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Why does everyone here dislike "high-end" brands? - Page 4

post #46 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geezer View Post

This forum loves high-end brands. Most SR/Rome/Napoli tailors. Lots of shirtmakers. Drake's. Lobb/EG/G&G. Etc. Where else on the internet can you find people discussing hand-welted shoes, or the benefits of suits hand-stitched by chain-smoking cockneys in basement workshops? (OK, the London Lounge, but beyond that?)
This forum has a high tolerance for, for example, Hermes and even LV leather goods. Though it prefers Charvet ties and PSes. But it is not opposed to the well-known and well-advertised.
But this forum has a low tolerance for things sold at premium prices on their brand name on the back of expensive ad campaigns rather than on their inherent quality or aesthetic value, while similar non-branded items are available at a fraction of the cost.

+1
post #47 of 60

Charvet ties give me headaches.

post #48 of 60
You are tying them too tight.
post #49 of 60

No, not when wearing them. When looking at them. That said I have a couple.

post #50 of 60
People here hate mainstream high-end b/c they're trying to be different. Their ego and identity are wrapped in what articles of clothing they purchase and wear. Think about people who love an indie band than hate them once they become mainstream.

First, the context is very important to understand. Many people here are broke and have no net worth or investments to speak of. They also earn a lot less money than you think. Everyone thinks everyone else is wildly successful. Many are still early in their career trajectory. Many only buy used clothing in order to look more wealthy than they are. They also mostly come from blue collar families, and think clothing will elevate them into a higher social class or get them a promotion. Of course, this is what poor people who buy LV bags also do, so people of SF are merely trying to be one step ahead. But, it's the same "low class" mindset that is driving the obsession on clothing.

High-end fashion brands are purchased for people to feel included in a group. The brands purchased by the SF poster is to exclude themselves from the group.

So, the difference is that they just spend money on different overpriced clothing to feel special and superior. Generally, if it's sold at a mall, it's not "cool". And if it's trendy "fashion", it's not cool either. Meanwhile, if Gucci, Burberry, Ferragamo, or LV put out the highest quality product ever at a Walmart price point, do you think people here would suddenly embrace this amazing value?

They insist that it's about quality and value, but it's not that simple. First, the quality aspect is vastly overstated, particularly from a diminishing returns point of view. For example, it's almost impossible to tell apart a fused jacket from fully canvassed. (Do a search, have a laugh at the "pinch test". Or the mythical "bubbling" effect after 1 supposed minute caught in the rain.) You can't tell silk from polyester without lighting it on fire. They insist $100 mall-caliber shoes will "explode" after 3 wears. They don't. Not even close. Meanwhile, they will pay $300 for a cloth duffle bag (Filson) and insist it's about value. They concoct all sorts of bizarre reasons to justify spending $5000 on a watch that can be replicated for $300. (Get a load of the Homage vs. Replica debate, in light of the "quality" justification) Spare me. All bullshit. It's all herd mentality here. It's just a different herd. Instead of just brand whoring, it's a mixture of alternative boutique brand whoring, granted with some eye on quality.

They also delude themselves into thinking items will last them 10 years, when in reality little beyond shoes are ever worn more than a few years without going out of style anyway. (Cue the 1% who defy this rule of thumb) In the last 3 years, even sport jackets have gone from long ....to short ....to who knows what. When short is in fashion, too long means it's old. When long is in fashion, too short is a woman's jacket. Tie fashion goes from wide ...to thin ....to medium. Ironically, only a fashion whore who loves shopping would be able to keep up with this anti-fashion mindset.

I am not throwing the baby out with the bathwater. There is worthwhile knowledge to be learned here. The best thing you can learn here is how to buy clothing that flatters your particular body type. (jackets, pants, and dress shirts). Proper fit is paramount here. Do not confuse this with the many arbitrary "rules" of fashion that are constantly changing (lapel width, jacket length, tie width, collar style, pant bagginess/rise, etc)

Let's talk style. You will also learn to appreciate simpler, less trendy "timeless gentleman" (LOL) clothing that is less likely to look regrettable a few years from now (wingtips vs. square toed shoes, solids vs. loud stripes, fitted vs baggy clothing, etc). You might develop a sense of color matching.

