A view on Neapolitan shirtmakers and hand finishes

mafoofan said:

F. Corbera said:

My NsM shirts have little nubs. This probably means that they are harder to do than the large ones on your Matuozzos, the ones that look like my avatar.

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How much is done by hand other than the nubs? Collar attachment? Side seams?

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I am not 100 sure about what you mean about numbs, but if you mean smallar thread pick, rather then difficult these are time consuming (in relative terms as these women can hand sew faster the i can type). The straightness and frequency of the hand pick shows the skills. The ticker thread some time used on the front shoulder/yoke, that is just a stylistic choice. Again, the number of hand steps, adding the side seams and hems, should had around 20-30 euro more to the cost of a shirt...

Again most shirtmakers may use the same group of home seamstress for hand sewing, so the quality is relative. Does Anna Matuozzo do everything herself? I doubt it.



patrickBOOTH said:

I see, how many different cutters are employed?

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Don't know the exact number. Somewhere between 5 and 10, I think.

quar said:

Not really enough wear to justify the cost, is it.
What's your new sweet spot for longevity versus softness / luxury in your Geneva orders?

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5-6 years per shirt would be nice. I don't mind some minor fraying. The problem is that the Riva cotton has totally worn through. Where the collar folds, there is a large, gaping hole straight through to the interlining. But more important is the cost. Geneva charges $250-80 a shirt, for any Alumo fabric of your choice. Hard to beat that.

My evening shirt is the first shirt I've had made with Alumo. It's very, very nice. Don't miss the Riva at all.

F. Corbera said:

I hope so.

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He is self-aware of his showmanship and how it contrasts to the traditional way of doing things. That's very encouraging to me.

F. Corbera said:

Did you think to use CVS cloth tape?

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We do Duane Reade in NYC.



marcodalondra said:

Does Anna Matuozzo do everything herself? I doubt it.

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Of course not. She probably hasn't sewn anything herself in a long time. Her contribution is fitting and oversight.



mafoofan said:

Don't know the exact number. Somewhere between 5 and 10, I think.
5-6 years per shirt would be nice. I don't mind some minor fraying. The problem is that the Riva cotton has totally worn through. Where the collar folds, there is a large, gaping hole straight through to the interlining. But more important is the cost. Geneva charges $250-80 a shirt, for any Alumo fabric of your choice. Hard to beat that.
My evening shirt is the first shirt I've had made with Alumo. It's very, very nice. Don't miss the Riva at all.
He is self-aware of his showmanship and how it contrasts to the traditional way of doing things. That's very encouraging to me.
We do Duane Reade in NYC.

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Yes, that is actually really reasonable. I didn't know that Geneva was that low. Hmm.

mafoofan said:

quar said:

Roughly how much wear were you getting out of your Riva shirts Foo?
I've found that the ultra-fine DJ Anderson shirting is incredibly delicate too.

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Hmm. For each shirt: four years, one wearing every three weeks. So, roughly 70 washings/wearings per shirt. The collars and cuffs are frayed through to the lining now.

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That is why most people ask for spare set of cuffs and collar. It was always included in the shirt price... Once I found a whole box full of cuffs and collar at my grandfather house.

If those were not one off fabrics from Riva, standard fabric should still be available and A M should be able to replace them for you. You will be surprised...

I'd guess that the cost of replacing the collars and cuffs on an Riva AM shirt would approach that of an entirely new Alumo Geneva shirt.



marcodalondra said:

That is why most people ask for spare set of cuffs and collar. It was always included in the shirt price... Once I found a whole box full of cuffs and collar at my grandfather house.
If those were not one off fabrics from Riva, standard fabric should still be available and A M should be able to replace them for you. You will be surprised...

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I have extra cuff s and collars for most of my shirts. But sending them back to Italy is a costly pain.



mafoofan said:

5-6 years per shirt would be nice. I don't mind some minor fraying. The problem is that the Riva cotton has totally worn through. Where the collar folds, there is a large, gaping hole straight through to the interlining. But more important is the cost. Geneva charges $250-80 a shirt, for any Alumo fabric of your choice. Hard to beat that.

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Have you tried Cego's $150 OCBD? The cloth is inexpensive, thick, coarse and with lots of body (Carl mentioned that the cloth is from a mill in India). Note that it is not any where luxurious - I have to wear it with an under shirt. But for me it is a work horse during the cold months. Also, I wear ties with OCBDs. So YMMV.



mafoofan said:

I have extra cuff s and collars for most of my shirts. But sending them back to Italy is a costly pain.

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Have you considered asking someone locally, like Geneva, to do it for you?



patrickBOOTH said:

I might be in the minority here, but I have my reasons. Basically, I feel that small hand finishing is nicer than perfect fit. Over my short time getting shirts made I feel that over many washings and wearings cotton wears out, it shrinks, it fades, it yellows. Having something that makes it stand out despite these things is important to me. I 99% of the time have a jacket on so fit that isn't perfect isn't a huge issue for me. Plus, frequent laundering makes the properties of the fabric change, and being that shirt is closer to your body than a suit and made from a weaker fiber it tends to get more wear from movement. Just my thoughts.

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Buy more shirts. Fewer washings. No need to "euthanize" shirts before you are resigned to this eventuality.
That's what I do. I have T&A, and other shirts that are over 15 years old which look new(ish).



quar said:

I'd guess that the cost of replacing the collars and cuffs on an Riva AM shirt would approach that of an entirely new Alumo Geneva shirt.

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It should only be a nominal fee, my shirtmaker would do it for around 20 euro (spare parts would have been produced with the shirt).

mafoofan said:

marcodalondra said:

That is why most people ask for spare set of cuffs and collar. It was always included in the shirt price... Once I found a whole box full of cuffs and collar at my grandfather house.
If those were not one off fabrics from Riva, standard fabric should still be available and A M should be able to replace them for you. You will be surprised...

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I have extra cuff s and collars for most of my shirts. But sending them back to Italy is a costly pain.

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USPS priority mail international with two shirts in envelope should cost you around $25....



mafoofan said:

I have extra cuff s and collars for most of my shirts. But sending them back to Italy is a costly pain.

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thank you for the entertainment. priceless.



marcodalondra said:

USPS priority mail international with two shirts in envelope should cost you around $25....

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I've had shirts disappear that way. I'd have to send them with tracking and insurance. 20+ shirts.

Matt,

Somewhat off-topic, but have you taken delivery of your large-scale herringbone overcoat from the blog?