Styleforum › Forums › Lifestyle › Entertainment and Culture › Soccer • Football • Voetbal • Fútbol • Calcio • Futebol - 2012-2013 Thread (Including EURO2012)
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Soccer • Football • Voetbal • Fútbol • Calcio • Futebol - 2012-2013 Thread (Including EURO2012) - Page 162

post #2416 of 4274
9/6/12 at 12:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by smallpond View Post

Wait until they get Heskey.

lol8[1].gif
Reply
Reply

Featured Stories on Styleforum

Fedora Lounge on Aero Leather jackets
If you need help with a wedding tux, interview suit, etc... check out Styleforum 101
The official Alden discussion thread
post #2417 of 4274
9/6/12 at 4:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian SD View Post

No, not quite, unless you're being extremely generous with your math. Porto doesn't get those players as cheaply as is reported (for example the 5.5m fee for Hulk was only for 50% of his rights, when they ponied up for another 30% of his rights, they paid 13m-ish), and they also don't get the full fee in return when they sell them since they rarely own 100% of the players. Again bringing up the Hulk example, the reported fee is 60 million but of that 40m was paid to Porto, the other 20 to third parties.

They still make a tidy profit, usually around 3-6m per year, but they have to sell a star player every year to be in the black. If they didn't sell players, they'd be making significant losses annually. Definitely not rolling in cash like many people would have you believe.

Their business model works for them since it allows them to dominate the league, but with the financial fair play regulations, English clubs will be looking to bring in talents from South America in at a younger age, thus dipping into Porto's main source of player. They could be in big trouble in the future.

do you have figures for more than one player or are your made up figures better than that image's made up figures ?

anyway, regardless of selling players or not, the fact remains they operate in a similar fashion to, say, Arsenal, but have won considerably more.

and the bit about FFP is great, if it ever gets implemented, which remains to be seen. I doubt it will without serious resistance from big clubs
Reply
Reply
post #2418 of 4274
9/6/12 at 4:12am
http://video.lequipe.fr/video/football/foot-and-co-diaby-peut-on-croire-en-lui/?sig=b9c51839e5cs
after 8 min mark.
Quote:

Basically, he said the following:
- Diaby had massive muscular imbalance issues and the rehab at Arsenal was not done well (implied on second part).
- Diaby had one leg that was a footballer's and another leg that was fit for a 10 year old (exact quote).
- The last 3 months were spent to strengthen his injured areas and regain proper balance.
- Also spent a lot of time working on getting the body to release the scar tissue from his injuries, which created irritation, and to reestablish proper flexibility in those areas.

This trainer was the one who trained Diaby during his only injury-free season (2009-2010). After that, Arsenal wanted Diaby to use the club's training and recovery methods (because they're cheap). Only in the last 4 months did Diaby request and receive authorization to return to this trainer.

* Video interpretation from Goallegacy.

watching video to see if it's accurate interpretation...
Reply
Reply
post #2419 of 4274
9/6/12 at 4:26am
Interestingly enough, Bacary Sagna went to Qatar for their apparently superior rehab facilities or something like that.
Reply
Reply
post #2420 of 4274
9/6/12 at 7:12am
Does anyone here watch the Fox Soccer Report (now Fox Soccer News)? confused.gif The old 'Report", while admittedly a low budget production w/ commentators ranging from decent (despite Canuck accents) to excellent (despite scots/irish brogues), news and highlights were presented in an organized fashion - you could watch a half hour and be up to date on the big 4, and if you were schedule savvy you could easily be on top of the next tier (Dutch, French, Belgian, Portuguese, etc.)

The new show is beyond awful. From the commentators eek.gif, to the format crazy.gif, to the content facepalm.gif, it is just unwatchable. ffffuuuu.gif
Edited by romafan - 9/6/12 at 10:44am
Reply
Reply
post #2421 of 4274
9/6/12 at 7:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by the shah View Post

do you have figures for more than one player or are your made up figures better than that image's made up figures ?
anyway, regardless of selling players or not, the fact remains they operate in a similar fashion to, say, Arsenal, but have won considerably more.
and the bit about FFP is great, if it ever gets implemented, which remains to be seen. I doubt it will without serious resistance from big clubs

It is not really like Arsenal except that the end result is that they sell their star players.

