Androgynous men's wear

Some of you may remember, I posted a thread back in August asking for help to find men's clothing that fit me: http://www.styleforum.net/t/263421/clothes-for-skinny-boys-men
I sorta fell off the map after this post, but I received a lot of good advice from the thread and used it to search for a new wardrobe. I've accepted the fact that no matter what I wear most people are going to think I'm a woman, so I'm just going to own it.
It's taken a while to find some cloths that fit me and look decent, but I've had some good success. I suspect I am going to have to get a suit tailored to my body because of my build... I hope to do that really soon =)
Anyway, I wanted to get some input, maybe some more shopping ideas, and if possible find more guys like myself... although, I know most guys don't have my problem =)
Since changing my look I've been getting approached by a lot of photographers to stand in front of their camera. These are two photos from a shoot I did last week... if anyone has any ideas or recommendations for cloths or places to shop please let me know.

Standing up straight would help. My personal take is that a good part of masculinity is projected from the inside and begins with posture and attitude. On the other hand, looking like a woman could be an interesting ploy in getting the ladies' attention. Let us know how that comes out . . .

Van Welcome to Styleforum.
Androgynous appearance would basically be half male and hald female and onlookers may not be able to determine if you are male of female at a glance or even under longer scrutiny.
You have exceptionally good looks and good symmetry.
If it will help, I have struggled with this myself all my life. I was always confused by others as being female because I also have feminine features.
My question to you is how do you feel inside, before the clothing?
If you are male body but identify inwardly as female, then you would be suffering from a medical condition called Gender Dysphoria and would therefore be, what is referred to as 'Transgendered'.
If on the other hand you are male body and identify inwardly as male then you are male through and through.
You definitely have feminine features in your face and make no mistake there are millions of people who would want your good looks, male or female.
Perhaps you could clarify for us how you feel in your mind....male or female.
If male, then we could make suggestions further but if female, then this will be a medical gender issue and you would need professional medical assistance in these matters.

I will second what Man of lint says about how you feel. You need to settle this in your mind and then dressing will be crystal clear.

From what i read quickly so far It is a little confusing to determine your exact goals and this is perhaps because this is not clear to you either? The stronger theme is that you like looking like a woman but want to dress in a more androgynous manner or downright manly just to hang on a bit to the male experience. That's OK but I believe you over estimate the power of cloths.

Although on casual glance you have a the appearance of a woman you still retain certain male features and characteristics. I think this is where you have more power to play the androgynous look. For instance have you considered shaving your head? This would not alter most female characteristics but would add a strong male vibe. This could put you squarely in the "difficult to determine gender"

If on another hand everything is fine and settled in your mind and just want to play around with male cloths, than you have gotten some good advice in the previous thread. In this arena I also think you could really experiment a bit with custom work that incorporates both male and female clothing elements. Also have a look at the females in guys garb thread for ideas.

If on another hand you just want to earn some respect or recognition from your peers or coworkers than clothing will not likely help here either. And maybe you don't need their respect.

You dress and wear your hair in a way that suggests you wish to be perceived as feminine. If that is what you like, great. I'm not sure this is the best place to ask for tips on perfecting the look. Thom Browne, maybe? You might want to look at some of the stuff on the Streetwear and Denim forum here as well.

In any case, you'd have to cut your hair to complete the look in my book.

To be honest your first picture doesn't look like you're wearing men's clothing, rather than clothes are one size too big on you. I think you can purchase everything in the first photo J. Crew and Club Monaco in the women's section.

OlSarge said:

Standing up straight would help. My personal take is that a good part of masculinity is projected from the inside and begins with posture and attitude. On the other hand, looking like a woman could be an interesting ploy in getting the ladies' attention. Let us know how that comes out . . .

Click to expand...

Lol the ladies attention huh? Believe it or not, I do exceptionally well with girls, unfortunately for the ladies though... I'm not very interested in them =) Although, I will date them from time to time though. Image if you woke up tomorrow and you were a woman, how easy it would be for you to find a boyfriend simply because you know how a mans mind works.. Well, although I was born male, I use to be a woman... I lived many years of my life as a girl, so getting girls is pretty simple when you know how they think.

