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post #3826 of 4171
Quote:
Originally Posted by il ciclista View Post

^^nice , it's crazy how good of results you can get from such a small package.


Patrick , that's also my favorite lens for nikon. It's focuses very close too. I used it in my Nikon about 90% of the time.

 

 

My D90 and the 35 f/1.8 is a nice little package that works for much of what I do. However, I keep considering one of the mirrorless setups for travel. My wife and I were in barcelona last year and I didn't want to lug my DSLR around.

post #3827 of 4171
The RX100 is a really nice little camera. After I upgrade the DSLR that'll be next on the list. After messing with one for a few hours I'm convinced I could get away with using one if my DSLR takes a dump on me in the middle of a most shoots.
post #3828 of 4171

My quest for a small, travel friendly camera may be over. That RX100 is very appealing.

post #3829 of 4171
I dabbled with the great small camera trend with the Lumix LX3. I loved the manual control and ease of use.

My word of advice... wait till the new one comes out and the old version's prices start to plummet. The thing with these cameras is that the new ones are usually only incrementally better. $600 is a lot for that camera, but in a year it'll be below $400 and a super value.

just google and look at the shots you can take with the Canon S90/Lumix LX3 (which have been updated at least 2x over) and you'll see that its 98% the same quality.
post #3830 of 4171
Quote:
Originally Posted by LawrenceMD View Post

I dabbled with the great small camera trend with the Lumix LX3. I loved the manual control and ease of use.

My word of advice... wait till the new one comes out and the old version's prices start to plummet. The thing with these cameras is that the new ones are usually only incrementally better. $600 is a lot for that camera, but in a year it'll be below $400 and a super value.

just google and look at the shots you can take with the Canon S90/Lumix LX3 (which have been updated at least 2x over) and you'll see that its 98% the same quality.

 

Thanks LawrenceMD. It was the Lumix series that started me down this road a couple of yrs ago. I haven't kept up on the technology at all in recent years until my brother bought a NEX (not sure which model) for travel when he didn't want to carry a DSLR. I was impressed with the results, though the interface seemed very menu-heavy.

 

What I find daunting today is that there are so many more large sensor small cameras (is it a sin to call them P&S's?) on the market. RX100 reviews are very positive and while I was considering an interchangeable lens setup, the RX100 seems to offer a nice package without the added cost of lenses. With that said, I love the idea of buying last year's model or waiting until the new one comes out. I hadn't even considered that.

 

Thanks again for your thoughts.

post #3831 of 4171
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrick_b View Post


What I find daunting today is that there are so many more large sensor small cameras (is it a sin to call them P&S's?) on the market. RX100 reviews are very positive and while I was considering an interchangeable lens setup, the RX100 seems to offer a nice package without the added cost of lenses. With that said, I love the idea of buying last year's model or waiting until the new one comes out. I hadn't even considered that.

Thanks again for your thoughts.

^I just got back from Boston we watched a game (the celtics got killed frown.gif )

Lumix GX1 with 25mm 1.4 lens no editing.



I sold my LX3 for a GF1 +20mm pancake kit and it was like using the LX3 but on steroids. I waited out the subsequent GF series "upgrades" (which were sadly more P&S-like in execution) until the GX1. You can't really go wrong with these smaller cameras right now (because of the great lenses and strong user base). Those sony NEX series are excellent, as well as the FUJi range finder-like series that have the same flat rangefinder like bodies with built in EVFs.
post #3832 of 4171
If I had to get a P&S right now, it'd probably be the new Fuji X20. The RX100 is very nice, but it doesn't fit my hands very well, and is slippery. I'd probably be one of those people who would stick a grip and fake leather skin on it just to get a good hold on it.
post #3833 of 4171
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Y View Post

If I had to get a P&S right now, it'd probably be the new Fuji X20. The RX100 is very nice, but it doesn't fit my hands very well, and is slippery. I'd probably be one of those people who would stick a grip and fake leather skin on it just to get a good hold on it.

Realistically, how far are we from the P&S being fully replaced by the phone? I know we're not there yet.... but how soon?
post #3834 of 4171
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChicagoRon View Post

Realistically, how far are we from the P&S being fully replaced by the phone? I know we're not there yet.... but how soon?

the tech/software is already here. but the phone might end up bulky because of the lens. even with the smallest "enthusiasts" P&S cameras the lens is still about the size of a quarter/half dollar. you can take great pictures with an iPhone under the right conditions. nokia dabbled in consumer phones with great lenses (especially video) but that almost bankrupted the company.

thats the one way to cheat getting a adequate photo with an iPhone. sometimes its easier (with lower light) to just take a video then get a screen capture from the video.
post #3835 of 4171
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChicagoRon View Post

Realistically, how far are we from the P&S being fully replaced by the phone? I know we're not there yet.... but how soon?

For most casual shooters, and people whose primary way of sharing photos is immediate upload to a social networking site (no disparagement here, just an acknowledgment of reality), the cellphone has already won. For people who are the traditional photo hobbyists, I don't see a phone replacing a traditional camera any time soon. It's not only a matter of quality (the sensors are tiny, and the lenses minimal in a phone), but also of control and responsiveness.