The situations surrounding the clubs are too different. Arsenal is playing in the strongest league in the world – they're under more pressure to perform as the competition is stiffer, and the stage is bigger. They wouldn't sell their star players if they weren't getting picked off and coerced by teams offering more money. Arsenal would rather have RVP, Cesc Fabregas, Gael Clichy, Alex Song, etc. than the players they have now, as good as Arteta and Santi Cazorla are.

Porto is afforded experimentation because they are far and away the strongest team in their league. If the experimentation comes off, its a hit. They also sell their players because they have to. It's their goal and their business model.

Arsenal would prefer to avoid selling their players, but the lure of Barcelona, Man City, trophies and $$$ is too great.

FFP will come off eventually. Teams like Manchester United, Liverpool and Arsenal are in staunch support of it, as well as smaller teams. Only Chelsea and City are against it. They will be overruled eventually. There will be in-league FFP rules as well, not just the Uefa rules that result in being barred from European competition.
Reply
Reply
post #2422 of 4274
9/6/12 at 8:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian SD View Post


It is not really like Arsenal except that the end result is that they sell their star players.

The situations surrounding the clubs are too different. Arsenal is playing in the strongest league in the world – they're under more pressure to perform as the competition is stiffer, and the stage is bigger. They wouldn't sell their star players if they weren't getting picked off and coerced by teams offering more money. Arsenal would rather have RVP, Cesc Fabregas, Gael Clichy, Alex Song, etc. than the players they have now, as good as Arteta and Santi Cazorla are.

Porto is afforded experimentation because they are far and away the strongest team in their league. If the experimentation comes off, its a hit. They also sell their players because they have to. It's their goal and their business model.

Arsenal would prefer to avoid selling their players, but the lure of Barcelona, Man City, trophies and $$$ is too great.

FFP will come off eventually. Teams like Manchester United, Liverpool and Arsenal are in staunch support of it, as well as smaller teams. Only Chelsea and City are against it. They will be overruled eventually. There will be in-league FFP rules as well, not just the Uefa rules that result in being barred from European competition.

I agree to some extent, well certainly about their positions affording them differences in experimentation. But I am more and more skeptical of the board and wenger's motives. the wage structure in place rewards useless players (djourou, the children like jenkinson, etc) who make much more compared to our top players versus in places like Manchester where the top earn considerably higher than the bottom. The wage gap at arsenal limits experienced players and encourages new/underexperienced ones to be signed. Then you get things like Walcott demanding 100k/week which is just a joke. Add to that the highest ticket prices in the leauge along with Wenger having the highest base salary (because everyone knows performance bonuses are a non-issue for him given the record for past 8 years) and you see the only true goal is top 4 to get that CL qualifier spot and with it cash to rinse and repeat. It's very frustrating.

The in-league FFP would be fantastic, but to get that as well as UEFA ones the corruption needs to be stamped out. Right now it would be too easy to buy someone on a governing body, especially with deep pockets like City and Chelsea have, let alone Madrid's bank ties, Milan's gov't connections, and new rich-boy clubs like PSG ... but in-league is how it was done in rugby, headed by Wigan (who dominated the league) so definitely needs a catalyst from the top...
Reply
Reply
post #2423 of 4274
9/6/12 at 8:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sagna 
"At Arsenal, you’re back from holidays, you prepare and you see two of the players leave when competition returns," Sagna told L'Equipe. "That’s the way it is since I am here. I’m used to it now.
"Van Persie, I expected it. All of us expected it. It was 'obvious', if I shall put it in English.
"But Alex Song for Barcelona… What a surprise. He is 24, he had three years left. I still can’t understand. It is a huge loss for the club."
Sagna has two years remaining on his own contract and, after admitting he felt jealous seeing former team-mates Gael Clichy and Samir Nasri win the Premier League last season, the defender said Arsenal have not made any effort to secure his future.
When asked if the club had approached him regarding a new contract, Sagna replied: "No. Nothing and nobody."
Quote:
He continued: "I am the only starting player left from 2007. In May, I watched City's parade on TV. I saw Samir and Gael lift the trophy. I want that [feeling]."