In the end you too will learn to avoid "logo brands", partly to expect more value for your money. While you may not actually get it b/c plenty of "SF approved" stuff here is overpriced and over-hyped even without the logo, you will at least try to discern what constitutes "quality", and aim for that instead of simply assuming "expensive = quality", as the masses who buy those fashion brands you mentioned do. For various articles of clothing, only you can decide the price point you are comfortable with, lest you still get ripped off, but just in a more tasteful, less mainstream way.
Edited by Reevolving - 8/24/12 at 4:37pm
post #51 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by KObalto View Post

You are tying them too tight.

lol8[1].gif
post #52 of 60
That LV condom isn't real BTW.
post #53 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reevolving View Post

People here hate mainstream high-end b/c they're trying to be different. Their ego and identity are wrapped in what articles of clothing they purchase and wear. Think about people who love an indie band than hate them once they become mainstream.
First, the context is very important to understand. Many people here are broke and have no investments to speak of. They are still early in their career trajectory. They also earn a lot less money than you think. Everyone thinks everyone else is wildly successful. Many only buy used clothing in order to look more wealthy than they are. They also mostly come from blue collar families, and think clothing will elevate them into a higher social class or get them a promotion. Of course, this is what poor people who buy LV bags also do, so people of SF are merely trying to be one step ahead. But, it's the same "low class" mindset that is driving the obsession on clothing.
So, the difference is that they piss money on DIFFERENT overpriced clothing to feel special and different. Generally, if it's sold at a mall, it's not "cool". And if it's trendy "fashion", it's not cool either. If Gucci or Burberry or Ferragamo or LV put out the highest quality product ever at a Walmart price point, do you think people here would suddenly embrace this amazing value?
They pretend that it's about quality, but really it's not. First, the quality is vastly overstated. For example, it's almost impossible to tell apart a fused jacket from fully canvassed. (Do a search, have a laugh at the "pinch test". Or the mythical "bubbling" effect after 1 supposed minute caught in the rain.) You can't tell silk from polyester without lighting it on fire. They concoct all sorts of bizarre reasons to justify spending $5000 on a watch that can be replicated for $300. They insist $100 mall-caliber shoes will "explode" after 3 wears. Meanwhile, they will pay $300 for a cloth duffle bag (Filson) and insist it's about quality. Spare me. All bullshit. It's all herd mentality here. It's just a different herd. Instead of just brand whoring, it's a mixture of brand whoring and seeking quality.
They also pretend stuff will last them 10 years, when in reality little beyond shoes are ever worn more than a few years without going out of style anyway. (Cue the 1% who defy this rule of thumb) In the last 3 years, even sport jackets have gone from long to short to long again. Ties go from wide to thin to medium. Ironically, only a fashion whore who loves shopping would be able to keep up with this anti-fashion mindset.
There is knowledge to be learned here. The best thing you can learn here is how to buy clothing that flatters your particular body type. (jackets, pants, and dress shirts). Proper fit is paramount here. You might develop a sense of color matching. You will also learn to appreciate simpler, less trendy "timeless gentleman" (I laugh every time I type that) clothing that is less likely to look regrettable a few years from now (wingtips vs. square toed shoes, solids vs. bold stripes, fitted vs baggy clothing, etc). You will also, to some extent, learn to avoid "logo brands" and expect more value for your money. While you may not actually get it b/c plenty of "SF approved" stuff here is overpriced and overhyped without the logo, you will at least try to discern what constitutes "quality", and aim for that instead of simply assuming "expensive = quality" You may still get ripped off, but just in a more tasteful, less mainstream way.


lurker[1].gif
post #54 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reevolving View Post

