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whnay.'s good taste thread - Page 571

post #8551 of 13313
Quote:
Originally Posted by edmorel View Post

Before you make any shirt decisions, read this thread:

http://www.styleforum.net/t/341010/the-oneshirt-a-phoenix-from-the-ashes-4-3-13-update-new-chambray-arrived/0_10

I followed that thread from the very beginning. It is one of the reasons I am getting new shirts. I think Foo is much more mature than me stylistically (If in no other way!) and his idea of simplifying his shirt wardrobe to something that will look good consistently, regardless of situation or pairing, is very inspiring. I think I will go back through the first 15 pages or so.
Quote:
Originally Posted by in stitches View Post

WC - i think your list is pretty sensible. though for me, id get all 3 broadcloths in non BDs considering that both oxfords are BDs. im also not super keen on the striped BD, id sooner get solid BDs and have one of the broadcloths in a tasteful smaller scale stripe, maybe a pencil stripe or candy stripe, blue and white, but YMMV. im also not a huge linen shirt fran, but thats just a personal preference, if you think you will use it, i see no reason not to have one. just my 2 cents.

thanks for the input IS. I think I will do some type of blue small scale striped shirt. I want to give the linen/ cotton blend dress shirt a try as Manton seems to love them for warm weather.
post #8552 of 13313
i start with socks (well underwear and and undershirt really), from there go to pants, then shoes, and then shirt. i put on the shirt afterwards to prevent unnecessary wrinkling from the movement when putting on the the other items, particularly tying my shoes.
post #8553 of 13313
Quote:
Originally Posted by dopey View Post

The first photo is a study in gloom and sadness, not saved by the square.

Sig-worthy.

Btw, sometimes it is difficult to tell if the vets fail to acknowledge a post because the outfit in question is in such (a) good taste that it goes without saying, or (b) bad taste that the outfit does not merit acknowledgement.

To my mind, JPHardy's last combination was very well-executed, but the vets are mum. If one of you (Ed, Foo, Dopey, Manton) could chime in, even if to explain how you might tweak a certain element, that would be helpful. This is the outfit to which I refer:

post #8554 of 13313
^ The Anna Karenina Principle, at work.
post #8555 of 13313
There is a conflict of interest in me saying anything about JP Hardy
post #8556 of 13313
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wallcloud View Post

I followed that thread from the very beginning. It is one of the reasons I am getting new shirts. I think Foo is much more mature than me stylistically (If in no other way!) and his idea of simplifying his shirt wardrobe to something that will look good consistently, regardless of situation or pairing, is very inspiring. I think I will go back through the first 15 pages or so.

Ed is screwing with you. In his earnest assessment, that thread should be avoided like the plague. He might be right to some extent.

However, it's worth noting that this whole "OneShirt" thing isn't really new. Easily 80% of my shirts are solid blue (60% if not counting OCBDs). It's always worked for me, so I finally just gave the concept a pithy name. You are by no means treading dangerous, uncharted territory.
post #8557 of 13313
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaymanS View Post


Cayman, I like your avatar but would love it if it was more fluid. Work on that.
post #8558 of 13313
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post

Ed is screwing with you. In his earnest assessment, that thread should be avoided like the plague. He might be right to some extent.

However, it's worth noting that this whole "OneShirt" thing isn't really new. Easily 80% of my shirts are solid blue (60% if not counting OCBDs). It's always worked for me, so I finally just gave the concept a pithy name. You are by no means treading dangerous, uncharted territory.


I think if anyone asked my thoughts on shirts, I would tell them that 80-90% of their shirts should be some sort of solid blue as that is pretty much what I wear so we are pretty much in the same boat.
post #8559 of 13313
Quote:
Originally Posted by edmorel View Post

I think if anyone asked my thoughts on shirts, I would tell them that 80-90% of their shirts should be some sort of solid blue as that is pretty much what I wear so we are pretty much in the same boat.

It's a crowded boat, with lots of really well-dressed men in it. That doesn't stop the masses of neophytes from impulsively recoiling from the idea.
post #8560 of 13313
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

Quote:

Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post


Thoughtful critique takes even more effort than shooting and uploading photos. I used to consider it worthwhile, as I believe it's infinitely more helpful than simply admiring an outfit. After all, an outfit is just a snapshot at the end of a long, intricately dynamic process. If you try to learn from an outfit, without working on understanding how it came to be, you are at best going to walk away with a neat costume idea. You have to develop and refine the process of dressing to improve your style. That involves thinking about clothes with far more care and consideration than you're probably used to, not so much buying the right tie on your next trip to the mall.

The problem is that very few people have the patience, confidence, and commitment to really learn this stuff. People here tend to take criticism of their clothing choices far too personally. They post outfits with the hidden assumption that they will, naturally, find nothing but applause and admiration. So, when someone with demonstrable taste explains that a proudly-posted outfit is actually no good, what is the result? Tantrums and sour grapes. Next thing you know, the person offering the critique is under attack. So, then, fuck it: Give me deets on that tie. It really pops! If you think that's obnoxious, you now know how I feel.

 

 

Point taken on the investment in thoughtful critique.  In fact, I wouldn't want critique from you if you weren't so thoughtful.  I have witnessed you run into the "f-it cause I like it crowd."  Manton too.  I know it frustrates you.  On the other hand, I know that your manner of expression comes off heavy-handed to some folks, and they perceive that you are talking down to them.  I don't know you, and won't form a conclusion in that debate.  I don't think that debate needs or even deserves to be resolved for an internet community.

