or Connect
Styleforum › Forums › Men's Style › Streetwear and Denim › Saint Laurent Paris - Official Thread.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Saint Laurent Paris - Official Thread. - Page 31

post #451 of 2452

I disagree that he perfected the varsity..

I posted this earlier in the thread but the varsity is simply a replica of a jacket found at melrose trading post for $15

Here it is photographed in 2010 modeled by the drums - 

 

http://www.hedislimane.com/rockdiary/index.php?e=viewSpe&rockdiarySpeHomeNo=32

post #452 of 2452

I don't know if I'd call the SLP varsity perfect, but I don't see the big deal with it being a replica. How is this any different than OG vs MMM gats?

post #453 of 2452

I don't think it's a big deal at all, I'd much rather have the SLP, I just don't think Hedi deserves to be praised as a genius designer. He's a great stylist, he found something that works and made it cool. 

post #454 of 2452

repost

post #455 of 2452
Quote:
Originally Posted by ExAngel View Post
 

I don't think it's a big deal at all, I'd much rather have the SLP, I just don't think Hedi deserves to be praised as a genius designer. He's a great stylist, he found something that works and made it cool. 


Hedi is a fantastic designer, as evidenced by his work at Dior Homme. The issue is not with him, but with rock. Hedi's first rock inspired collection was Victim of the Crime. This was also the first collection to start to become less conceptual, and more styles. Prior to this collection, Hedi went through two phases, the first phase being where he deconstructed masculinity, and the second being when he was involved in the Berlin electronic scene. Both these concepts, masculinity and electronic music, are very abstract, and his clothing reflected that in their design. Rock, however, is a much more concrete reference, both in content (rock often having lyrics, using physical instruments) and in delivery (established fashion codes of rock, i.e. grunge, glam, punk). As such, Hedi went from trying to extrapolate what clothing inspired by an abstract concept would be like, to creating clothing off of an already existing reference and history. If Hedi were to start listening to electronic music again, or try to advance some other idea through his clothing, then I think you'd find that Saint Laurent would become less literal, less 'styled', and more unique and creative.

post #456 of 2452
^Agreed, but I do think it has come at the expense of losing the essence of YSL (not to mention the name itself). All designers bring their vision when entering an already established design house, but when this vision is carefully balanced with an already established aesthetic, the result is renewed fulfillment for the paying customer. I can't imagine how awful the outcome would have been, had Lagerfeld just ignored Chanel's legacy and turned the it into something completely his own. With this new departure, if the only YSL thing preserved is the retail space...then, why not just create a new label. Of course, this choice is obvious from Hedi's perspective, but not so from the operational people at YSL.
post #457 of 2452
Quote:
Originally Posted by ffatt View Post

^Agreed, but I do think it has come at the expense of losing the essence of YSL (not to mention the name itself). All designers bring their vision when entering an already established design house, but when this vision is carefully balanced with an already established aesthetic, the result is renewed fulfillment for the paying customer. I can't imagine how awful the outcome would have been, had Lagerfeld just ignored Chanel's legacy and turned the it into something completely his own. With this new departure, if the only YSL thing preserved is the retail space...then, why not just create a new label. Of course, this choice is obvious from Hedi's perspective, but not so from the operational people at YSL.

 

Karl has been designing for Channel longer than Channel did. At this point, it is his brand. I actually think Hedi is preserving the YSL legacy. Whereas Dior Homme to me looked to the future, SLP looks to the past. Everything just has an older feel to it.

post #458 of 2452
There are 'vintage' pieces and a lot of his hits from Dior Homme, which doesn't do much to preserve YSL's image.
post #459 of 2452
Heidi and Channel, yay!
post #460 of 2452

I think the "Aint no Saint Laurent without Yves" shirt has a point as opposed to most of these other silly "parody" shirts.

A fashion house is interested in preserving with incremental innovation, thus pushes a designer into a certain direction (think LV and handbags) to protect the brand.

To radical change like Hedi could go "wrong" from a maison's point of view.

Consistency like Lagerfeld provides for Chanel or even an unknown team with a similar mindset at MMM irritates less.

post #461 of 2452
Quote:
Originally Posted by Illithid Dude View Post
 

 

Whereas Dior Homme to me looked to the future, SLP looks to the past. Everything just has an older feel to it.

I think Dior Homme "looked to the future" because Hedi (at the time) liked minimalistic electronic music and the Berlin scene. Something intangible with an industrial, future outlook and technological feel to it. Consequently his pieces looked futuristic, straight-forward, minimal.

 

Now at SLP he is into rock music which is old music by now old, iconic musicians, so his pieces have an "older feel" to it.

All the chains etc. he incorporates at SLP are ornaments- something non-existant in raw minimal techno/dior homme.

 

Kanye's point in his last two, recent interviews (BBC & Jimmy Kimmel) was that fashion and especially Hedi are referencing "old" culture and ignoring hip-hop/black culture.

