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Official: STAR WARS THREAD. These are the droids you're looking for. **WARNING MAY CONTAIN SPOILERS!** - Page 107

post #1591 of 2848

Finally saw it last night and found my way here via Jasper's review (which I pretty much agreed with)

 

Some assorted impressions:


 

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

I thought the new cast were great.  Ridley in particular.

 

My favorite moments paying homage to the originals were when the new characters interacted with the old stuff (Rey's vision of the corridor on Cloud City after touching Luke's lightsaber gave me chills; Finn wrestling with the Falcon's gun turret was funny).  I wished they'd exercised some restraint and left it to a few moments like this instead of giving us Episode IV's plot rehashed and countless straight visual quotations (like having a mini trench run complete with the gun towers...ugh).

 

Snoke is a horrendous name for a villain. What were they thinking?

 

For all the hype about practical effects there was still an awful lot of Bad CGI  (Snoke and the Rathar tentacle monsters being the most egregious examples).

 

All of the weapon and vehicle effects were pretty great, though.

 

Retconning Hyperspeed so you can jump from/to anywhere you damn please (out of a hanger, right into planetary atmosphere) pissed off my inner nerd.

 

So many plot points occur in an absurdly convenient manner, often with the effect of making an apparently huge universe feel a lot smaller.

 

The 'Map to find Luke' was a really weak MacGuffin.

 

Rey's introductory scene where she's scavenging the derelict Star Destroyer was totally awesome (and I wish they used less of it in the trailer).

 

Out of the new characters I had the most issue with Finn (most people seem to have more problems with Rey / Kylo).  Why? Well from the first scene his character is already set, there's no development or nuance in the way he abandons the First Order for the Resistance.  He goes straight from not being able to kill villagers to willingly blasting away his stormtrooper comrades "because its the right thing to do" even though they are the only people and ideology he has known since childhood.  He also manages to choose the most difficult and unlikely to succeed manner of defecting possible (freeing Poe and escaping a Star Destroyer) making his defection all the more jarring.  I was expecting it to be something like he returns to Jakku or some other planet still a stormtrooper and the rest of his platoon gets killed off leaving him alone and conflicted, or he faces Rey / BB-8 and finds he can't kill/capture them and ends up helping them instead.  I felt like the 'Stromtrooper gone rogue' character had tons of potential but didn't quite work (even though I thought Boyega was good).

 

Hamill looked great as a bearded Druid-like figure on his little Irish island.

 

I really, really don't want Rey to be Luke's daughter but I have a feeling I'll be disappointed.

 

I can totally see the sequel playing out with Luke training Rey while Kylo consolidates his power and searches for them, setting a confrontation at the end, ie. echoing the Empire Strikes Back story arc.  I really hope they deviate from that though.

 

 

 

 

 

post #1592 of 2848
It's like poetry it rhymes.
post #1593 of 2848
^ See, that's why I can't accept that EP 8 and ESB will be completely separate movies that don't mimic the same beats. After all, ANH ended almost exactly like TFA: Empire/First Order suffering a critical blow which will lead to them "striking back",, Rey off to train like Luke with Yoda ending with a confrontation with Ben,, more little winks and nods to the OT and maybe throw the PT a bone,, etc.


What would be hilarious is if they completely subverted nerds expectations and time-jumped 3 years later with Luke basically telling Rey to fuck off and she's been back in Jaakuu scavenging junk with Chewbacca.
post #1594 of 2848
Thread Starter 
Saw it the second time last night and picked up on some interesting things:
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
I suspected it before but it was much more clear the 2nd time around. Kylo is all but toying with Finn in the light saber battle at the end. It puts a lot of context to the battle and goes some way towards answering the criticisms @LA Guy and others had of it. While I still don't have an issue with Finn briefly standing his ground with a novice dark side user who had just been shot in the gut with a weapon that had been repeatedly shown to knock stormtroppers on their asses, I believe the intention of the scene was that Kylo could have taken him out any time he wished.

When Rey gets the lightsaber there is a shot of Kylo's face were he forms a slight smile. Driver is an excellent actor and I can only think this was an intentional hint given to the audience. It's all the more obvious he knows her from his past and I interpreted this scene as almost a sign of pride.

