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Meermin Mallorca Shoes - Page 148

post #2206 of 11564
Not sure if the "Made in Spain" stamp is a new thing — my pair is from July.

Wikipedia:
Quote:
Generally, articles only change their country of origin if the work or material added to an article in the second country constitutes a substantial transformation, or, the article changes its name, tariff code, character or use (for instance from wheel to car). Value added in the second country may also be an issue.

I've understood that the tariff code is a pretty important factor in determining the country of origin in the EU.

What does everyone mean by "finishing"?
post #2207 of 11564
The discussion about country of origin, and the derision of China as a manufacturer of quality goods is pretty interesting.

If we assume the quality of the garment - absent materials quality - can be described as a function of the amount of labor and the skill of the craftsman:

(labor hours)x(labor skill)

We can assume that the cost of labor hours for an equivalently skilled craftsman is lower in China than it is in Spain. Thus, assuming they can properly train their craftsmen, by manufacturing in China they can reach a higher quality for the same cost.

The cost can be described thus:

(labor hours)x(salary) = cost

If the salary is lower, the amount of hours going into a shoe can increase for the same constant cost.

The big assumption here is of course that the Chinese factory-workers are trained to a sufficiently high skill level. Personally I would find it very interesting to hear Pepe's and Sandro's approach to training people in China, assuming that is where the shoes are made.

From a personal perspective, I would actually LIKE this to be the explanation. If the reason for them being able to provide shoes of this quality at this price point is that they have lower salary costs, I could surmise that they are not cutting corners in the construction or materials of the shoe.

(very simplified model, of course - I was starting to put in coefficients and building out a more proper economic quality model, but decided to keep it this way)
post #2208 of 11564
Quote:
Originally Posted by kungapa View Post

The discussion about country of origin, and the derision of China as a manufacturer of quality goods is pretty interesting.
If we assume the quality of the garment - absent materials quality - can be described as a function of the amount of labor and the skill of the craftsman:
(labor hours)x(labor skill)
We can assume that the cost of labor hours for an equivalently skilled craftsman is lower in China than it is in Spain. Thus, assuming they can properly train their craftsmen, by manufacturing in China they can reach a higher quality for the same cost.
The cost can be described thus:
(labor hours)x(salary) = cost
If the salary is lower, the amount of hours going into a shoe can increase for the same constant cost.
The big assumption here is of course that the Chinese factory-workers are trained to a sufficiently high skill level. Personally I would find it very interesting to hear Pepe's and Sandro's approach to training people in China, assuming that is where the shoes are made.
From a personal perspective, I would actually LIKE this to be the explanation. If the reason for them being able to provide shoes of this quality at this price point is that they have lower salary costs, I could surmise that they are not cutting corners in the construction or materials of the shoe.
(very simplified model, of course - I was starting to put in coefficients and building out a more proper economic quality model, but decided to keep it this way)

too simple an explanation actually.

 

Let me break it down for you.

 

It costs less to manufacture in China.

Why do people move manufacturing over to China?

Is it to sell a product for the same retail and make a bigger profit margin or is it to produce a lower priced product using cheaper manufacturing.

 

This isn't about the Chinese making the shoes, it is about the decision to manufacture in China and how it represents a shift from high price to low price.

post #2209 of 11564
For me, it's a matter of 'voting with my pocketbook' as my grandmother would say.

Do I wish to spend my money in support of the practices of the Chinese government or in support of a government which is more friendly to my personal ideals?

I try to avoid made in China as much as possible because I have no reason to believe that the Chinese government is my friend.

