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killing Trayvon - Page 107

post #1591 of 6250
Quote:
Originally Posted by PipersSon View Post

Lucidly surmised.
You must not be drunk all the time. Unless alcohol gives you your bright moments.

I believe his ilk refer to it as "a moment of clarity."
post #1592 of 6250
Quote:
Originally Posted by munchausen View Post

If his lawyer is good, he might be able to get the "stand down" excluded, since it's of questionable relevance at best. Not that anyone hasn't heard it by now.

I don't think the relevance is all that questionable in a depraved heart theory murder case. The central issue in the case is going to be Z's state of mind, and almost everything Z said, did, or heard is going to be fair game. The prosecution will argue that Z's actions after hearing the dispatcher's instruction/suggestion/order illustrate reckless indifference. The defense will argue that a dispatcher does not have the authority to issue an order to a citizen, so it is irrelevant. My guess is that it probably comes in, but with a limiting instruction (for whatever good that would do Z).
post #1593 of 6250
Quote:
Originally Posted by edinatlanta View Post

It actually is.
Yeah, they have really good eye candy and not like in a way where its like wow look at that bombshell but like a "wow, that's a real girl and she's fucking hot" which makes her more attractive. At least to me.

What's important whether or not Z was asked to stand down or whether that request came from a police dispatcher vs. a law enforcement officer? Or is it both?
post #1594 of 6250
Even if there is a principal/agent relationship between the homeowner's association and Zimmerman, it's going to be difficult to pin liability on the association. The association can argue quite persuasively that Zimmerman's actions were ultra vires, particularly if it has a policy against neighborhood watchmen carrying firearms and/or confronting suspects.
post #1595 of 6250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tck13 View Post

Hopefully there's a Homowner's Association involved in all of this and they get sued.

Why do you feel this way?
post #1596 of 6250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambulance Chaser View Post

Even if there is a principal/agent relationship between the homeowner's association and Zimmerman, it's going to be difficult to pin liability on the association. The association can argue quite persuasively that Zimmerman's actions were ultra vires, particularly if it has a policy against neighborhood watchmen carrying firearms and/or confronting suspects.

Agreed, there's a lot that could affect this one way or the other. As I said, I don't know if this is the woman's intention, just her association with that slime Sharpton makes me question it.
post #1597 of 6250
I'm finding it hard to see how he has agency for the community, as a self-appointed neighborhood watch. If I ignore the crazy dude down the street who likes to patrol the neighborhood, does he represent me? I used to have a neighbor just like this - he had a whole arsenal of homemade edged weapons, and he liked to chase people he thought were dealing drugs out of the neighborhood, even going so far as to attack a guys car with a battleaxe (which was awesome, BTW).
post #1598 of 6250
Quote:
Originally Posted by retronotmetro View Post

I don't think the relevance is all that questionable in a depraved heart theory murder case. The central issue in the case is going to be Z's state of mind, and almost everything Z said, did, or heard is going to be fair game. The prosecution will argue that Z's actions after hearing the dispatcher's instruction/suggestion/order illustrate reckless indifference. The defense will argue that a dispatcher does not have the authority to issue an order to a citizen, so it is irrelevant. My guess is that it probably comes in, but with a limiting instruction (for whatever good that would do Z).
There's some relevance as to state of mind, but I think it's FAR more prejudicial than it is probative.
post #1599 of 6250
Quote:
Originally Posted by harvey_birdman View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambulance Chaser View Post

Even if there is a principal/agent relationship between the homeowner's association and Zimmerman, it's going to be difficult to pin liability on the association. The association can argue quite persuasively that Zimmerman's actions were ultra vires, particularly if it has a policy against neighborhood watchmen carrying firearms and/or confronting suspects.

Agreed, there's a lot that could affect this one way or the other. As I said, I don't know if this is the woman's intention, just her association with that slime Sharpton makes me question it.