People here hate mainstream high-end b/c they're trying to be different. Their ego and identity are wrapped in what articles of clothing they purchase and wear. Think about people who love an indie band than hate them once they become mainstream.
First, the context is very important to understand. Many people here are broke and have no net worth or investments to speak of. They also earn a lot less money than you think. Everyone thinks everyone else is wildly successful. Many are still early in their career trajectory. Many only buy used clothing in order to look more wealthy than they are. They also mostly come from blue collar families, and think clothing will elevate them into a higher social class or get them a promotion. Of course, this is what poor people who buy LV bags also do, so people of SF are merely trying to be one step ahead. But, it's the same "low class" mindset that is driving the obsession on clothing.
High-end fashion brands are purchased for people to feel included in a group. The brands purchased by the SF poster is to exclude themselves from the group.
So, the difference is that they just spend money on different overpriced clothing to feel special and superior. Generally, if it's sold at a mall, it's not "cool". And if it's trendy "fashion", it's not cool either. Meanwhile, if Gucci, Burberry, Ferragamo, or LV put out the highest quality product ever at a Walmart price point, do you think people here would suddenly embrace this amazing value?
They insist that it's about quality and value, but it's not that simple. First, the quality aspect is vastly overstated, particularly from a diminishing returns point of view. For example, it's almost impossible to tell apart a fused jacket from fully canvassed. (Do a search, have a laugh at the "pinch test". Or the mythical "bubbling" effect after 1 supposed minute caught in the rain.) You can't tell silk from polyester without lighting it on fire. They insist $100 mall-caliber shoes will "explode" after 3 wears. They don't. Not even close. Meanwhile, they will pay $300 for a cloth duffle bag (Filson) and insist it's about value. They concoct all sorts of bizarre reasons to justify spending $5000 on a watch that can be replicated for $300. (Get a load of the Homage vs. Replica debate, in light of the "quality" justification) Spare me. All bullshit. It's all herd mentality here. It's just a different herd. Instead of just brand whoring, it's a mixture of alternative boutique brand whoring, granted with some eye on quality.
They also delude themselves into thinking items will last them 10 years, when in reality little beyond shoes are ever worn more than a few years without going out of style anyway. (Cue the 1% who defy this rule of thumb) In the last 3 years, even sport jackets have gone from long ....to short ....to who knows what. When short is in fashion, too long means it's old. When long is in fashion, too short is a woman's jacket. Tie fashion goes from wide ...to thin ....to medium. Ironically, only a fashion whore who loves shopping would be able to keep up with this anti-fashion mindset.
I am not throwing the baby out with the bathwater. There is worthwhile knowledge to be learned here. The best thing you can learn here is how to buy clothing that flatters your particular body type. (jackets, pants, and dress shirts). Proper fit is paramount here. Do not confuse this with the many arbitrary "rules" of fashion that are constantly changing (lapel width, jacket length, tie width, collar style, pant bagginess/rise, etc)
Let's talk style. You will also learn to appreciate simpler, less trendy "timeless gentleman" (LOL) clothing that is less likely to look regrettable a few years from now (wingtips vs. square toed shoes, solids vs. loud stripes, fitted vs baggy clothing, etc). You might develop a sense of color matching.
In the end you too will learn to avoid "logo brands", partly to expect more value for your money. While you may not actually get it b/c plenty of "SF approved" stuff here is overpriced and over-hyped even without the logo, you will at least try to discern what constitutes "quality", and aim for that instead of simply assuming "expensive = quality", as the masses who buy those fashion brands you mentioned do. For various articles of clothing, only you can decide the price point you are comfortable with, lest you still get ripped off, but just in a more tasteful, less mainstream way.

 

As harsh as your post may sound, I agree...And It's exactly the same way with other hobbies too.

 

All though, I do love SF for picking up general tips on fit, pattern/color combinations, etc... and once in a while some threads and tips from resident tailors. 

