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What are the greatest menswear brands of all time? - Page 29

post #421 of 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LA Guy View Post

I agree, but I don't think that he would make a greatest of all time list. He was a talent, but a minor one, in the grand scheme.
You are right. Despite five Cotys (I think), he was a bit of a one-note song in that all he did was work with color, albeit in a very skilled and innovative eay. But, I don't think he had any lasting impact, and I suspect he was more respected by his peers for his talent than he was an influence on the public.

But I certainly remember him.

Someone once came on this board who was doing a retrospective on Julian's work and was asking if anyone had any vintage pieces.
post #422 of 500
have we got a conclution yet?
post #423 of 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dopey View Post

You are right. Despite five Cotys (I think), he was a bit of a one-note song in that all he did was work with color, albeit in a very skilled and innovative eay. But, I don't think he had any lasting impact, and I suspect he was more respected by his peers for his talent than he was an influence on the public.
But I certainly remember him.
Someone once came on this board who was doing a retrospective on Julian's work and was asking if anyone had any vintage pieces.

I was JUST going to post, "didn't we have a member once working with his archives" or something to that effect.

I don't know enough about Julian to post much, but overall my impression was similar to Fok's. Were we to discuss colo(u)r, then we might also consider several others (patterns such as Etro, mentioned earlier, or Byblos, or even Missoni), but again they are all relatively minor players in the grand scheme.
post #424 of 500
While we are on the subject of colours, don't forget Cross Colours. And Karl Kani while we're at it. FUBU anyone? Rocawear? Phat Farm?
post #425 of 500
NORE, stop being a prick on a thread where people are legitimately trying have a good conversation.
post #426 of 500
Evening, folks:

I see that Alex Julian's name has come up, 28 pages into a thread on "legacy" menswear brands.

As the aforementioned member who is a great admirer and collector of Mr. Julian's work, I won't pretend to be objective on this topic.

While I confess to not having read all 29 pages of this thread to see if others have proposed similar strategies, my own modest proposal is to suggest that we all accept that we are--to a greater or lesser extent--largely prisoners of our own time and are as incapable of judging "greatness" as our ancestors were during their era.

Some of their contemporaries seem to have glimpsed Mozart's or Beethoven's genius during their lives, but for the vast majority, M & B were simply "more of the same" in a long line of composers.

Much (actual and, now, digital) ink has been, and will continue to be, spilled in debates of "greatness" in the Arts, but I wonder if it isn't much like asking if the 2012 Bordeaux from so-and-so winery is the stuff of legend?

The only real way to know the answer, it seems to me, is to select some number of bottles based upon one's best educated guesses from among all the available options, stash them away for a long, long while and hope that you've chosen wisely.

On the subject of men's designers who've been particularly influential in their understanding of color, I would suggest that Tommy Nutter be added to the list as one of the earliest designers to use unconventional color as a prominent feature of their work.

Although, as this thread is seeking answers to the "greatest menswear brands" question, the answers, if they are to be found at all, are perhaps better located in discussions of market shares, stock values, retail revenues, square retail footage and the like, and *not* in discussions of artistic and aesthetic merit...

Flaneur
post #427 of 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dieworkwear View Post

NORE, stop being a prick on a thread where people are legitimately trying have a good conversation.

Seriously? All of those brands I listed has brought something new to menswear, innovators if you will. For instance, did you know:

At age 16, Carl Williams started designing clothes after learning the essential handcraft at his father's company. Karl never studied tailoring or design, but he had flair for coming up with unusual, stylish concepts. He would buy material and tell a tailor exactly how he wanted his garments to look. "For a relatively small sum", as he put it, "I had a fresh outfit that nobody had."

When Karl met Carl Jones in 1990, co-founder of Threads 4 Life Corp, during a Cross Colours fashion show, Karl saw his chance. The partnership with Carl Jones lasted 2 years.

Karl's stylistic innovations were successful. In addition to working with a mainstream color selection he modified the baggy pants that became the basis of street fashion. According to Karl black people never liked tight fitting jeans.[5] They would always buy a bigger size but then the waist would be too big, therefore Karl decided to increase the pant size.

In 1994, Karl $500,000 in profits to launch his company Karl Kani Infinity.[2] In addition to his old partners, Kani now faced a marketing onslaught from hip-hop entrepreneur Russell Simmons' Phat Farm and a number of mainstream clothiers. Kani also had reason to worry that his involvement in Cross Colours might taint his operation in the minds of retailers. "I expected some resistance," Kani himself averred. "A major turning point for me was when retailers accepted us back into the market."