Standing straight up is actually a really good idea, that didn't really cross my mind... I'll try that in my next photoshoot =)

Man Of Lint said:

Van Welcome to Styleforum.
Androgynous appearance would basically be half male and hald female and onlookers may not be able to determine if you are male of female at a glance or even under longer scrutiny.
You have exceptionally good looks and good symmetry.
If it will help, I have struggled with this myself all my life. I was always confused by others as being female because I also have feminine features.
My question to you is how do you feel inside, before the clothing?
If you are male body but identify inwardly as female, then you would be suffering from a medical condition called Gender Dysphoria and would therefore be, what is referred to as 'Transgendered'.
If on the other hand you are male body and identify inwardly as male then you are male through and through.
You definitely have feminine features in your face and make no mistake there are millions of people who would want your good looks, male or female.
Perhaps you could clarify for us how you feel in your mind....male or female.
If male, then we could make suggestions further but if female, then this will be a medical gender issue and you would need professional medical assistance in these matters.

Click to expand...

Yes, I have been diagnosed with gender dysphoria... many years ago. I am actually legally female according to my license, passport and all other government identification. Actually, I had to dress like a woman today so I wouldn't have any trouble passing the background check when I went to buy a new gun =)
I really appreciate the input though, that was very insightful of you to spot that. As I stated in my reply to the quote above yours, I've lived most of my 20s as a woman. I enjoy it, and honestly most of my friends don't even know I'm a guy, but I wouldn't say I'm completely happy this way. I miss being a guy, so I'm been going for a more androgynous look lately. My voice is unmistakably female, so everyone still calls me ma'am, but I miss being one of the boys. So, it seems the best compromise for me is to just be both... be androgynous, be a man, and when I need to, be a woman. For most work related things (presentations, board meetings, etc) I have to be a woman because I was employeed as such, and that's how everyone knows me... so, there is no way to go completely back to a man unless I quit my job. Inside I feel like a woman, no doubt about that... but I have male urges too that I can't deny.

So, I would like to find some place to get androgynous men's wear. It's easy to shop for female cloths and be androgynous, but it makes me favor a more feminine side... I would like to be androgynous and favor a more male side, which can really only be accomplished by incorporating men's cloths into my wardrobe. I don't really own any men's cloths, and as you may have already figured out... I don't know men's fashion. Shopping for men's cloths is like a foreign language to me, I really haven't spent much time doing it. So, any suggestions for slim fitting androgynous men's apparel would be amazing =)

plei89 said:

In any case, you'd have to cut your hair to complete the look in my book.
To be honest your first picture doesn't look like you're wearing men's clothing, rather than clothes are one size too big on you. I think you can purchase everything in the first photo J. Crew and Club Monaco in the women's section.

Click to expand...

Unfortunately I can't cut my hair =( If you think I look like a woman now, wait until I cut my hair... I have to use my hair to hide my face and my jawline.

See what I mean? =)

I'd hit it.

Didn't the lead singer from The Human League have his hair like that about 30 years ago?

As I understand then, these are your stats:
You are 5'-8" tall
120 lbs
look female
have a female voice.
You've had Laser done so no beard growth option.
You won't cut your hair.
You miss the male part of you and want to reconnect with it but through clothing.

Essentially then the task at hand is to, with clothing, have you pass as male on the street.
I'll offer some suggestions and perhaps others will too.
I am really studying your photos and I see some possibilities.
The biggest obstacle I see is your long hair.
Perhaps you can conceal it under a fedora.
A button down collared shirt will show less of your neck and therefore add a masculine touch.
Though I am no good at PhotoShop, I tried an experiment with you in a trench coat....



This is something you can also do at home, just play with Photoshop and see what look appeals to you.
Mainly I would advise to steer clear of form fitting clothes. Your face is feminine enough so the clothes should contrast somewhat.
I hope this is a start.

Quote:


I've never heard of this band... But I just looked him up and he did have a similar hairstyle. His was more combed over the top which seems to give a more boyish appearance, I am have to try that. His jaw is pretty strong though, but his style is great and he's very attractive... Well, was before aging set in Pretty men often look very strange when they age... Sorta like Johnny depp, Leo and brad Pitt.. They all look kinda weird now in my opinion, but are still attractive.

Man Of Lint said:

As I understand then, these are your stats:
You are 5'-8" tall
120 lbs
look female
have a female voice.
You've had Laser done so no beard growth option.
You won't cut your hair.
You miss the male part of you and want to reconnect with it but through clothing.
Essentially then the task at hand is to, with clothing, have you pass as male on the street.
I'll offer some suggestions and perhaps others will too.
I am really studying your photos and I see some possibilities.
The biggest obstacle I see is your long hair.
Perhaps you can conceal it under a fedora.