The cork-sniffing over small scale boutiques, not so much. 

post #55 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reevolving View Post

People here hate mainstream high-end b/c they're trying to be different. Their ego and identity are wrapped in what articles of clothing they purchase and wear. Think about people who love an indie band than hate them once they become mainstream.
First, the context is very important to understand. Many people here are broke and have no net worth or investments to speak of. They also earn a lot less money than you think. Everyone thinks everyone else is wildly successful. Many are still early in their career trajectory. Many only buy used clothing in order to look more wealthy than they are. They also mostly come from blue collar families, and think clothing will elevate them into a higher social class or get them a promotion. Of course, this is what poor people who buy LV bags also do, so people of SF are merely trying to be one step ahead. But, it's the same "low class" mindset that is driving the obsession on clothing.
High-end fashion brands are purchased for people to feel included in a group. The brands purchased by the SF poster is to exclude themselves from the group.
So, the difference is that they just spend money on different overpriced clothing to feel special and superior. Generally, if it's sold at a mall, it's not "cool". And if it's trendy "fashion", it's not cool either. Meanwhile, if Gucci, Burberry, Ferragamo, or LV put out the highest quality product ever at a Walmart price point, do you think people here would suddenly embrace this amazing value?
They insist that it's about quality and value, but it's not that simple. First, the quality aspect is vastly overstated, particularly from a diminishing returns point of view. For example, it's almost impossible to tell apart a fused jacket from fully canvassed. (Do a search, have a laugh at the "pinch test". Or the mythical "bubbling" effect after 1 supposed minute caught in the rain.) You can't tell silk from polyester without lighting it on fire. They insist $100 mall-caliber shoes will "explode" after 3 wears. They don't. Not even close. Meanwhile, they will pay $300 for a cloth duffle bag (Filson) and insist it's about value. They concoct all sorts of bizarre reasons to justify spending $5000 on a watch that can be replicated for $300. (Get a load of the Homage vs. Replica debate, in light of the "quality" justification) Spare me. All bullshit. It's all herd mentality here. It's just a different herd. Instead of just brand whoring, it's a mixture of alternative boutique brand whoring, granted with some eye on quality.
They also delude themselves into thinking items will last them 10 years, when in reality little beyond shoes are ever worn more than a few years without going out of style anyway. (Cue the 1% who defy this rule of thumb) In the last 3 years, even sport jackets have gone from long ....to short ....to who knows what. When short is in fashion, too long means it's old. When long is in fashion, too short is a woman's jacket. Tie fashion goes from wide ...to thin ....to medium. Ironically, only a fashion whore who loves shopping would be able to keep up with this anti-fashion mindset.
I am not throwing the baby out with the bathwater. There is worthwhile knowledge to be learned here. The best thing you can learn here is how to buy clothing that flatters your particular body type. (jackets, pants, and dress shirts). Proper fit is paramount here. Do not confuse this with the many arbitrary "rules" of fashion that are constantly changing (lapel width, jacket length, tie width, collar style, pant bagginess/rise, etc)
Let's talk style. You will also learn to appreciate simpler, less trendy "timeless gentleman" (LOL) clothing that is less likely to look regrettable a few years from now (wingtips vs. square toed shoes, solids vs. loud stripes, fitted vs baggy clothing, etc). You might develop a sense of color matching.
In the end you too will learn to avoid "logo brands", partly to expect more value for your money. While you may not actually get it b/c plenty of "SF approved" stuff here is overpriced and over-hyped even without the logo, you will at least try to discern what constitutes "quality", and aim for that instead of simply assuming "expensive = quality", as the masses who buy those fashion brands you mentioned do. For various articles of clothing, only you can decide the price point you are comfortable with, lest you still get ripped off, but just in a more tasteful, less mainstream way.

 

Relatively new to the "fashion" scene, but it is scarily similar to how the car modification scene operates which I have been a part of for many years now. Is all about trying to be a step ahead, and be "better" than everyone else, often by putting down the high end mainstream down. Very rare to run into people actually into it for the love of the hobby. 

post #56 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reevolving View Post

People here hate mainstream high-end b/c they're trying to be different. Lots of blather....

Just because you don't care about the differences doesn't mean that everyone else doesn't or can't tell - or to put it another way your ignorance isn't as good as my knowledge. Of course, if you are into being a baller with conspicuous consumption to impress people with even less knowledge than you - then go for it. A well-known brand requires marketing - just realize that you are paying for that ad campaign.