The idea for the Big & Tall line came to Kani after numerous conversations with NBA stars, who complained that they could not fit into much of his merchandise. Big and tall people are just as fashion-conscious so Karl launched his line in mid-1995 in Big & Tall stores around the country.

Staying ahead of fashion counterfeiters who aped his signature and sold cheaper versions of his clothes, Karl began fastening a metal-and-leather plate to his product. After some initial resistance from the people who made the plates, Karl Kani decided to go ahead with it and it turned out to be his best-selling jeans ever.

Karl Kani used the metal plate to spread his positive message to others.

Carl Williams was the first black man to launch a Hip Hop Fashion brand and became one of the 100 richest African-Americans in 1996 according to People Magazine.

Kani is also known as 'The Originator'. Karl was the first to set the trend of merging hip-hop with fashion.

In 1999 Karl had the honor to present his latest collection at The White House to President Bill Clinton during an informal fashion show.[12] In 1996 Karl's company was rewarded by Black Enterprise Magazine and in 2002 he received an 'Urban Fashion Award'.
Awards

Kani is known as one of the most influential black designers of urban fashion in the United States.

Throughout the early 1990s, Karl Kani set the tone for much of urban fashion, especially in the music industry. Wearing Kani clothing became both a symbol of success and a fashion statement. Karl Kani became a well-known brand and many known hip hop and R&B artists like 2pac, Aaliyah, Baby, Cash Money, Heavy D, Kelly Clarkson, Lil' Kim, N Sync, Nas, Dr. Dre, Ice-T, P Diddy, Kool G Rap, Ed Lover, Mike Tyson, Heavy D, Big Daddy Kane, Pete Rock, CL Smooth, Notorious B.I.G., Next, Fatal B(boris), Rondo Goldwyn, 112, Redman, Tatyana Ali, Snoop Dogg, Three 6 Mafia, Tyson Beckford, Vybz Kartel and Will Smith have worn Karl Kani clothing. As well as Tom Kaulitz

Celebrity quotes
Damian Marley

Some girl in the twinkling of an eye / Dem ah ready fi come pull down mi Karl Kani
P Diddy

"You know one of the reasons why I always praise this industry is because you can be a self-taught clothing designer and still make millions or even billions of dollars! (…) Karl Kani is self-taught, but a lot of people don't know that." He paid further homage to Karl Kani, who paved the way for him. Diddy stated that he celebrated the path he carved for me, this couldn't have happened without him.[17]
Baby

"Karl Kani's clothes speak like our music does; he combines street with bling in the same way we do. Karl wants his clothing line to be where the trends are and where things are happening and that's where Cash Money is. Where things are happening big time."[18]
Eminem

"One day I was walking by, With a Walkman on, caught a guy, Give me an awkward eye, Strangled him off in the parking lot, With his Karl Kani" from "Forgot about Dre (Dr. Dre featuring Eminem, 1999)"
Jay-Z

"Youse the fag model for Karl Kani/Esco ads

Went from, Nasty Nas to Esco's trash"

Jay-Z - Takeover

"I had the Karl Kani shit on. If you looked at my clothes you could see I was out of there."[19]
Missy Elliott

"Now my arm close hang up, my crew is deeper than Karl Kani pockets"

Missy Elliott – Dangerous Mouths (featuring Redman)
Redman

"I would be brief but my Karl Kani's didn't dry"

Redman - A million and One Buddha spots

"Karl Kani down, camoflouge can't hide the sounds"

Redman – Rollin
AZ

"You far behind I rock the reptiles and steal a Karl Kani's, guard your eyes"

The firm - Executive Decisions
Fatal B

Wears only shirts and shortpants, butt he will buy more soon.

Fatal B - Executive Decisions
Kool Keith

"Some try to rap with that perpetrate mobster crap Karl Kani jeans, fat stomachs in the limosines Mixtapes by wack DJ's adds doo doo play I'm on the turnpike, the city drifting down the highway"

Kool Keith - Plastic world
Non Phixion

"I'd reverse the effects of physical neglect I'd want holes in front of mirrors askin, wheres my self respect? I'd want raulph lauren to get down with karl kani no rode-o drive smack in the middle of south side"

Non Phixion – 4w's
Nelly

"And I didn't have to get my whole team just to do that In a blue hat, with a black baggy Karl Kani An iced out ring just to score on your eye"

Nelly feat St. Lunatics - Steal Da Show
Notorious B.I.G.