The star fighter battle at the end still didn't do much for me. I realized on the 2nd viewing that part of the problem is how small it felt. There couldn't have been more then 30 x-wings flying to battle and not a lot really happened. The sense of momentum wasn't there to captivate the audience.
post #1595 of 2848
Quote:
Originally Posted by Graemsay View Post

I disagree, Rey working on the Falcon in the opening shot would be a bit too on the nose.


Besides, the "garbage ship" sequence is my favourite scene in the movie, and you'd lose that.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorcan7 View Post

Finally saw it last night and found my way here via Jasper's review (which I pretty much agreed with)

Some assorted impressions:


  Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
I thought the new cast were great.  Ridley in particular.

My favorite moments paying homage to the originals were when the new characters interacted with the old stuff (Rey's vision of the corridor on Cloud City after touching Luke's lightsaber gave me chills; Finn wrestling with the Falcon's gun turret was funny).  I wished they'd exercised some restraint and left it to a few moments like this instead of giving us Episode IV's plot rehashed and countless straight visual quotations (like having a mini trench run complete with the gun towers...ugh).

Snoke is a horrendous name for a villain. What were they thinking?

For all the hype about practical effects there was still an awful lot of Bad CGI  (Snoke and the Rathar tentacle monsters being the most egregious examples).

All of the weapon and vehicle effects were pretty great, though.

Retconning Hyperspeed so you can jump from/to anywhere you damn please (out of a hanger, right into planetary atmosphere) pissed off my inner nerd.

So many plot points occur in an absurdly convenient manner, often with the effect of making an apparently huge universe feel a lot smaller.

The 'Map to find Luke' was a really weak MacGuffin.

Rey's introductory scene where she's scavenging the derelict Star Destroyer was totally awesome (and I wish they used less of it in the trailer).

Out of the new characters I had the most issue with Finn (most people seem to have more problems with Rey / Kylo).  Why? Well from the first scene his character is already set, there's no development or nuance in the way he abandons the First Order for the Resistance.  He goes straight from not being able to kill villagers to willingly blasting away his stormtrooper comrades "because its the right thing to do" even though they are the only people and ideology he has known since childhood.  He also manages to choose the most difficult and unlikely to succeed manner of defecting possible (freeing Poe and escaping a Star Destroyer) making his defection all the more jarring.  I was expecting it to be something like he returns to Jakku or some other planet still a stormtrooper and the rest of his platoon gets killed off leaving him alone and conflicted, or he faces Rey / BB-8 and finds he can't kill/capture them and ends up helping them instead.  I felt like the 'Stromtrooper gone rogue' character had tons of potential but didn't quite work (even though I thought Boyega was good).

Hamill looked great as a bearded Druid-like figure on his little Irish island.

I really, really don't want Rey to be Luke's daughter but I have a feeling I'll be disappointed.

I can totally see the sequel playing out with Luke training Rey while Kylo consolidates his power and searches for them, setting a confrontation at the end, ie. echoing the Empire Strikes Back story arc.  I really hope they deviate from that though.




Small quibble: Finn isn't cool with blasting his former buddies "because it's he right thing to do". That's just the BS he says. He does it because he's hoping to get his darksaber wet, which is eat more realistic.
post #1596 of 2848
I forgot to mention the biggest thing I hated in the film. And that is the appearance of fatman Greg Grunberg. The fact that JJ made this tub of lard an X-Wing pilot is a sin on par with making Jar Jar Binks a senator in Attack of the Clones.
post #1597 of 2848
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lawyerdad View Post


Small quibble: Finn isn't cool with blasting his former buddies "because it's he right thing to do". That's just the BS he says. He does it because he's hoping to get his darksaber wet, which is eat more realistic.


Hah. Well it's clear he likes Rey. It may seem superficial to some but this is a man who was stolen from his family as a young child and put into a brainwashing program by space Nazis. Rey and Poe are the first people in his life to show him kindness. He says so much with the line about how she looks at his eyes. Of course he's going to get attached to her and switch to protection mode. She validates him as a man and not a (literal) number.
post #1598 of 2848
Quote:
Originally Posted by lawyerdad View Post



Small quibble: Finn isn't cool with blasting his former buddies "because it's he right thing to do". That's just the BS he says. He does it because he's hoping to get his darksaber wet, which is eat more realistic.

 

Hmm maybe, but he hasn't met Rey at that point, no?  Or was even aware of her existence.  If he met Rey and then was like 'screw this First Order crap' then yeah fair enough. Also if Captain Phasma is any indication the First Order was not without a female presence.  Unless you're suggesting he had eyes for the dashing Mr Poe?