So a few questions:
  1. Fused versus canvassed - pretty easy to tell the difference in wear, whether it is worth it is another question. But why would you buy a fused suit made on the same machines as cheaper stuff with a label slapped on (e.g. Hugo Boss, some Armani, etc) versus something made to a higher standard at the same price?
  2. Prada selling nylon bags with a big logo on it? How is that a quality?
  3. Hermes quality is excellent, but why wouldn't you just go to April in Paris in SF, get her to make a custom bag for you at half price that is customized to your needs and higher quality?

OTOH - I agree that the Filson bag is a great example of cultish reverence for a brand name over durability; double-monks were totally a random SF-fad; etc. but what community doesn't have its own random trends.
post #57 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by harryx2 View Post


Because this sucks!

Personally I hate LV for suing artists and for using dubious claims of copyright infringement as a way of silence free speech and artistic freedom:

http://www.mediareport.nl/persrecht/07032011/louis-vuitton-sues-danish-artist-plesner-in-the-netherlands-over-depiction-of-bag-in-art-work/en/
post #58 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reevolving View Post

People here hate mainstream high-end b/c they're trying to be different. Their ego and identity are wrapped in what articles of clothing they purchase and wear. Think about people who love an indie band than hate them once they become mainstream.
First, the context is very important to understand. Many people here are broke and have no net worth or investments to speak of. They also earn a lot less money than you think. Everyone thinks everyone else is wildly successful. Many are still early in their career trajectory. Many only buy used clothing in order to look more wealthy than they are. They also mostly come from blue collar families, and think clothing will elevate them into a higher social class or get them a promotion. Of course, this is what poor people who buy LV bags also do, so people of SF are merely trying to be one step ahead. But, it's the same "low class" mindset that is driving the obsession on clothing.
High-end fashion brands are purchased for people to feel included in a group. The brands purchased by the SF poster is to exclude themselves from the group.
So, the difference is that they just spend money on different overpriced clothing to feel special and superior. Generally, if it's sold at a mall, it's not "cool". And if it's trendy "fashion", it's not cool either. Meanwhile, if Gucci, Burberry, Ferragamo, or LV put out the highest quality product ever at a Walmart price point, do you think people here would suddenly embrace this amazing value?
They insist that it's about quality and value, but it's not that simple. First, the quality aspect is vastly overstated, particularly from a diminishing returns point of view. For example, it's almost impossible to tell apart a fused jacket from fully canvassed. (Do a search, have a laugh at the "pinch test". Or the mythical "bubbling" effect after 1 supposed minute caught in the rain.) You can't tell silk from polyester without lighting it on fire. They insist $100 mall-caliber shoes will "explode" after 3 wears. They don't. Not even close. Meanwhile, they will pay $300 for a cloth duffle bag (Filson) and insist it's about value. They concoct all sorts of bizarre reasons to justify spending $5000 on a watch that can be replicated for $300. (Get a load of the Homage vs. Replica debate, in light of the "quality" justification) Spare me. All bullshit. It's all herd mentality here. It's just a different herd. Instead of just brand whoring, it's a mixture of alternative boutique brand whoring, granted with some eye on quality.
They also delude themselves into thinking items will last them 10 years, when in reality little beyond shoes are ever worn more than a few years without going out of style anyway. (Cue the 1% who defy this rule of thumb) In the last 3 years, even sport jackets have gone from long ....to short ....to who knows what. When short is in fashion, too long means it's old. When long is in fashion, too short is a woman's jacket. Tie fashion goes from wide ...to thin ....to medium. Ironically, only a fashion whore who loves shopping would be able to keep up with this anti-fashion mindset.
I am not throwing the baby out with the bathwater. There is worthwhile knowledge to be learned here. The best thing you can learn here is how to buy clothing that flatters your particular body type. (jackets, pants, and dress shirts). Proper fit is paramount here. Do not confuse this with the many arbitrary "rules" of fashion that are constantly changing (lapel width, jacket length, tie width, collar style, pant bagginess/rise, etc)
Let's talk style. You will also learn to appreciate simpler, less trendy "timeless gentleman" (LOL) clothing that is less likely to look regrettable a few years from now (wingtips vs. square toed shoes, solids vs. loud stripes, fitted vs baggy clothing, etc). You might develop a sense of color matching.
In the end you too will learn to avoid "logo brands", partly to expect more value for your money. While you may not actually get it b/c plenty of "SF approved" stuff here is overpriced and over-hyped even without the logo, you will at least try to discern what constitutes "quality", and aim for that instead of simply assuming "expensive = quality", as the masses who buy those fashion brands you mentioned do. For various articles of clothing, only you can decide the price point you are comfortable with, lest you still get ripped off, but just in a more tasteful, less mainstream way.

