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Reasons why New York Sucks - Page 336

post #5026 of 11477
Thread Starter 
LD, if course I don't literally mean "everyone". The janitors aren't doing it, for instance. But:

1) The workplace is now a akin to Stalin-era collective, complete with block captains and everything. OK, no, it's not LITERALLY that bad. But the similarities are numerous and striking. The range of acceptable opinion is oppressive, there is a Star Chamber HR regime dedicated to punishing apostates, and most depressingly, a whole class of workers who seem to enjoy informing on their colleagues. Until I saw that up close, I didn't really understand how a totalitarian state could function so well, but there is apparently something human nature that takes to it like a duck to water.

2) Well, socially I tend to cocoon myself among conservatives as often as possible, or with apolitical food people with whom I don't talk about politics. Outside those circles though, the shaming of heterodoxy is prevalent. And recent. People didn't used to do that, not even in the lib places where I grew up (Berkeley being the exception).
post #5027 of 11477
Can I admit to being confused over the use of the word "heterodoxy" here? As being used in this conversation should Manton not be characterized as lacking the proper heterodox views? Seriously confused over word use/choice here.

Edit: Or should I think more along the lines of "the new heterodoxy?"
Edited by Piobaire - 12/5/13 at 8:25am
post #5028 of 11477
Manton will love this article: http://www.commentarymagazine.com/2013/12/04/a-frightening-portent-for-new-york-city/ I am typing from a mobile so feel free to cut and paste the text for others to read.
post #5029 of 11477
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piobaire View Post

Can I admit to being confused over the use of the word "heterodoxy" here? As being used in this conversation should Manton not be characterized as lacking the proper heterodox views? Seriously confused over word use/choice here.

Edit: Or should I think more along the lines of "the new heterodoxy?"

Well, it's Manton's fancy word. I was just pretending to understand it.

But I think as used here, the definition of heterodox is something like "not in agreement with prevailing beliefs or prescribed dogma". Thus, when Manton suggests I take my heterodox opinions for a test flight or complains that he doesn't feel he can safely express his own, we're talking about opinions that run counter to what Manton views as the orthodoxy being imposed by the enforcers. By way of example, "cisgendered people shouldn't have to share bathrooms or locker rooms with transgendered people if they don't feel like it", "Trayvon Martin was a simply a punk who caught a bad break that was at least partly of his own making, not a victim of institutionalized racism", and "same-sex marriage is not enshrined in the Bill of Rights and may not even be socially desirable" would all be considered at least somewhat heterodox in the sense that term is being used here.

Manton can obviously correct me if he meant something different (since he introduced the term), but I think that's at least in the ballpark.
post #5030 of 11477
Quote:
Originally Posted by StephenHero View Post

It looks like De Blasio is tapping William Bratton for Police Chief. Opinions?

The best hire one could hope for.

He butted heads rather famously with Rudy back in the day. So I can't imagine him coming back without having a huge amount of autonomy from DiBlasio.
post #5031 of 11477
post #5032 of 11477
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manton View Post

1) The workplace is now a akin to Stalin-era collective, complete with block captains and everything. OK, no, it's not LITERALLY that bad. But the similarities are numerous and striking. The range of acceptable opinion is oppressive, there is a Star Chamber HR regime dedicated to punishing apostates, and most depressingly, a whole class of workers who seem to enjoy informing on their colleagues. Until I saw that up close, I didn't really understand how a totalitarian state could function so well, but there is apparently something human nature that takes to it like a duck to water.

It may be that New York's corporate culture is more PC than that of the Bay Area's, but I doubt it. Is it PC to make fun of how hard it is to pronounce those funny names the foreign employees have? What about belly dancers at the holiday party? What if an executive gets excessively friendly with the belly dancer and makes suggestive comments? None of these elicited a peep from HR.
post #5033 of 11477
Quote:
Originally Posted by tropics View Post

just saw the clover club has a back room with a fireplace. mind = blown.



bounce2.gif

I'll be there on Friday night for a birthday party actually.
post #5034 of 11477
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarbutch View Post

It may be that New York's corporate culture is more PC than that of the Bay Area's, but I doubt it. Is it PC to make fun of how hard it is to pronounce those funny names the foreign employees have? What about belly dancers at the holiday party? What if an executive gets excessively friendly with the belly dancer and makes suggestive comments? None of these elicited a peep from HR.

I don't think this really addresses Mike's point. The fact that some groups are not protected by socially enforced orthodoxy doesn't at all point to that enforcement not existing, it just points to how hypocritical it can be.
post #5035 of 11477
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post

I'll be there on Friday night for a birthday party actually.

back room? i saw the door out the back of the main bar a few times but never actually thought to check what was there.
post #5036 of 11477
Not sure where we will be. Probably been two years since I have been there. Come to think of it, I have always been in the back room. I pissed off one of the bartender's when I was joking around with him. When I was paying my tab I told him I was putting negative $10 on the tip line and subtracting it from the total. (Service was excellent, it was literally a joke). He must have been a sensitive Sally because he looked at me like I just killed his dog.
post #5037 of 11477
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post

Not sure where we will be. Probably been two years since I have been there. Come to think of it, I have always been in the back room. I pissed off one of the bartender's when I was joking around with him. When I was paying my tab I told him I was putting negative $10 on the tip line and subtracting it from the total. (Service was excellent, it was literally a joke). He must have been a sensitive Sally because he looked at me like I just killed his dog.

remember that one time two weeks ago when it was discovered that there was a big bowl of chalk on this bar's bathroom vaity, so we drew cocks all over the mirrors?
post #5038 of 11477
In fact, I do remember that.
post #5039 of 11477
Quote:
Originally Posted by itsstillmatt View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarbutch View Post

It may be that New York's corporate culture is more PC than that of the Bay Area's, but I doubt it. Is it PC to make fun of how hard it is to pronounce those funny names the foreign employees have? What about belly dancers at the holiday party? What if an executive gets excessively friendly with the belly dancer and makes suggestive comments? None of these elicited a peep from HR.

I don't think this really addresses Mike's point. The fact that some groups are not protected by socially enforced orthodoxy doesn't at all point to that enforcement not existing, it just points to how hypocritical it can be.

Perhaps. I took his point to be that PC scolds have made it impossible to express anything other than Nation-approved orthodoxy in a public setting. That just doesn't square with the world I live in. Sure, there are people who match his description, but the overwhelming majority of people on the left bear little resemblance to that portrait, just like the overwhelming majority of people on the right don't see themselves in the bobbleheads on Fox News.
post #5040 of 11477
Quote:
Originally Posted by tropics View Post

just saw the clover club has a back room with a fireplace. mind = blown.



bounce2.gif

Unless you go there at an off time, good luck being able to enjoy it. That place gets completely slammed. Can barely even get a drink most of the time.

Black Mountain Wine House, not far from there, also has a nice fireplace. For a nice dinner, the downstairs at Vinegar Hill House has a fireplace.
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