Click to expand...

Hahaha that photoshopping is hilarious... I'm so glad you did that. I didn't even realize it was me at first glance until I read the post.
Yes you are right... 5'8" 120 lbs, I'm not cutting my hair... at least not all the way off. I spent years growing it this long, and trust me when it was short I got called ma'am everywhere i went too. Basically yes I am trying to pass as male... but I don't want to completely conceal my body... I want style. I'm going to figure this out... it just may take time =)

This will be fun... I actually have a picture in a fedora. This is a man's shirt too, but for some reason it looks girly on me. I dressed like this one day over the summer to try and pass as male...

lulz....yeah sorry about that...I never had a proper lesson with Photoshop...it's the thought that counts right?
If you provide one good frontal shot with your hair pulled back that would be better. There are some members here who are wizards with Photoshop and would do a much better job than me.
I really feel you should go with a button down collar. Seeing your neck and shoulder lines is too fem for mens clothes so you will need to cover up. A higher collar will achieve this.
With pants, avoid ultra slim fit. Again, you'll want to tone down the curves on your body. Men, on average, are more straight lines and chisled so we have to find a way to roughen up your appearance.
Perhaps some boots like Red Wing or Wolverine 1,000 mile will be an option.



VanBurnham said:

Hahaha that photoshopping is hilarious... I'm so glad you did that.  I didn't even realize it was me at first glance until I read the post. 
Yes you are right... 5'8" 120 lbs, I'm not cutting my hair... at least not all the way off.  I spent years growing it this long, and trust me when it was short I got called ma'am everywhere i went too.  Basically yes I am trying to pass as male... but I don't want to completely conceal my body... I want style.  I'm going to figure this out... it just may take time =)

This will be fun... I actually have a picture in a fedora.  This is a man's shirt too, but for some reason it looks girly on me.  I dressed like this one day over the summer to try and pass as male... 

Click to expand...

I may be way off the mark here, but It strikes me that your "male" clothing is all of the kind that is designed to show off "masculine" traits. I know a guy with the same shirt and he looks very manly because he has huge muscles. Loose fittings, drape, scooped necks are all meant to show off a super-masculine frame. You don't have one, which makes the clothing look feminine.

If you want to look masculine you need to look at structured clothing which hides "flaws" (in this case a lack of muscle and bulk is a flaw because it doesn't achieve the look you're after). Consider collared shirts, jackets with more shoulder padding than you usually like and denim with a little more "slouch" than yhou might otherwise look for.

The fact is, you have the frame of a model, which means a good designer can work wonders, but you have to select clothing that was designed with your goals in mind.

I say look at this list and slowly buy the stuff that you are interested in. You can probably incorporate some classic male items into your current wardrobe. Mix and match male items and female items, have fun with it.

http://putthison.com/post/712103418/the-essential-mans-wardrobe-perhaps-the-most

I think you are going to have to do a lot of trying on. But when you do, look at the fit of the clothes. If you want to come across as a male, or have your clothing be more masculine then make sure they enhance you in areas that are inherently masculine. This means strong shoulders, not too hour-glassy, that sort of thing. Make sure your pants fit less like woman's pants. Straight down from your rear-end and then a slight taper starting at your knee. I think jackets could really help you out too. Here is a simple guide about how they should fit a male frame.

http://putthison.com/post/9394551419/three-basic-points-of-fit-waist-shoulder

Maybe look up some photographs of Fred Astaire. He was a very slight man, but also one of the best dressed men of the last century. Much of his clothing isn't reasonable now, or wouldn't fit your style but at least look at his silhouette.

I think posture and make up will make a big deal too. In the first post, the top picture looks (to my eye) like it's of a woman in male-styled female clothing. The second picture though, you are standing up straight mostly, and your skin tone is much more even because of the filter or a lack of make up. I think that helps a lot too. In that picture you look like a man, just an effeminate one, which I think is what you are going for.

Your hair makes it hard too. You could think about getting it cut shorter, like a bit above your shoulders. Then you can google "mens long hair" and "womans short hair" and just style your hair differently depending on your situation?

Well there's my three or four cents. God, I need to go to bed.