The France defender will be heading into the final year of his current deal at the end of the season, and maintains as yet there has been no talk over an extension.
Reply
Reply
post #2424 of 4274
9/6/12 at 8:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by romafan View Post

Does anyone here watch the Fox Soccer Report (now Fox Soccer News)? confused.gif While admittedly a low budget production w/ commentators ranging from decent (despite Canuck accents) to excellent (despite scots/irish brogues), tews and highlights were presented in an organized fashion - you could watch a half hour and be up to date on the big 4, and if you were schedule savvy you could easily be on top of the next tier (Dutch, French, Belgian, Portuguese, etc.)
The new show is beyond awful. From the commentators eek.gif, to the format crazy.gif, to the content facepalm.gif, it is just unwatchable. ffffuuuu.gif

I used to watch FSR all the time, but they added the background music while you are watching the highlights and you can't focus on what the announcers are saying. The old show was better. I like bobby McMahon and the Irish dude.
Reply
Reply
post #2425 of 4274
9/6/12 at 9:01am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian SD View Post

It is not really like Arsenal except that the end result is that they sell their star players.
The situations surrounding the clubs are too different. Arsenal is playing in the strongest league in the world – they're under more pressure to perform as the competition is stiffer, and the stage is bigger. They wouldn't sell their star players if they weren't getting picked off and coerced by teams offering more money. Arsenal would rather have RVP, Cesc Fabregas, Gael Clichy, Alex Song, etc. than the players they have now, as good as Arteta and Santi Cazorla are.
Porto is afforded experimentation because they are far and away the strongest team in their league. If the experimentation comes off, its a hit. They also sell their players because they have to. It's their goal and their business model.
Arsenal would prefer to avoid selling their players, but the lure of Barcelona, Man City, trophies and $$$ is too great.
FFP will come off eventually. Teams like Manchester United, Liverpool and Arsenal are in staunch support of it, as well as smaller teams. Only Chelsea and City are against it. They will be overruled eventually. There will be in-league FFP rules as well, not just the Uefa rules that result in being barred from European competition.

Without it there really is no league. City will back it if they ever win PL title outright, but until then spending is their edge.
Reply
Reply
post #2426 of 4274
9/6/12 at 9:17am
It will surprise people to learn that Chelsea is looking pretty good under FFP. It helps to have a lot of players under contract that are grandfathered in ('09 is the cutoff I believe), but the CL money is the main thing. They are also planning for the future well by signing young, 2-contract players, which spares them the cost of a transfer fee on the later contract assuming they work out.

But Italian teams are apparently in real trouble.

Here is a blog post on it. I didn't read the whole thing, but its conclusions are similar to those I have seen before:


"After all these adjustments, most of the English clubs look to be well placed for FFP. Even Chelsea’s FFP loss has come down to only £8 million, which is well within the acceptable deviations and helps explain why they felt that they could continue spending in this summer’s transfer window, especially as their income will be boosted by more revenue from their Champions League triumph.

The only club that looks vulnerable is Manchester City, whose loss for FFP is still a frightening £142 million. Indeed, the club’s sporting director Brian Marwood admitted, “We’ve got a huge amount of work ahead of us to make sure we are sustainable.” They will benefit from rapid revenue growth, both in terms of distributions from the Champions League and (especially) new commercial deals, but the chances are that their losses will still be well beyond UEFA’s limits in the short-term."

http://swissramble.blogspot.ch/2012/09/uefas-ffp-regulations-play-to-win.html
Reply
Reply
post #2427 of 4274
9/6/12 at 10:05am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DLester View Post

It will surprise people to learn that Chelsea is looking pretty good under FFP. It helps to have a lot of players under contract that are grandfathered in ('09 is the cutoff I believe), but the CL money is the main thing. They are also planning for the future well by signing young, 2-contract players, which spares them the cost of a transfer fee on the later contract assuming they work out.
But Italian teams are apparently in real trouble.
Here is a blog post on it. I didn't read the whole thing, but its conclusions are similar to those I have seen before:

"After all these adjustments, most of the English clubs look to be well placed for FFP. Even Chelsea’s FFP loss has come down to only £8 million, which is well within the acceptable deviations and helps explain why they felt that they could continue spending in this summer’s transfer window, especially as their income will be boosted by more revenue from their Champions League triumph.
The only club that looks vulnerable is Manchester City, whose loss for FFP is still a frightening £142 million. Indeed, the club’s sporting director Brian Marwood admitted, “We’ve got a huge amount of work ahead of us to make sure we are sustainable.” They will benefit from rapid revenue growth, both in terms of distributions from the Champions League and (especially) new commercial deals, but the chances are that their losses will still be well beyond UEFA’s limits in the short-term."
http://swissramble.blogspot.ch/2012/09/uefas-ffp-regulations-play-to-win.html

Didn't know about the '09 cutoff. No wonder Madrid was so keen on snagging Ronaldo, Kaká, Alonso, and Benzema that year. All making sense now.