+1
post #1600 of 6250
It's really amazing that every time 16-ton posts, he manages to make himself look stupider. And this is after 80+ posts in this thread! That must be some sort of CE single-thread record.
post #1601 of 6250
Quote:
Originally Posted by imatlas View Post

I'm finding it hard to see how he has agency for the community, as a self-appointed neighborhood watch. If I ignore the crazy dude down the street who likes to patrol the neighborhood, does he represent me? I used to have a neighbor just like this - he had a whole arsenal of homemade edged weapons, and he liked to chase people he thought were dealing drugs out of the neighborhood, even going so far as to attack a guys car with a battleaxe (which was awesome, BTW).

Yeah I think this is a non-starter as a law suit against the complex. If Zimmerman has homeowners or renter's insurance then you might go after that, but you've still got to prove negligence instead of a purposeful act.
post #1602 of 6250
It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if the family was planning to sue the HOA. But calling Zimmerman their agent because he was part of some vaguely endorsed neighborhood watch is really, really tenuous.

It also strikes me as unlikely that the HOA's insurance policy completely excludes intentional acts of employees. Intentional and negligent are often interwoven in a vicarious liability / respondeat superior case -- like, for example, negligent hiring, negligent supervision, and so forth and so on. There's also the specter of liability for intentional acts done "in furtherance of the employer's business."
post #1603 of 6250
Aruba, Jamaica, ooo I wanna take ya, to some place cheaper, how about Denny's?
post #1604 of 6250
Quote:
Originally Posted by imatlas View Post

I'm finding it hard to see how he has agency for the community, as a self-appointed neighborhood watch. If I ignore the crazy dude down the street who likes to patrol the neighborhood, does he represent me? I used to have a neighbor just like this - he had a whole arsenal of homemade edged weapons, and he liked to chase people he thought were dealing drugs out of the neighborhood, even going so far as to attack a guys car with a battleaxe (which was awesome, BTW).

I don't know Z's relationship to the community, but it appears he was more than "self-appointed".
Quote:
This is from the September 2012 Homeowners Association newsletter itself
Neighborhood Watch & Crime in the Community
We have recently experienced an increased incidence of crime within the community including three break-ins in the past month, which is why having residents committed to being members of the Neighborhood Watch and reporting suspicious activities is so important. We must send a message that we will not tolerate this in our community! If you have any information on these crimes or witness suspicious activity, please contact the Sanford PD at 407-688-5199. Your call can be anonymous. Having an active Neighborhood Watch can reduce crime by 80%. To receive Neighborhood Watch updates, safety tips and be notified of any suspicious activity within your community Call George Zimmerman at (I, Catherina, redacted the phone number) or email RTL neighborhoodwatch@gmail.com to get involved. You can also call Sanford PD to schedule free “vacation checks” when you go out of town as well as free home security inspections to help you burglar-proof your home. Go to www.crimemapping.com and click on Sanford PD for more crime reports from this community.

http://www.theyoungturks.com/story/2012/4/4/95557/80469/Diary/Will-someone-please-get-this-to-Cenk-Zimmerman-was-official-neighborhood-watch-captain

And apparently I'm not the first person to think of this.

http://www.wsvn.com/news/articles/local/21007169090699/
post #1605 of 6250
http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/homeowner-association-sued-martin-case-16099584#.T4cXv1GrmWg

Yep, Martin's parents are going to sue the HOA. I kind of figured the "family lawyers" were plaintiff's lawyers. Every time I hear them speak I cringe--sleazy and dull.

I like how the article also seemingly attributes a statement to the HOA's attorneys, as if they would say such a thing:
Quote:
Under the heading "Neighborhood Watch," the newsletter's message recommended that residents first call police and then "please contact our Captain, George Zimmerman ... so he can be aware and help address the issue with other residents."

That seeming endorsement of Zimmerman exposes the 7-year-old association to possible legal action by Martin's parents, homeowners association attorneys said.

Scummy hack lawyers and scummy hack journalists together again.
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