A bigger problem for the camera companies is not whether they'll lose the photo hobbyists (they won't), but whether there are enough of them to justify the R&D costs of developing really good cameras and lenses, as well as maintaining their production facilities. I think there will always be a trickle upwards from people who discover photography as a hobby by using their cellphone, and wanting to move to a better system. The question is whether there are enough of those people for Canon, Nikon, etc. to keep doing what they're doing. I think much of their business over the last decade was fueled in large part by casual shooters who thought more expensive and fancier cameras would let them take better pictures. Those people are now moving on to cellphones.

Because of this, I think it's more important than ever for photo companies to emphasize what they bring to photography: that means cameras that are the best, pure picture-taking (and probably movie-taking) machines available. The value they bring to the market should very clear to everyone. That means half-assed cameras that try to have one foot in the smartphone arena (eg. the couple of Android-based cameras as well as Sony's lame app system for their latest NEX cameras and all touchscreen cameras) won't cut it. I think the success of the Fuji X100 as well as the Olympus OM-D (yes, this has a touchscreen, but you can ignore it and still use the camera very well) show that people still value cameras that function as cameras.

This isn't to say there isn't some Steve Jobs of the photo world out there who can radically change cameras or even unite disparate industries like cellphones and cameras, but until that Messiah comes along, I don't think crossing boundaries is a good thing for photo companies to be doing.
post #3836 of 4171
Yeah I never use the nex apps but I do use the wireless upload a lot
post #3837 of 4171
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Y View Post

For most casual shooters, and people whose primary way of sharing photos is immediate upload to a social networking site (no disparagement here, just an acknowledgment of reality), the cellphone has already won. For people who are the traditional photo hobbyists, I don't see a phone replacing a traditional camera any time soon. It's not only a matter of quality (the sensors are tiny, and the lenses minimal in a phone), but also of control and responsiveness.

A bigger problem for the camera companies is not whether they'll lose the photo hobbyists (they won't), but whether there are enough of them to justify the R&D costs of developing really good cameras and lenses, as well as maintaining their production facilities. I think there will always be a trickle upwards from people who discover photography as a hobby by using their cellphone, and wanting to move to a better system. The question is whether there are enough of those people for Canon, Nikon, etc. to keep doing what they're doing. I think much of their business over the last decade was fueled in large part by casual shooters who thought more expensive and fancier cameras would let them take better pictures. Those people are now moving on to cellphones.

Because of this, I think it's more important than ever for photo companies to emphasize what they bring to photography: that means cameras that are the best, pure picture-taking (and probably movie-taking) machines available. The value they bring to the market should very clear to everyone. That means half-assed cameras that try to have one foot in the smartphone arena (eg. the couple of Android-based cameras as well as Sony's lame app system for their latest NEX cameras and all touchscreen cameras) won't cut it. I think the success of the Fuji X100 as well as the Olympus OM-D (yes, this has a touchscreen, but you can ignore it and still use the camera very well) show that people still value cameras that function as cameras.

This isn't to say there isn't some Steve Jobs of the photo world out there who can radically change cameras or even unite disparate industries like cellphones and cameras, but until that Messiah comes along, I don't think crossing boundaries is a good thing for photo companies to be doing.

Thanks - I agree with all of this, but still wonder when the photo hobbyists won't just skip up to a DSLR. That's what I did. I figured... if I just want snapshots of my friends being drunk and stupid - cell phone will work. If I want pictures of nature, portraits, etc. then I'll carry around the DSLR and give myself a little more control. I can see where there is a demand for hobbyists at a lower price point than DSLRs today, but if the price trend continues, I'm not sure if pure size/simplicity is enough to attract the person who wants more than a camera phone away from a DSLR.
post #3838 of 4171
Cellphones and small sensor cameras won't cut it if you're looking to be able to make up large prints. I don't see full size DSLRs going anywhere anytime soon for a number of other reasons as well.
post #3839 of 4171
There are a number of reasons I went mirrorless the biggest reason was size. I like that the nex6 also has contrast and phase detection. I enjoy the EVF how it's what you see if what you see is what you get and the ability to adapt lenses without worry of slapping the mirror. However, some people are put off by the size when I do paid assignments . It's still about the whole image of bigger is better. I just assure them the results will be the same as a clunky dslr. Heck I shot with a 7d and the results were terrible compared to my Sony . Especially past 400iso
post #3840 of 4171
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crane's View Post

Cellphones and small sensor cameras won't cut it if you're looking to be able to make up large prints. I don't see full size DSLRs going anywhere anytime soon for a number of other reasons as well.

That's not what I was saying - I was saying DSLRs and Camera Phones will squeeze out the P&S in the middle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by il ciclista View Post

There are a number of reasons I went mirrorless the biggest reason was size. I like that the nex6 also has contrast and phase detection. I enjoy the EVF how it's what you see if what you see is what you get and the ability to adapt lenses without worry of slapping the mirror. However, some people are put off by the size when I do paid assignments . It's still about the whole image of bigger is better. I just assure them the results will be the same as a clunky dslr. Heck I shot with a 7d and the results were terrible compared to my Sony . Especially past 400iso

This makes sense - a DLSR is bulky and the technology is improving in the high-end P&S / Hybrid range. When I think P&S, I think $500-1000 ELPH, Coolpix, etc.
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