BMW Z3 opinions needed please

Hmmm... I was going to suggest you consider carefully the utility of a roadster as a sole vehicle but you have had a motorbike for a while so that point is moot. Of couse this coming from someone who did not buy a Miata because he could not fit his martial arts gear in the boot. I would say look in to reliability, service costs, parts availability and the like. Out of warranty BMW are not the cheapest vehicles to run afaik. I would also assume that somewhere there are some fora on the Z roadsters themselves. It would be very valuable to know what to look for as far as common problems and warning signs that are specific to the model. Plus being a lower volume vehicle will make it all even harder...

I drive a '98 2.8L Z3 and love every second of it. Here's the thing, it's not a Miata and it's obviously not a Taurus. You already know what you're getting into with a roadster as an only car, so I won't harp on that. Besides, the top goes down and you can fit an OK sized table in the passenger seat if you're creative. The Z3 doesn't exactly drive like it's on rails, nor does it feel playful and tossable. It does have outstanding BMW steering and brakes and the shifter is legitimately a joy to use. The engine is big, more than you really need, but the car is (relatively) heavy. And I like to drive fast, so the big engine is cool with me. Back roads are a LOT of fun. Germany is covered by a beautiful spiderweb of well maintained twisty country roads that cross hill and dale; that's what the Z3 is built for. Not getting around the track the fastest, not the fastest off the line, and not pushing a whining 10000 RPM redline like the S2000. It does all those things well, but not the best. It has a relatively comfortable ride. It sucks ass in the snow, any snow at all. Put it all together in a sexy beast package and trust me, chicks dig it. Words of caution on the older models...I replaced all the brake rotors at about 7 years/55k miles. Tires shortly after. After sitting out in the weather for a year while I was deployed, the rubber lining over the windows started to leak a bit in the rain. Both front headlights burnt out at about 9 years/64k miles. BMW dealerships rape you on labor but not parts. That's it, that's all. No major mechanical problems or electronics problems, no breaking down...well, yet, for me. Drive it in good health my friend. Tom

I was in your situation this time last year, considering buying a used z3. After I test drove both the z3 and a new z4, the decision had been made. I now have just under 7k miles on a new z4 3.0 and really love the car. The payments are decent and any service issues are covered 100%. Steer clear of the z3, for a little bit more $$$ you are getting so much more car.

MrR

The 2.8L engines have some maintenance issues that you should be aware of: the water pumps either seize or break a bit before 100K miles. The radiator neck also tends to break. The engine thermostat likes to break, too. This may affect the price depending whether the previous owner's taken care of them. BMW shocks also tend to be done before 100K miles.

--Andre

This doesn't sound as exciting as a '60s-'70s Porsche.

Andre, thanks for the info. Do you know if that goes for both Euro and American models? I think they share most of their guts so I'll have to keep an eye on those issues. Tom

Tom,

Yes, same issues for both models. Most people do the radiator and water pump preventively, and the latest thermostats seem to be lasting well now. Shocks aren't too important as they degrade pretty gradually, but you will definitely notice the difference when you put new ones in. The rear shock mounts tend to die very quickly, too, but there are aftermarket ones that will last for a long time. Other than that, if you keep on top of the regular maintenance, the cars are rock solid.

--Andre

Great, thanks. My quarterly car budget was blown by the roof repairs but with relatively few miles on the car, I have some room to fudge.

