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How much do you pay for a shoe-shine? - Page 4

post #46 of 91
It's unseemly to have shoes that are too shiny.
post #47 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpooPoker View Post

Go get your fuckin shine box.

and your sack of nickels
post #48 of 91
pretty degrading to get another human being to shine your shoes while you are wearing them. just remember to rest one foot on top of their head while they are busy shining the other shoe on your foot.

it seems certain styleforum members still believe certain people should be second class citizens, otherwise you would shine your shoes yourselves.
post #49 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by iroh View Post

pretty degrading to get another human being to shine your shoes while you are wearing them. just remember to rest one foot on top of their head while they are busy shining the other shoe on your foot.
it seems certain styleforum members still believe certain people should be second class citizens, otherwise you would shine your shoes yourselves.

 

Do you not use restrooms because it's degrading that somebody has to come and clean them later?
 

trollololol

 

post #50 of 91

This seems one of the few places that we don't get ripped off in NYC.  I can't imagine paying $10 for a shoeshine (or living somewhere where the option didn't exist).  Multiple choices here, ranging from $3 to $4 per shine with a few dollars as tip.

post #51 of 91
I do it myself.

A couple of months ago a big fish around here got a shoe shine and gave the guy 100€. True story.
post #52 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by EMartNJ View Post


Do you not use restrooms because it's degrading that somebody has to come and clean them later?

you are missing the point. restrooms are fine because someone cleans them later, now if someone was there on the spot to wipe your behind after you do your business, then that is degrading.
post #53 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by iroh View Post

pretty degrading to get another human being to shine your shoes while you are wearing them. just remember to rest one foot on top of their head while they are busy shining the other shoe on your foot.
it seems certain styleforum members still believe certain people should be second class citizens, otherwise you would shine your shoes yourselves.


I don't think honest work is degrading. Shoe-shiners are hard workers, in my experience. They provide a quick and quality service, to a level I, personally, could never match. I don't see why one should deny such a person his livelihood because one could technically perform some imitation of his skill. To my mind it is more degrading to suggest that people in service-related industries ought to feel they are somehow "second-class" because of their work. People who work hard are first class in my book.

And as further admittedly anecdotal evidence, I have never seen anyone treat shoe-shiners in any manner degradingly. Most customers exchange pleasantries, and maybe idle chat.

Is it degrading to sit in a chair while a barber cuts your hair (perhaps even gives you a shave) because you could, in theory, take a buzzer to your own scalp?
post #54 of 91
I keep my socks on when they repair the holes in them.
post #55 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by Treko View Post

I don't think honest work is degrading. Shoe-shiners are hard workers, in my experience. They provide a quick and quality service, to a level I, personally, could never match. I don't see why one should deny such a person his livelihood because one could technically perform some imitation of his skill. To my mind it is more degrading to suggest that people in service-related industries ought to feel they are somehow "second-class" because of their work. People who work hard are first class in my book.
And as further admittedly anecdotal evidence, I have never seen anyone treat shoe-shiners in any manner degradingly. Most customers exchange pleasantries, and maybe idle chat.
Is it degrading to sit in a chair while a barber cuts your hair (perhaps even gives you a shave) because you could, in theory, take a buzzer to your own scalp?

you make good points i will give you that, there are some flaws though.

i find it is not a fair to compare a hair cut to a shoe shine, getting a decent haircut and style does require another person to cut your hair there is no doubt about that, there are no atlernatives. and one normally does not think getting a haircut is degrading to the barber, not on the same level as being a shoe shiner.

however for shoe shining there are alternatives, one can shine the shoes themselves and still get a excellent job done (it is super easy to shine shoes, i learned it just by watching a video on youtube and now i shine all my shoes myself, so there is absolutely no excuse why anyone else can't do it, unless they want to feel a perverted false sense of superiority by degrading another human). a possible second alternative could be for the shoes to be shined while they are off the person's feet, perhaps taking the shoes to a backroom and shining them out of sight, and returning the shoes later to the person waiting.

not all honest work is not degrading. slavery is an example. it says many things about the certain insecure people (who feel like they have to try to put down other people) introduced it, trying to justify it as honest work because the slaves work hard.
post #56 of 91

I can cook my own food, but often eat out.  am i degrading the chef then?