For once the dweeb said a few things that are true. You generally have mostly poor blue collar types on here who have some outdated notion of how their betters dress hence all the wingtip crap.And this nonsense about resoling shoes as if they're going to last 20 years is nonsense. If you have a dozen shoes it will take 10 years before you'd have to resole them and by that time the shoe is old and not worth spending a 1/3 of its values to resole so just throw  the old shoe away and buy new. Used clothes and thrift stores  are for the indigent  and the homeless.Only the poor whose time is worth nothing would waste it looking through all of the garbage. And he's also right about people who buy used clothes because they can't afford new ones who think buying old clothes that were once higher priced because you think it makes you look richer than you are. They don't and there's always something incongruous in the look. Many of these people as he said want you to believe they wear expensive brands while pretending they don't want people to know (they do) because they erroneously think they're imitating rich people which is bullshit because the rich don't care if the brand's logo or any identifying mark shows or doesn't show. They're not going to give up wearing Gucci just because you can tell the brand from the bit on the shoe. Or Lacoste just because it has a crocodile on it that they've been wearing it for 50 years.

They also claim that that don't like fashion but Style but almost everything they own is the latest fashion trend.lol8[1].gif The wealthy who you're vainly trying to imitate would never wear skin tight shirts or suits with sleeves that are too short ,and showing cuff is the sign of a prole.Long full length coats should never reach the calf and the proper length is top of the knee.

They agonise about what to wear to an interview thinking the clothes are going to get them the job.It won't. Just put on a suit  like eveyone else  and do your best. It's no big deal, it's a uniform that's all.Nobody is going to be imptressed with your clothes they just have to be appropriate for the job and it doesn't matter if you're wearing Lobb or Cole Haan shoes. A lot of wealthy guys just wear off the peg BB suits and don't even bother with alterations for minor things.And you have to learn how a shoe or jacketis supposed to fit because I've never seen so many guys who don't have a clue.Listen to the salesmen they know, you don't. Why would a salesman try to mislead you? He doesn't care what size shoe you buy and he's fitted thousands of men. And buying stuff  on the net just because you got it cheaper is dumb because most of the time it doesn't fit. If you're so poor that you have to worry about 50 bucks then you're buying things out of your class and I have to wonder where you even wear it in your Podunk town.

post #59 of 60

There´s loads of stuff that has been said already. Generally people try to aim at quality rather than brand name and the forum is useful for trying to figure out which brands are worth it and which one´s are overrated. There´s always a general tendency toward a particular brand with Hugo Boss getting teared apart and Brooks Brothers extolled for their price to quality ratio. Personally I cannot judge on suits but concerning leather stuff there has been loads of useful things with discerning Hermès as pretty good(which they are) and others as not being that good.

post #60 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reevolving View Post

People here hate mainstream high-end b/c they're trying to be different. Their ego and identity are wrapped in what articles of clothing they purchase and wear. Think about people who love an indie band than hate them once they become mainstream.
First, the context is very important to understand. Many people here are broke and have no net worth or investments to speak of. They also earn a lot less money than you think. Everyone thinks everyone else is wildly successful. Many are still early in their career trajectory. Many only buy used clothing in order to look more wealthy than they are. They also mostly come from blue collar families, and think clothing will elevate them into a higher social class or get them a promotion. 

 

I'm probably the opposite of what you describe when it comes to dressing to improve social status. My main concern instead is how can I dress well (and most of all comfortably) without looking like I'm well off. But that's hard in a country where wearing a shirt makes people think you dressed up. Sorry, but T-shirts look like shit on me and I'm uncomfortable as hell.

 

But I agree with most of you post.

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