Since then Özil, Khedira (both young signings off a good WC), Coentrão, and now Modric, I guess. Meh. We'll see.

I think FFP will get thrown out fairly quickly either way. You can't cap business - even terminally failing ones.
Reply
Reply
post #2428 of 4274
9/6/12 at 5:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DLester View Post

It will surprise people to learn that Chelsea is looking pretty good under FFP. It helps to have a lot of players under contract that are grandfathered in ('09 is the cutoff I believe), but the CL money is the main thing. They are also planning for the future well by signing young, 2-contract players, which spares them the cost of a transfer fee on the later contract assuming they work out.
But Italian teams are apparently in real trouble.
Here is a blog post on it. I didn't read the whole thing, but its conclusions are similar to those I have seen before:

"After all these adjustments, most of the English clubs look to be well placed for FFP. Even Chelsea’s FFP loss has come down to only £8 million, which is well within the acceptable deviations and helps explain why they felt that they could continue spending in this summer’s transfer window, especially as their income will be boosted by more revenue from their Champions League triumph.
The only club that looks vulnerable is Manchester City, whose loss for FFP is still a frightening £142 million. Indeed, the club’s sporting director Brian Marwood admitted, “We’ve got a huge amount of work ahead of us to make sure we are sustainable.” They will benefit from rapid revenue growth, both in terms of distributions from the Champions League and (especially) new commercial deals, but the chances are that their losses will still be well beyond UEFA’s limits in the short-term."
http://swissramble.blogspot.ch/2012/09/uefas-ffp-regulations-play-to-win.html

Interesting. Good about on Swiss Ramble by the way. I read that blog religiously. I must have missed that part about Chelsea though. After their seemingly bottomless spending this summer it seemed like they were just up and tossing the idea of FFP qualification. CL money does go a long way to recouping expenses though.

By the way, I'm sure you've seen the info about the new TV money coming next year? Teams that get relegated will earn more money than City did winning the title last year. Insanity!

I think it's encouraging for the PL. A few years ago I would have much preferred to watch La Liga's smaller teams than the Premier League's. It was really only Arsenal, United and Liverpool that played fluid, passing football in the latter part of the decade, but now we have Swansea, Wigan, Norwich, Spurs, etc. lots of teams picking up on te high tempo pass and press game. It'll be good for the league getting money for these teams. And relegating Stoke. Please?
Reply
Reply
post #2429 of 4274
9/6/12 at 5:23pm
Thread Starter 
I'm almost ready to declare an EPL allegiance to Swansea. I've reserved myself from siding with any particular English team for years now, and might finally be ready to make a decision.
Reply
Reply
post #2430 of 4274
9/6/12 at 6:30pm
For some reason I knew you'd read that blog bran...
Quote:
At this point we should pause to recall a story that Emmanuel Eboué once told a small gathering of journalists in London. As Eboué tells it, with a hearty laugh, when he first arrived at Arsenal, Kolo Touré was extremely helpful and even put him up in his own home for many months, insisting that they stay there every time Eboué suggested it was time he got his own place. Eboué said he was bowled over by his compatriot's generosity … until he found out that the house was owned by Arsenal and that Touré had instructed the club to take Eboué's share of the rent straight out of his wages! The Mill mentions this now because the Turkish transfer window does not close until later today, Manchester City and Galatasaray are discussing a transfer of Touré and the Turkish club's manager has said: "We're interested in Kolo and hope we can ask his former team-mate Emmanuel Eboué for help if we need it ..."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/sep/04/football-transfer-rumours-cristiano-ronaldo-psg

laugh.gif
Reply
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Entertainment and Culture

Featured Stories on Styleforum

Fedora Lounge on Aero Leather jackets
If you need help with a wedding tux, interview suit, etc... check out Styleforum 101
The official Alden discussion thread
Styleforum › Forums › Lifestyle › Entertainment and Culture › Soccer • Football • Voetbal • Fútbol • Calcio • Futebol - 2012-2013 Thread (Including EURO2012)