Due respect to Tom, but I'm not a fan at all. I love the way they look, and based solely on that thought I would buy one when I moved back to the States for grad school. Then I drove one. As Tom wrote, it's no Miata. (That's what I drive now, though at the time I decided that I was better served by a coupe and bought a mid-80s vintage Alfa GTV-6 that promptly rusted out from under me in two Boston winters...) It basically drives like a BMW E30 cabrio with a lot less chassis rigidity and a little bit more inertia. The 1.8L engine sounds and feels agricultural, which combined with the handling and fit/finish makes it perhaps a much truer-to-pattern better retro Brit roadster than the Miata. All of the Sixes all give adequate power with that lovely BMW velvety straight six smoothness, albeit as AY has mentioned not always without consequence. The M-Roadster is probably the most American-feeling car BMW has ever done, with the comparatively crude chassis totally overwhelmed by the engine and the outsized gumballs. If you've always dreamed of a big block Camaro but want something with more perceived class, the M-Roadster would be a perfect fit.The interior in all Z3's, including the M, is a big letdown in terms of quality, and there are many off-putting build shortcuts taken in South Carolina, such as the clearcoat stopping at the hood/bonnet rather than covering the engine side of the fenders as well. Also, you mentioned music, and the Z3's stereo really, really sucks. Even the stock Bose junk in the Miata sounds better, though either way I'd think a serious listener would rip out the whole system. What I've done to make my Miata more listenable is a simple system: 80GB iPod, Nakamichi CD stacker head unit with iPod input, a compact and lightweight Class-D amp from Alpine, and a pair of vintage Israeli-made Morel Integra 8" coaxials in the doors with Alpine (made by the Danish firm Vifa) ring radiator supertweeters in place of the stock speaker complement with simple capacitor filters - sounds pretty darned good for what it is. It's not as good sounding as a Volvo C70 cabrio, which has a really great stereo, but it works well and adds little mass to the car. Honestly, the Miata is a better roadster and a better car as well. The interior (on the top-line models up to 2003; the 2003-6 were downgraded with cheap grey plastic replacing chromed parts for inner doorpulls and so on) is better finished and more stylish. (Especially if you get a 2000 or 2001 Special Edition with the delectable wood Nardi steering wheel and shift knob.) The cabin has more space. The chassis is just set up better, especially the Sport models (look for yellow Bilstein shocks) and the turbo one. And even the trunk's marginally bigger. Miata tops are expensive too, though. Mine was recently knifed and an OEM replacement (done by probably the world's top Miata shop, R-Speed) was about $1700 all in. One thing I will give the Z3 is that I think it's sexy as hell. Even after being around for well over a decade. But if I had to have a German prestige roadster, I'd pick a TT. It doesn't drive any worse than the BMW, has that interior design, and repairs should be cheaper because it's just a beautiful body on top of the "cooking" platform and running gear of the Mk. IV Golf. PS: The way to fix a twitchy Miata is to get a decent street alignment on it. If it's set up to twist through cones, it won't be at its best for street driving.

just get an Echo. dang.

13 inch steel wheels RULE!

For what it's worth, I would take a late model MR2 Spyder over a Z3 without question. From when I was 16 to 20, my dad had a 2000 MR2 and one of my good friends had Z3. I can tell you without hesitation the MR2 was the better drive in every way I can think of (save maybe a bit better low-end in the Z3 engine). The transmissions are pretty equal, the brakes on the MR2 superior and exceptional by any road-car standard. The MR2 isn't as prestigious, practical (the mid-engined MR2 has more unconventional storage), and you can debate the looks (they're about even to me). The handling, however, is in another class. Anyone with experience with a mid-engined car will agree that there's simply nothing like having the weight in the back. The car has a go-cart feel that few mass-market cars can equal. I would think the maintenance (and probably tires for the smaller wheels) would be far less as well. The MR2 interior, while less upscale in appearance, aged better as well. At least drive one first, because I can't see how a car enthusiast wouldn't recognize the better handling after the first corner. I'd probably take a newish Miata over an old Z3 if I had to go front-engined. The Z3 was just never a great handling car in it's class, IMO, and you can do far better for the money. Here's a MR2 vs. Miata circa 2000 comparison: http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...r2-spyder.html

The MR-2 Spyder is indeed a very nice little machine. Aftermarket is so-so on it but the engine is reliable and used across many Toyota vehicles (including Celica GT, Corolla XR and Matrix XR). Oh, and there is the option of dropping the 2ZZGE engine in it (the one used by Lotus - 180 bhp with around 2300 lbs to propel ).