liner like yours is. Does yours have a little thing to pull across and button at your waist, inside of the jacket? If you visit the ebay listing, you can see it on some of the pics.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BLAUGRANA View Post

Bertie getting here before me.  Here's my take on it.  Oh wait.  Let me ask, are there zippers to add another lining?  On the sides of the inside?  Because on a couple of my To Ki To's from this year it's the zip out liner that has the Barbour Beacon tag, so when the liner is zipped out the coat doesn't have that tag on it. 

Second thought, and now looking at the pics I think this could be the case, is that it's early To Ki To and they didn't use the Barbour Beacon at that time.  I just discovered the line this year, but I think it started in 08.  Maybe they didn't have Barbour Beacon tags back then.  Your pic 12 has 08/09 on it and I know some companies do put what year/season and year the garment is from. 

At the end of the day did you contact Barbour?  You might want to try that.  Anyway, I think you have enough to stand on for a return.  Hopefully you haven't left feedback yet.  Anyway, I would move quickly. 

One more thing, do you see any tag anywhere, in a pocket even, that says something like "MW96451651"?  The AW12 Collection all have a specific style number and when I've done searches I've just typed in that number.  So if you coat has a tag like that you might be able to do a search and see what comes up. 

Didn't find a serial number that long, but there is a554 medium 27391 on one of them.

I'm looking into it being an older model. Seems like it's a winning theory, as the Beacon Heritage patch doesn't seem to have remained stationary, and I'm beginning to wonder if Barbour would have even put it on every single one of them the first year.

I emailed barbour. She said she couldn't tell from the pictures, but if it were to be sent in they could figure it out.

Thanks!
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManofKent View Post

My guess is sample or more likely older model.

This might be true. The seller actually suggested it might be a sample, because there is absolutely nothing quality wise to suggest it isn't authentic (well, except maybe the zipper, but that could just be a zipper being a zipper). It's a really great coat that I'm still contemplating keeping, even though it wasn't exactly what I wanted.
post #11 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by otacon View Post

Thanks a lot. No, there isn't a zipper on the one I have, so it's not made to accept a zip-out liner like yours is. Does yours have a little thing to pull across and button at your waist, inside of the jacket? If you visit the ebay listing, you can see it on some of the pics.

No inner little pull thing on mine - got a couple of external tabs with two snaps per side to tighten the waist. If I suck my gut in i can almost fasten them:)
post #12 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bertie View Post

No inner little pull thing on mine - got a couple of external tabs with two snaps per side to tighten the waist. If I suck my gut in i can almost fasten them:)

Haha. That's neat. Mine's got elastic cord running through the waist and another on the bottom, with draw-string pinch-things (no idea what they're called). Let's me internally tighten up, which is nice. I think mine is cut a little wider than their typical medium (at least these days), but I could be mistaken.
post #13 of 15
ToKiTo is way slimmer than regular Barbour. I'm swimming in regular but look slim (sausage like?) in the ToKiTi. I really like the fit.
post #14 of 15

I'm guessing it's just older To Ki To.  Looks Barbour either way.  Never seen/heard of Barbour samples floating around either. 

post #15 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bertie View Post

ToKiTo is way slimmer than regular Barbour. I'm swimming in regular but look slim (sausage like?) in the ToKiTi. I really like the fit.

I meant slimmer than the typical tokito of today, going off measurements I've gotten from the sport jacket. Regular Barbour sizing actually kind of scares me. I'd probably drown in a medium and get swallowed by a large.

I worked out a partial refund with the seller. Great guy, glad he was willing to hear me out.
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