post #57 of 91
I can manage to clean my own shoes - regrettably the cost of live in servants is too great these days!!
post #58 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by iroh View Post

you make good points i will give you that, there are some flaws though.
i find it is not a fair to compare a hair cut to a shoe shine, getting a decent haircut and style does require another person to cut your hair there is no doubt about that, there are no atlernatives.
however for shoe shining there are alternatives, one can shine the shoes themselves and still get a excellent job done (it is super easy to shine shoes, i learned it just by watching a video on youtube and now i shine all my shoes myself, so there is absolutely no excuse why anyone else can't do it, unless they want to feel a perverted false sense of superiority by degrading another human). a possible second alternative could be for the shoes to be shined while they are off the person's feet, perhaps taking the shoes to a backroom and shining them out of sight, and returning the shoes later to the person waiting.
not all honest work is not degrading. slavery is an example. it says many things about the certain insecure people (who feel like they have to try to put down other people) introduced it, trying to justify it as honest work because the slaves work hard.


Well I have to disagree on a few points. (i) Slavery, for example, is not honest work -- quite the antithesis, I'd say that's about as dishonest as any industry can be. These people are either self-employed or work for small businesses, so the comparison is not well taken. (ii) My point was not that I or anyone else is incapable of shining our own shoes (I have done it before, and will again when the need arises), but rather that the simple fact that I can do something does not mean it is morally repugnant for me to pay someone who specializes in the same task (and has both higher levels of skill and economy in terms of time); especially when the effect of that attitude would be to deprive the shoe-shiner of work. (iii) The reasons many people opt for the quick 'on-the-foot' shine have to do with the speed of the service and the on-the-go fix for scuffed or worn looking shoes. While some may affect that look in certain circumstances, in others it is shabby and potentially even disrespectful of those you may be meeting with. Obviously this is something of a 'micro-cultural' phenomena, but in certain industries (banking, the law &c.) in NYC, at least, people tend to opt for highly bulled dress shoes.

'Off-the-foot' shines and shoe repair are not uncommon, but serve different functions and offer different benefits (and generally demand more time -- a day or sometimes more vs. two or three minutes). I sense some cognitive dissonance when the same work, hidden from the eyes of the customer, is somehow more noble and less degrading. I suppose it is the height of the chairs used that inspire discomfort in your view of the practice (ironically, they are propped up as a matter of sensitivity to the posture of the employee -- not to instill some regal self-regard in the customer). I think to assume people get shoe-shines to feed some vapid need to feel superior to another person is reading into the entire scenario something that isn't there.

I could buy starch and various steamers and irons and laundry equipment and expertly launder and dry clean my shirts and suits. I could refuse every opportunity to ride in a cab because I am quite capable of driving and could rent a car instead. I could cut my own hair (again, with less but passable skill) instead of mocking the barber by sitting in his chair. I could make myself dinner every night of the year, and never imply to a restaurants' wait staff that I am somehow their better because their job requires carrying out my meal. I could refuse the assistance of bellhops, being physically capable of carrying my own bags to my hotel room.

My ability to accomplish any or all of these tasks without relying on the services of other people is not really the point (in my view). In taking the above course of action I would be selfishly denying the right of other people to make a living out of zealous individualism, weighing down my schedule with countless extra tasks (that in the past might have been carried out by domestic labor, a more degrading institution in my opinion) and achieving lesser results. Or I could employ the services of my neighbors, as they employ mine. These people are not servants or slaves, they are industrious and free people who are working hard to make a living. I have worked as a waiter and a caddy, and would not have been thrilled had customers persistently 'honored' me by bussing their own tables and carrying their own golf bags (many of them perfectly capable of both).

Everyone must pick and choose what services and people he has the resources and need to do business with, and what tasks he must handle himself. But I see no need to yoke some moral judgment on this particular service because it is not altogether common in every part of the country. Where the market exists it exists for a reason, and barring some evidence that it is truly exploitative or unfair I see no reason why people should not be free to make up their own minds on whether to frequent such a business, or employ such a service.
post #59 of 91
Treko, Iroh is a troll. He repairs holes in dirty socks and uses a kitchen knife to scratch up the soles of his new shoes.
post #60 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by harvey_birdman View Post

Treko, Iroh is a troll.

how dare you
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