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The State of Black Tie: Your Observations - Page 90

post #1336 of 3406
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post

Well, apparently, the wedding party will be wearing boots with their dinner suits. I have been vehemently told that this is just the way things are done in Texas. I accept that, but I don't have to like it. smile.gif

Have they suggested you do same? And if so, would you go with a true Western style boot or perhaps pair a high-gloss Chelsea with a tux (which I've actually seen my dad do and he pulls of quite well).
post #1337 of 3406
The last black tie affair I attended was a dinner in a private residence in New York City. It was held on the Friday before the beginning of Lent. In all sincerity I didn't pay excruciating attention to dress as I was there to honor the host and to see friends. But I knew all six couple attending and if my memory is correct all six men wore black tie ... all wore SB (don't recall venting) dinner coats ... all with black bow ties ... 5 cummerbunds / 1 vest (yours truly) ... 2 pairs of calf pumps (including yours truly), 1 patent pump, 3 patent Oxfords. But again I knew everyone there and I may be remembering what they wore on some other black-tie evening.
post #1338 of 3406
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimelesStyle View Post

I thought the boots discussion was largely about pairing them with suits, not formalwear? I know that Bush had the black tie and boots gala but I feel as though the "customary in TX" idea mostly applies to them being worn with business suits. But maybe I skipped some of the relevant posts?
I regularly attend a couple of event weekends in Texas. Boots are seen, particularly at some of the more egalitarian events. Those wearing them are NOT in the majority. Although I see more today than I did in past years. For most of the men wearing them, I think it's akin to style without content.
post #1339 of 3406

I'm guessing Colt Single Action Army Revolvers probably with lots of hand engraving and a custom leather holster.

 

Agree on the boots, you'd never catch me doing it, but when in Rome...

post #1340 of 3406
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post

I don't doubt that Texans take their boots seriously and that it is customary to wear them with dinner clothes. However, dinner clothes weren't developed with cowboy boots in mind. It is an extremely harsh juxtaposition. After all, the dominant theme of black tie is elegance through simplicity. Dressy cowboy boots in exotic leathers are hardly simple. Thus, they are an aesthetic disruption to their adopted context. And that's to say nothing of having to widen one's trouser legs to accommodate them, another disrupting effect. It's tragic to ruin what was so inherently and purposefully streamlined for the sake of an ill-placed regional affectation.

If Texans want to wear cowboy boots on occasions that would otherwise call for black tie, I think they'd be better off coming up with a new kind of complementary attire. That seems the gutsier route, and thus the more Texan one, anyway.

I think you're elevating the function of black tie to a bit of a myth here, at least with regards to footwear. In this thread there are already instances of opera pumps, Belgian slippers, and non-black-tie footwear being "acceptable" in a pinch, to say nothing of the contentiousness of traditional black patent bluchers or the odd colored velvet jacket. I'd hardly call any of these understated or simple.

I don't see why the Lucchese boot below would be "extremely harsh" or ruin anything except the most sensitive of sartorial temperaments:
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

Polish up the toe and, assuming one's trouser's don't fit like a teenager's skateboarding jeans, the shaft fits easily under any pant leg. I don't foresee anyone's day being ruined by the support stitching or the fact that one's silk socks can't be appreciated.

I'd never do it myself but I find a notch-lapel or vented tuxedo many times more abhorrent.
post #1341 of 3406
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moloch38 View Post

I'm guessing Colt Single Action Army Revolvers probably with lots of hand engraving and a custom leather holster.

 

Agree on the boots, you'd never catch me doing it, but when in Rome...


That would be inline with my experience.

post #1342 of 3406
I want to see someone wearing a dress gun. I mean, that's way cooler than boots with a suit/tux.
post #1343 of 3406
As to the matter of the "dress gun," I asked my good friend Garey Hindman about this whole business. He is a lifelong Texan, his family having migrated from Germany to Texas around 1850. For much of his life he was also a gunsmith of considerable renown. So was his father Ace Hindman, who, in collaboration with Gun World's Dean Grennel, developed the useful .45 Super conversion for .45 auto pistols. Thus, I figured he would know about these matters better than anyone else I know. I stressed this was not a cowboy-costume wedding where it might be appropriate for the male guests to come a-packin' their sixguns.