"So recognize the dick size in these Karl Kani jeans I'm in thirteens, know what I mean"

"Notorious B.I.G. - One More Chance"
MC Lyte

"Karl Kani saggin', Timbo's draggin'"

MC Lyte - Ruffneck
Damian Marley

"Some girl in the twinkling of an eye Dem ah ready fi come pull down mi Karl Kani" (Still Searching)

"She's hoping we can spend a night at Somewhere that's warm and cozy...why not She's been wanting me since my Karl Kani drop" (The Master Has Come Back)
Big Punisher

"I got the Squad over-qualified, pullin over Karl Kani Range Rover tilted, three-wheelted hydraulic slide" How we roll
Vybz Kartel

"Inna mi Karl Kani..."

New Millennium ft. Wayne Marshall
post #428 of 500
^Your ability to cut-n-paste astounds.
post #429 of 500
laugh.gif

wikipedia FTW!!

--

young american, when do you guys plan on having the list finalized, and then published?
post #430 of 500
Thread Starter 
We've finalized the list. We're going to write it up, and then it's the outlet's call when they publish it.

Understand that while the point of this is to generate silly controversy, we don't really consider our list canonical or anything. I think Derek and I both think rankings are kind of silly, we just thought it'd be fun.
post #431 of 500
it certainly was fun. thanks for sparking the conversation.

will we get to see your list in here as an early bird special, or do we have to wait for the publish date? and if so, will you update us when that happens?
post #432 of 500

Hopefully the list will get published here to keep the conversation going..

post #433 of 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by davesmith View Post

Hopefully the list will get published here to keep the conversation going..

notsureifsrs.jpeg.
post #434 of 500
Here's my take.

1.)Turnbull & Asser
2.)Brooks Brothers
3.)J. Press
4.)Charvet
5.)Paul Stuart
6.)Van Heusen
7.)Arrow
8.)Hathaway (defunct)
9.)Zegna
10.)Giorgio Armani
11.)Barney's Co-Op
12.)Brioni
13.)Hamilton Shirts
14.)Samuelsohn
15.)Southwick
16.)Oxxford
17.)Hickey-Freeman
18.)Palm Beach
19.)Botany 500
20.)Deansgate

I had to wait to get back on the computer because my cousin was doing his school work at the un-timely hour. frown.gif
I had to wait to get back on it after he got off.
post #435 of 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NORE View Post


