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Reasons why New York Sucks - Page 434

post #6496 of 11479
Quote:
Originally Posted by aravenel View Post

Basically, this. In most higher-end or up-and coming neighborhoods, within a few years, rents will likely go up to the point you can't afford to live there anymore, leading a never-ending move further out.

I agree that buying in New York makes little sense from a purely financial standpoint--but the New York market is unlike any other, and if you are a long-term resident not in a rent-stabilized unit who wants to stay in the same or similar neighborhoods, chances are that unless you are averaging 15-20% raises every single year (and you don't want to use that money for other things, like kids, or traveling, or just not living in a shithole anymore) you're either going to buy or slowly end up in Long Island or Jersey.

Personally, I'd never buy here, but that's because I won't stay here forever, and so I can take that tradeoff for a while.

Well, these are hindsight evaluations. Property prices keep going up until they don't... Good job being right on prices now vs. when you bought, but that wasn't riskless and may reverse.

Absent conviction in the direction of rents & prices (which many markets people would argue are stochastic/brownian), the relative favorability of the economics is best captured by the all in cap rate, which in NYC heavily favors renters.

But yeah, I guess if you put a big premium on removing the risk of being priced out in the future, OK...
post #6497 of 11479
Quote:
Originally Posted by aravenel View Post

Spent last week on the coast of Maine, where it was perfect weather--upper 70s, low humidity--all week long.

Come back to 92 degrees and humid.

No amount of linen is comfortable in this, and I am wearing it head to toe. I'm even slumming it today and not wearing a tie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aravenel View Post

That's why you really need a place that's either on or has access to a lake or pond.

Sit in the sun, and it's quite warm--get too warm, and either jump in the lake or merely step into the shade, where it is a pleasing mid-70s temperature.

But yeah, you're generally not jumping into the ocean there, even if it gets really hot. At least not this time of year.

It was so refreshing being able to sit outside without wanting to die. And at night, it'd get cool enough to have a little bonfire on the beach. Sigh.


You would love Seattle in the summer. It's like this, plus, no bugs.
post #6498 of 11479
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedLantern View Post


You would love Seattle in the summer. It's like this, plus, no bugs.

Yeah, but doesn't it just rain most of the time?
post #6499 of 11479
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post

Also, many coops have high fees because they are up to their eyeballs in debt.

There is no particular reason for that - building mortgage can easily be refinanced at attractive current rates.   Last coop I was in did that and saved a bunch on mortgage payments while extending maturity.

post #6500 of 11479
Refinancing to cheaper payments and/or longer maturities does not reduce indebtedness.
post #6501 of 11479
It doesn't rain in Seattle in the summer all that much. Also, little known fact: It actually rains more in NYC than Seattle. When I was in Seattle last summer I didn't want to come back.
post #6502 of 11479
i've never liked the idea of living in a big city where a car is a requirement.
post #6503 of 11479
Quote:
Originally Posted by archetypal_yuppie View Post

Refinancing to cheaper payments and/or longer maturities does not reduce indebtedness.

If you read one more level of discussion up, you'd see that PB was primarily referring to the monthly cost of that debt, not the quantum of the debt itself.  While refinancing doesn't reduce the debt level, it can reduce the servicing cost of that debt and therefore address his comment about high maintenance fees being the result of high debt

post #6504 of 11479
Quote:
Originally Posted by gomestar View Post

i've never liked the idea of living in a big city where a car is a requirement.
Depending on where you live you don't need one. Also, Seattle has a pretty decent bus system. Much better than New York, imo. Also, for a city where most people own cars there seems to be little traffic. My mind was blown when I was looking to cross the street outside of a crosswalk, cars actually just saw I wanted to cross and stopped. Zero beeping or anything. I was actually angry at them for not being pissed off at me. What gives!?!
post #6505 of 11479
Quote:
Originally Posted by gdl203 View Post

If you read one more level of discussion up, you'd see that PB was primarily referring to the monthly cost of that debt, not the quantum of the debt itself.  While refinancing doesn't reduce the debt level, it can reduce the servicing cost of that debt and therefore address his comment about high maintenance fees being the result of high debt

Hmm.
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post

Also, many coops have high fees because they are up to their eyeballs in debt.

He mentioned a level of indebtedness, not of interest rates. Assuming that they're all paying above market interest rates that can be solved by refi seems to distract from that issue. But this will go nowhere...
post #6506 of 11479

There's an inferred relationship here.  You need to be able to read between the lines if you want to understand what people write.  It would be tedious (it is actually...) to spell everything out all the time.  Do you understand what "coop high fees" refer to in his original post?   Coop maintenance fees are related to indebtedness only because of the servicing cost that debt carries.  The level of debt itself has no bearing on the monthly fees.   Refinancing a building mortgage to a lower rate is a way to reduce those "high fees".

post #6507 of 11479
Quote:
Originally Posted by gdl203 View Post

There's an inferred relationship here.  You need to be able to read between the lines if you want to understand what people write.  It would be tedious (it is actually...) to spell everything out all the time.  Do you understand what "coop high fees" refer to in his original post?   Coop maintenance fees are related to indebtedness only because of the servicing cost that debt carries.  The level of debt itself has no bearing on the monthly fees.   Refinancing a building mortgage to a lower rate is a way to reduce those "high fees".

The relationship is not inferred, it is direct, mathematical. There is no need to read between the lines in understanding the relationships.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gdl203 View Post

The level of debt itself has no bearing on the monthly fees.

Have you worked at Enron?
Quote:
Originally Posted by gdl203 View Post

Refinancing a building mortgage to a lower rate is a way to reduce those "high fees".

If you make the assumption that the building is currently paying above market rates, then yes it is. Why make that assumption?

You're talking to a financial analyst, I get this stuff. I was merely choosing not to deflect blame (rhetoricially) for debt onto the possibility of above market interest rates, which you seem to want to do.

As I said earlier, this is going nowhere... not trying to be particularly adversarial, only answering because of your insinuations that I'm failing to read between the lines on the basics of the nature of debt, interest, and payments.
post #6508 of 11479
As an ex investment banker I'm sure gdl gets it. Furthermore:
post #6509 of 11479
post #6510 of 11479
Bowlmor Lanes also closed....
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