He stated that the practice of wearing boots with black tie was very common in Texas. However, he had never in his long life (he's got a few years on me) heard of anyone wearing a dress gun to a black-tie wedding.

The term "dress gun," he informed me, was synonymous with "barbecue gun," which term I had heard. Basically, it means any very flashy sidearm ("pimped out" was the term he used) meant to be publicly displayed. These days it is perhaps more often a 1911-style pistol than anything else. Features are predictable--engraving or bright metal finishes; ivory, faux-ivory or mother-of-pearl stocks (ruby eyes are popular for the classic steer's head carvings on the stocks, he mentioned). I assume the eponymous barbecues are large costume-ish public events, not some friendly backyard grilling.

As a matter of interest, he told me that the great wearers of dress guns until the past couple of decades were the Texas Rangers. Although they were never a uniformed agency, for much of the 20th century they dressed uniformly: tan suit, highly starched white shirt, bolo tie, tooled-leather cowboy boots, straw Western hat and a dress-gun 1911 in a tan leather holster. They were very easy to spot. FWIW, the most famous 20th-century Ranger of them all, Captain Frank Hamer, typically wore dark business suits, neckties and dress shoes.
post #1344 of 3406
Quote:
Originally Posted by RSS View Post

style without content.

You mean all hat and no cattle.

post #1345 of 3406
As a lifelong Texan, I can tell you that dress guns are not the norm and would actually be illegal since open carry of handguns is against the law.

I have been to several black tie events (although, no weddings) and I can say that most men clean up and present themselves pretty well. I dont remember the shoes people were wearing, but if there were nice black ostrich or other leather boots (e.g. Lucchese) then it wouldn't gain a second glance or be out of the norm. Day to day, I see businessmen wear boots ALL the time (I have an office in downtown Austin) and it's just business as usual.
post #1346 of 3406
Quote:
Originally Posted by landshark View Post

As a lifelong Texan, I can tell you that dress guns are not the norm and would actually be illegal since open carry of handguns is against the law.

That just doesn't seem right in Texas.

post #1347 of 3406
Quote:
Originally Posted by JLibourel View Post

As to the matter of the "dress gun," I asked my good friend Garey Hindman about this whole business. He is a lifelong Texan, his family having migrated from Germany to Texas around 1850. For much of his life he was also a gunsmith of considerable renown. So was his father Ace Hindman, who, in collaboration with Gun World's Dean Grennel, developed the useful .45 Super conversion for .45 auto pistols. Thus, I figured he would know about these matters better than anyone else I know. I stressed this was not a cowboy-costume wedding where it might be appropriate for the male guests to come a-packin' their sixguns.

He stated that the practice of wearing boots with black tie was very common in Texas. However, he had never in his long life (he's got a few years on me) heard of anyone wearing a dress gun to a black-tie wedding.

The term "dress gun," he informed me, was synonymous with "barbecue gun," which term I had heard. Basically, it means any very flashy sidearm ("pimped out" was the term he used) meant to be publicly displayed. These days it is perhaps more often a 1911-style pistol than anything else. Features are predictable--engraving or bright metal finishes; ivory, faux-ivory or mother-of-pearl stocks (ruby eyes are popular for the classic steer's head carvings on the stocks, he mentioned). I assume the eponymous barbecues are large costume-ish public events, not some friendly backyard grilling.

As a matter of interest, he told me that the great wearers of dress guns until the past couple of decades were the Texas Rangers. Although they were never a uniformed agency, for much of the 20th century they dressed uniformly: tan suit, highly starched white shirt, bolo tie, tooled-leather cowboy boots, straw Western hat and a dress-gun 1911 in a tan leather holster. They were very easy to spot. FWIW, the most famous 20th-century Ranger of them all, Captain Frank Hamer, typically wore dark business suits, neckties and dress shoes.

Yep sounds about right. I've heard of BBQ guns (usually 1911s) for private events, a few Mil ones.

post #1348 of 3406
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kent Wang View Post

You mean all hat and no cattle.
B-I-N-G-O!
post #1349 of 3406
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafoofan View Post

TITC_02022013_02_zps1b589095.jpg

Btw, what do you think of these? I had them made up a while ago and forgot to post them after they were finished.

I don't wear matching cufflinks.

Foo, I've been coming around to these and found a vintage set being sold in 14k yellow gold with gum drop Amethyst.
post #1350 of 3406
photos of your set SG?
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