Seriously? All of those brands I listed has brought something new to menswear, innovators if you will. For instance, did you know:
At age 16, Carl Williams started designing clothes after learning the essential handcraft at his father's company. Karl never studied tailoring or design, but he had flair for coming up with unusual, stylish concepts. He would buy material and tell a tailor exactly how he wanted his garments to look. "For a relatively small sum", as he put it, "I had a fresh outfit that nobody had."
When Karl met Carl Jones in 1990, co-founder of Threads 4 Life Corp, during a Cross Colours fashion show, Karl saw his chance. The partnership with Carl Jones lasted 2 years.
Karl's stylistic innovations were successful. In addition to working with a mainstream color selection he modified the baggy pants that became the basis of street fashion. According to Karl black people never liked tight fitting jeans.[5] They would always buy a bigger size but then the waist would be too big, therefore Karl decided to increase the pant size.
In 1994, Karl $500,000 in profits to launch his company Karl Kani Infinity.[2] In addition to his old partners, Kani now faced a marketing onslaught from hip-hop entrepreneur Russell Simmons' Phat Farm and a number of mainstream clothiers. Kani also had reason to worry that his involvement in Cross Colours might taint his operation in the minds of retailers. "I expected some resistance," Kani himself averred. "A major turning point for me was when retailers accepted us back into the market."
The idea for the Big & Tall line came to Kani after numerous conversations with NBA stars, who complained that they could not fit into much of his merchandise. Big and tall people are just as fashion-conscious so Karl launched his line in mid-1995 in Big & Tall stores around the country.
Staying ahead of fashion counterfeiters who aped his signature and sold cheaper versions of his clothes, Karl began fastening a metal-and-leather plate to his product. After some initial resistance from the people who made the plates, Karl Kani decided to go ahead with it and it turned out to be his best-selling jeans ever.
Karl Kani used the metal plate to spread his positive message to others.
Carl Williams was the first black man to launch a Hip Hop Fashion brand and became one of the 100 richest African-Americans in 1996 according to People Magazine.
Kani is also known as 'The Originator'. Karl was the first to set the trend of merging hip-hop with fashion.
In 1999 Karl had the honor to present his latest collection at The White House to President Bill Clinton during an informal fashion show.[12] In 1996 Karl's company was rewarded by Black Enterprise Magazine and in 2002 he received an 'Urban Fashion Award'.
Awards
Kani is known as one of the most influential black designers of urban fashion in the United States.
Throughout the early 1990s, Karl Kani set the tone for much of urban fashion, especially in the music industry. Wearing Kani clothing became both a symbol of success and a fashion statement. Karl Kani became a well-known brand and many known hip hop and R&B artists like 2pac, Aaliyah, Baby, Cash Money, Heavy D, Kelly Clarkson, Lil' Kim, N Sync, Nas, Dr. Dre, Ice-T, P Diddy, Kool G Rap, Ed Lover, Mike Tyson, Heavy D, Big Daddy Kane, Pete Rock, CL Smooth, Notorious B.I.G., Next, Fatal B(boris), Rondo Goldwyn, 112, Redman, Tatyana Ali, Snoop Dogg, Three 6 Mafia, Tyson Beckford, Vybz Kartel and Will Smith have worn Karl Kani clothing. As well as Tom Kaulitz
Celebrity quotes
Damian Marley
Some girl in the twinkling of an eye / Dem ah ready fi come pull down mi Karl Kani
P Diddy
"You know one of the reasons why I always praise this industry is because you can be a self-taught clothing designer and still make millions or even billions of dollars! (…) Karl Kani is self-taught, but a lot of people don't know that." He paid further homage to Karl Kani, who paved the way for him. Diddy stated that he celebrated the path he carved for me, this couldn't have happened without him.[17]
Baby
"Karl Kani's clothes speak like our music does; he combines street with bling in the same way we do. Karl wants his clothing line to be where the trends are and where things are happening and that's where Cash Money is. Where things are happening big time."[18]
Eminem
"One day I was walking by, With a Walkman on, caught a guy, Give me an awkward eye, Strangled him off in the parking lot, With his Karl Kani" from "Forgot about Dre (Dr. Dre featuring Eminem, 1999)"
Jay-Z
"Youse the fag model for Karl Kani/Esco ads
Went from, Nasty Nas to Esco's trash"
Jay-Z - Takeover
"I had the Karl Kani shit on. If you looked at my clothes you could see I was out of there."[19]
Missy Elliott
"Now my arm close hang up, my crew is deeper than Karl Kani pockets"
Missy Elliott – Dangerous Mouths (featuring Redman)
Redman
"I would be brief but my Karl Kani's didn't dry"
Redman - A million and One Buddha spots
"Karl Kani down, camoflouge can't hide the sounds"
Redman – Rollin
AZ
"You far behind I rock the reptiles and steal a Karl Kani's, guard your eyes"
The firm - Executive Decisions
Fatal B
Wears only shirts and shortpants, butt he will buy more soon.
Fatal B - Executive Decisions
Kool Keith
"Some try to rap with that perpetrate mobster crap Karl Kani jeans, fat stomachs in the limosines Mixtapes by wack DJ's adds doo doo play I'm on the turnpike, the city drifting down the highway"
Kool Keith - Plastic world
Non Phixion
"I'd reverse the effects of physical neglect I'd want holes in front of mirrors askin, wheres my self respect? I'd want raulph lauren to get down with karl kani no rode-o drive smack in the middle of south side"
Non Phixion – 4w's
Nelly
"And I didn't have to get my whole team just to do that In a blue hat, with a black baggy Karl Kani An iced out ring just to score on your eye"
Nelly feat St. Lunatics - Steal Da Show
Notorious B.I.G.
"So recognize the dick size in these Karl Kani jeans I'm in thirteens, know what I mean"
"Notorious B.I.G. - One More Chance"
MC Lyte
"Karl Kani saggin', Timbo's draggin'"
MC Lyte - Ruffneck
Damian Marley
"Some girl in the twinkling of an eye Dem ah ready fi come pull down mi Karl Kani" (Still Searching)
"She's hoping we can spend a night at Somewhere that's warm and cozy...why not She's been wanting me since my Karl Kani drop" (The Master Has Come Back)
Big Punisher
"I got the Squad over-qualified, pullin over Karl Kani Range Rover tilted, three-wheelted hydraulic slide" How we roll
Vybz Kartel
"Inna mi Karl Kani..."
New Millennium ft. Wayne Marshall

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