 

As for me, I don't understand the thin skin--either theirs when critiqued or yours when your critique is rebuffed.  You couldn't possibly say anything that would offend me.  If i disliked your critique, I would consider it for what it is.   No more, no less.  But no tantrums.  No sour grapes.  I realize that some go that route.  So be it.  Ignore them and don't critique a post from them again.  But don't give up offering insight to those who have been receptive. (not so much plugging me, because i havent solicited your input until now, but there have been others who were receptive.)

post #8561 of 13313
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaymanS View Post

Sig-worthy.



To my mind, JPHardy's last combination was very well-executed, but the vets are mum. If one of you (Ed, Foo, Dopey, Manton) could chime in, even if to explain how you might tweak a certain element, that would be helpful. This is the outfit to which I refer:


Cayman, thank you for the kind words.

Manton can still see the mitered cuff, that will cause a fail.

Ed can't get past the pocket square, fail.

Foo, shirt is only 50% blue, not 100%, fail.

Dopey, I'm not too sure what makes him tick, yet.

Honestly, if one of the consigliere or all don't find my outfit in taste, as defined by this thread (which is impossible because they disagree with each other) my day is not ruined.

That being said, I post only fits, that I think would have a semblance to what is being looked for here.
post #8562 of 13313
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdude View Post

Point taken on the investment in thoughtful critique.  In fact, I wouldn't want critique from you if you weren't so thoughtful.  I have witnessed you run into the "f-it cause I like it crowd."  Manton too.  I know it frustrates you.  On the other hand, I know that your manner of expression comes off heavy-handed to some folks, and they perceive that you are talking down to them.  I don't know you, and won't form a conclusion in that debate.  I don't think that debate needs or even deserves to be resolved for an internet community.

As for me, I don't understand the thin skin--either theirs when critiqued or yours when your critique is rebuffed.  You couldn't possibly say anything that would offend me.  If i disliked your critique, I would consider it for what it is.   No more, no less.  But no tantrums.  No sour grapes.  I realize that some go that route.  So be it.  Ignore them and don't critique a post from them again.  But don't give up offering insight to those who have been receptive. (not so much plugging me, because i havent solicited your input until now, but there have been others who were receptive.)

I stand to gain nothing from offering critique other than good-willed, engaging discussion. So, my own annoyance has nothing to do with thin skin. It's the wasted time talking to people who don't actually want to talk about anything.

As for "talking down" to people and being "heavy-handed"--well, this isn't a dinner party. I would never comment on someone's clothing in a normal social situation, nor would I spend more than a moment noticing it to begin with. But this forum is not such a generalized environment. It's a gathering place specifically created for people to talk about a subject matter with depth and nuance that would otherwise be extremely socially awkward. Hence, I work on the assumption that you are all adults capable of digesting such commentary without needing your egos stroked and soothed. I'm talking about your clothes and the way you dress, not the quality of your characters. Unless you're a dick.
post #8563 of 13313
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPHardy View Post

. . .
Manton can still see the mitered cuff, that will cause a fail.
. . .
What does manton have against mitred barrel cuffs? Does he really care that much about cuff edges? My Dege barrel cuffs are two button, mitred. Lachter made two buttons with a curved edge. NSM does one button. If I cared about harmonizing them all, I would probably get two button mitred, but I don't. How can this choice matter in any way but petty preference?
post #8564 of 13313
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post



The problem is that very few people have the patience, confidence, and commitment to really learn this stuff. People here tend to take criticism of their clothing choices far too personally. They post outfits with the hidden assumption that they will, naturally, find nothing but applause and admiration. So, when someone with demonstrable taste explains that a proudly-posted outfit is actually no good, what is the result? Tantrums and sour grapes. Next thing you know, the person offering the critique is under attack. So, then, fuck it: Give me deets on that tie. It really pops! If you think that's obnoxious, you now know how I feel.

 

I hope I haven't been in this boat, at least it wasn't my intention. When I get harsh critique on a "proudly posted outfit" I will probably try to explain my choices, but not in a visceral way. How else would we spark some discussion? And most of the time I wear the same outfit again, it will be tweaked with last critique's suggestions, provided I have the elements to do it.

 

For a start, I'll say that I have returned to the foo-puff with my hanks. shog[1].gif

post #8565 of 13313
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post


I stand to gain nothing from offering critique other than good-willed, engaging discussion. So, my own annoyance has nothing to do with thin skin. It's the wasted time talking to people who don't actually want to talk about anything.

As for "talking down" to people and being "heavy-handed"--well, this isn't a dinner party. I would never comment on someone's clothing in a normal social situation, nor would I spend more than a moment noticing it to begin with. But this forum is not such a generalized environment. It's a gathering place specifically created for people to talk about a subject matter with depth and nuance that would normally be extremely socially awkward. Hence, I work on the assumption that you are all adults who are chiefly subject-oriented, an not here looking to have your sensitive egos stroked and soothed. I'm talking about your clothes and the way you dress, not the quality of your characters. Unless you're a dick.

 

To my mind, you are correct when you say you have nothing to gain other than engaging dialogue.  I admitted as much in my first diatribe that soliciting your feedback and that of others was selfish.  I am glad to hear that you are only annoyed and not more.  Chalk my perception of thin skin up to rubbish and re-engage in the critique process with only those who also share your desire to talk about classic mens dress.  I'll repeat my invitation to critique anything I post.  Perceptions of heavy handedness do not matter to me. 

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