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Reeves View Post

It's like poetry it rhymes.

 

I probably should have just written a Haiku review now you mention it.

post #1599 of 2848
Thread Starter 
The breaking point for Finn was when his friend dies. It's clear he's never been in a battle before and that moment takes a lifetime of resentment towards being forced to work for these people and pushes him over the edge. Why did he choose to use Poe as a means of escape? What other options did he have at the time? He was desperate and well aware that Phasma was onto the fact he disobeyed orders to shoot at the villagers. Honestly this is all spelled out for you in the film.

Yes the first order had other females in it. Females raised from birth in the same brainwashing program he was put into.
post #1600 of 2848
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jr Mouse View Post

Well the original plan was for Poe to die in the crash. JJ has said he liked the character and the actor so much he changed plans. I could see it bothering some people but it's not like we saw the body. At the end of the day the fact that Poe and Finn worked so well in their scenes together that I'm willing to overlook it happening offstage, as you say.

I've got issues with the film. Some I've said before. A few I've yet to get into. That really wasn't one of them.

The larger point we disagree on is things always need to happen onstage. They really don't. In fact this can often drag a film to a snail pace when it does.

I don't disagree that a lot has to occur offstage.  I mean, this is not Nady Warhol filming the Empire State Building for 7 hours or whatever it was.  That said, I think that important plots started onstage should not occur offstage.  

 

I think that your post above actually supports what I wrote - that the Poe storyline seems rushed and unfinished - makes sense, since his survival was actually an executive afterthought "Oh yeah, actually, he survived."  

post #1601 of 2848
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suntory View Post

I want some Rey Rey.

She a Kenobi and I Obi Wanna get up in them guts.
post #1602 of 2848
Thread Starter 
Well look at it like this. If they showed him falling out of the cockpit then it wouldn't have been a surprise he survived. I'm by no means saying this was a shocking moment, but I do know that there are viewers out there who didn't see it coming.

I keep going back to it being a small thing to get hung up on. When a movie is overall as good as this was, little issues like this dont take away from its overall goodness.

The prequels has a bunch of small issues too, but the movies were not good. So these things end up mattering more.
post #1603 of 2848
Thread Starter 
Thinking more about this thing with Poe it occurred to me that is it going to bother anyone when Captain Phasma appears in Ep 8? After all she was:
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Last seen about to get put into a trash compactor. Something that ANH established as a death trap. How did she get free before she was crushed or the planet exploded? I promise you this won't be shown and at best will be addressed in a quick line of dialogue. Should the viewer look on this as lazy 9th grade level story telling that takes them out of the narrative or just accept that it happened and enjoy the film?

I really don't see any difference between this and what happened to Poe.
post #1604 of 2848
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jr Mouse View Post

The breaking point for Finn was when his friend dies. It's clear he's never been in a battle before and that moment takes a lifetime of resentment towards being forced to work for these people and pushes him over the edge. Why did he choose to use Poe as a means of escape? What other options did he have at the time? He was desperate and well aware that Phasma was onto the fact he disobeyed orders to shoot at the villagers. Honestly this is all spelled out for you in the film.

Yes the first order had other females in it. Females raised from birth in the same brainwashing program he was put into.

 

Yeah, I hear you.

 

But that is also  what I meant when I said his character is set from the beginning - the breaking point for Finn is in the very first scene, we get to see maybe a few seconds of him behaving as a 'normal' stormtrooper before he realizes this isn't for him and that he'll have to ultimately escape/betray the First Order.

 

Compare that to Luke in ANH (who fills the everyman Joe Sixpack role, much as Finn does in TFA).  At first to Obi Wan, Luke's like "the Empire isn't my problem" and "I can't go off and save some princess, I've got work to do!" and the breaking point doesn't come until his aunt and uncle are killed and he realizes there's nothing left for him on Tatooine and he has to act.  It takes time, and we see his character change/develop.  Or with Rey, we get see her everyday life on Jakku before BB-8 shows up and the plot happens.  There's some lead in.  I'm not saying we needed an extended sequence of Finn carrying out his sanitation duties to fill in backstory, but the pacing and development of his character just felt slightly off to me.

 

 

post #1605 of 2848
It's lame fanfic. There's nothing great about the movie. Is it an ok action movie, sure. But nothing happens that matters. It's just crap.
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