 

"So when I see Hedi Slimane, and it's all like, 'Okay this is my take on the world.' Yeah, he got some nice $5,000 jeans in there. It's some nice ones here and there, some good shit here and there. But we culture. Rap the new rock 'n roll. We culture. Rap is the new rock 'n roll. We the rockstars. It's been like that for a minute, Hedi Slimane! It's been like that for a minute. We the real rockstars, and I'm the biggest of all of them. I'm the number one rockstar on the planet."

 

Of course a classic Kanye rant but it is true rock is old and that is why SLP has "an older feel to it".

I like the leather bracelets, belts and jackets but it is undeniable that it's looking into the past in contrast to to e.g. Rick Owens or Dior Homme(btw Raf is doing a great job there, balancing hertitage and personal style).


Edited by JodyHighroller - 10/14/13 at 11:57am
post #462 of 2452
Quote:
Originally Posted by JodyHighroller View Post

I think the "Aint no Saint Laurent without Yves" shirt has a point as opposed to most of these other silly "parody" shirts.
A fashion house is interested in preserving with incremental innovation, thus pushes a designer into a certain direction (think LV and handbags) to protect the brand.
To radical change like Hedi could go "wrong" from a maison's point of view.
Consistency like Lagerfeld provides for Chanel or even an unknown team with a similar mindset at MMM irritates less.

my guess is the major fashion houses couldn't care less about preserving brand heritage if the new direction is bringing in serious profit. there are some conservative houses like zegna that you could probably point to as exceptions, but neither sl nor dior is anywhere close to that category. and I don't see any signs that he was only supposed to move the brand forward incrementally. from the start he was given "total creative responsibility for the brand image and all its collections," which was basically YSL saying "go ahead, change whatever you want" with the understanding that it better bring in cash. the name change itself was obviously more about starting over with the branding than about returning the brand to what it was at its founding when it was saint laurent rive gauche.

if hedi wanted to do old man rock n roll clothes he should've gone to john varvatos stirpot.gif
post #463 of 2452
Quote:
Originally Posted by pickpackpockpuck View Post


my guess is the major fashion houses couldn't care less about preserving brand heritage if the new direction is bringing in serious profit. there are some conservative houses like zegna that you could probably point to as exceptions, but neither sl nor dior is anywhere close to that category. and I don't see any signs that he was only supposed to move the brand forward incrementally. from the start he was given "total creative responsibility for the brand image and all its collections," which was basically YSL saying "go ahead, change whatever you want" with the understanding that it better bring in cash. the name change itself was obviously more about starting over with the branding than about returning the brand to what it was at its founding when it was saint laurent rive gauche.

if hedi wanted to do old man rock n roll clothes he should've gone to john varvatos stirpot.gif

It's arguable but I would consider most big fashion houses conservative with incremental "change" like LV, gucci, hermes, Zegna, versace, chanel, mmm because they stick to signature silouettes, themes and patterns. Of course there might be ups and downs but customers buy these rather for the brand image and less for the current designer's influence.

 

On the other hand, yes, you are right the allmighty dollar rules and some fashion houses just flip flop for hype profit and let a designer completly remodel their aestehetic like Givenchy.

YSL did not really have a long tradition in fashion for men, so that might be a reason for going with Hedi and giving him "total creative responsability".

post #464 of 2452

I'm currently reading a book called The Luxury Alchemist that goes in depth into why certain fashion houses like hermes and chanel work and how they have managed to maintain their brand and reputation all these years, while still turning a profit. Brands like these will always be around. I can't say the same will happen to SL after the revamping. An example is Givenchy, having had many ups and downs for as long as I remember, at one point they were so desperate for sales that the brand was being sold next to Sean Jean at bloomingdales They finally found their market and turned the house around, thanks to the 'New Rock N Roll', but like all brands that cater to hype, the brand has now become a victim of it's own hype and no one is really interested anymore. I think SL will soon find itself in that same position. Everyone wants to be part of something new and fresh and while SL's revamping was refreshing and turned heads, now that all the style editors and critics are applauding hedi and are becoming comfortable with where the brand is, it'll no doubt soon find itself boring and repetitive, but without the luxe branding that it originally held and the massive loyal fanbase that YSL originally had. Funny enough, I found myself at Dior the other day and found myself wanting quite a few pieces and it was nice to see that rather than compete with SL, they've become more exclusive and have eliminated itself from going on sale and taking collections out of stores, thus maintaining its brand reputation. 

post #465 of 2452
^^ Thanks for mentioning the book- just looked it up and will order it. If you know more literature going into this direction, I'd appreciate a PM ;)
I agree on a lot of what you wrote. Also I think Dior is more timeless luxery. But maybe that's because I enjoy simple, modern, classical things with high quality over opulence, ornament and in SLP's case "rock and roll".

Edited by JodyHighroller - 10/14/13 at 1:33pm
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Streetwear and Denim
Styleforum › Forums › Men's Style › Streetwear and Denim › Saint Laurent Paris - Official Thread.