There is no doubt that quality goods can be manufactured in China - all it takes is training and quality control.
post #2210 of 11564
I've asked a few pre-purchase questions lately, thanks for answering them, all. One last one: I'm trying to figure out the total outlay on 2 pair of classic line shoes, the last thing I'm unsure about it is the tariff. What can I expect to get dinged for on two pair?
post #2211 of 11564
I find, the whole do-I-buy-made-in-China thing hard. While, I wish, to not fund a bad practice system--one which pays it's players a tiny wage, and forces them, to work long hours--the people working those machines need every damn penny they can get. There's a really interesting documentary, called Last Train Home, about a couple who work in terrible conditions, so that their daughter can get an education. She, then, decides to quit, and take up the very same job her parents have. It's very sad; that's why I continue, to buy Made in China, and petition how I can.
post #2212 of 11564
Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanAlex01 View Post

I find, the whole do-I-buy-made-in-China thing hard. While, I wish, to not fund a bad practice system--one which pays it's players a tiny wage, and forces them, to work long hours--the people working those machines need every damn penny they can get. There's a really interesting documentary, called Last Train Home, about a couple who work in terrible conditions, so that their daughter can get an education. She, then, decides to quit, and take up the very same job her parents have. It's very sad; that's why I continue, to buy Made in China, and petition how I can.

I share your struggle with this. To be sure my quibble is not at all with the Chinese people. For I wish them a good life and freedom from poverty, as I do everyone.

I work in China a good bit, the vast majority of my company's income is currently derived from providing professional services in China. (Thus we are actually exporting TO China from the US.) My Chinese counterparts are very much kept under lock and key. It is very hard for them to even get a visa to leave the country for business meetings. The government is in control of so much more than it might appear (IMO).

There is no easy answer here.
post #2213 of 11564
Re-made MTO modified oxford pair with black suede uppers, slim leather sole, dark purple lining. Natural welt top with white stitching, Hiro last.

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post #2214 of 11564
is it just me or does that hidden/folded toe cap stitching look a bit off to anyone else?
post #2215 of 11564
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnnamedPlayer View Post

too simple an explanation actually.

Let me break it down for you.

It costs less to manufacture in China.
Why do people move manufacturing over to China?
Is it to sell a product for the same retail and make a bigger profit margin or is it to produce a lower priced product using cheaper manufacturing.

This isn't about the Chinese making the shoes, it is about the decision to manufacture in China and how it represents a shift from high price to low price.

Let me un-break it down for you, since you are generalizing a bit too much. You are providing too simple an explanation, actually.

Assuming Meermin produces in China, Meermin's whole business model is premised on the wage differential between the western world and China. They can provide quality shoes at a cost they would not be able to produce shoes at if they were entirely made in Spain. They would be a different type of company if they produced in Spain - and their business model would be different: either they would be more expensive, or they would be of lower quality. As it is, Meermin has been able to find an unexploited niche in the market - a niche they can only target because of Chinese manufacturing.

I simply don't buy the notion that made in china = low quality.
post #2216 of 11564
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadcammer View Post

is it just me or does that hidden/folded toe cap stitching look a bit off to anyone else?

It does as well to me.
post #2217 of 11564

Hey guys,

 

you are just saying the same thing. Of course, at a given quality, the wage differential between Spain and China enables Meermin to offer the shoes cheaper by producing in China than in Spain. This does not necessarily imply low(er) quality. Nonetheless, as the same shoes would have to be sold at a higher price if produced in Spain, the shift from high price to low price mentioned by UnnamedPlayer is abolutely correct.
 

post #2218 of 11564
Quote:
Originally Posted by VRaivio View Post

Meermin_shoes_black_suede_MTO_oxford02.jpg

Nice!
post #2219 of 11564
Quote:
Originally Posted by kungapa View Post

As it is, Meermin has been able to find an unexploited niche in the market - a niche they can only target because of Chinese manufacturing.

What would you say that unexploited niche is exactly?
post #2220 of 11564
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadcammer View Post

What would you say that unexploited niche is exactly?

High-quality shoes (as in higher than mall-brand quality, and similar to say AE) with a styling catering to the blogosphere or SF crowds at a price point that is comparable or lower than other alternatives that are differently styled (such as AE, although that might be changing with their new lines).
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