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A thought.

post #1 of 25
Thread Starter 
I was sitting with a book, and suddenly this thought came to me. It was that I have noticed many people state that Canali makes "cheap" suits that are rather affordable. Also that Armani's lower end lines were rather cheap, and etc. I was thinking that the majority of the world's people would not find $1000+ clothing cheap. I myself am not one of these people as I possess these clothes but I was just thinking. Comments?
post #2 of 25
I look at it this way. I don't pretend that I have the money to walk into Saks and go crazy. I'm one of who knows how many out there that appreciate quality clothing and looking nice, but don't have the means to shop like it in a lot of cases. The expensive things I do have I got on sale at xxx store, on Ebay, Bluefly, etc. I hate paying retail and can't afford to on most things, so I get the nice stuff on sale and the mid tier stuff to fill out the rest. Even if I made 100k a year I'd do the same thing. And whoever says Canali is cheap at 1k is living in a world far different from mine..
post #3 of 25
I think that, on this forum, asserting that a $1000 suit is an entry level suit is the satorial equivalent of a locker room boast. Me, I own 5 Brioni suits for the weeks I feel like a Roman, 5 Kiton suits for weeks I feel Neapolitan, 10 Richard James because I more often feel like an upper class twit, and a couple of Armani Collezionis for slumming it on the weekends. I will write about my 365 nights of seven-fold ties tomorrow.
post #4 of 25
Quote:
I think that, on this forum, asserting that a $1000 suit is an entry level suit is the satorial equivalent of a locker room boast. Me, I own 5 Brioni suits for the weeks I feel like a Roman, 5 Kiton suits for weeks I feel Neapolitan, 10 Richard James because I more often feel like an upper class twit, and a couple of Armani Collezionis for slumming it on the weekends.  I will write about my 365 nights of seven-fold ties tomorrow.
Ha ha, that one really cracked me up I assume you're joking, but on this board, you never know... Seriously, "cheap" is relative to whatever you consider "expensive" or "high quality". Adjust your range accordingly, chalk up differences to the different people on the board.
post #5 of 25
Well, at full price none of those Canalis are cheap, but I wouldn't call them expensive in an age where jeans can run well in excess of US$100, either. And the Canalis I've seen have been well-made, so cheap as an epithet doesn't apply. The Armani Collezioni stuff, however, is cheap in the epithetic sense. (The same goes for Zegna's Soft line.) In terms of the quality of materials and tailoring, they are no better than most entry/mid-level department stores' tailored clothing lines. They just come with hangers that look more impressive hanging up in your wardrobe. That's not to say the silhouette can't agree with you, and if both the price is right and you can afford to toss it when the front starts bubbling (dry clean as seldomly as possible), don't let the cheapness of materials or construction necessarily stop you. Ditto for something from Woolworth, for that matter. Peace, JG
post #6 of 25
re: Canali suits i can't imagine anyone would talk about Canali in a demeaning or 'looking down one's nose at' sort of way. i mean, with the exception of the proposta line, canali is a well respected, hand finished line of suits, complete with edge stitched lapels on their jackets.. certainly a better buy than a vast majority of 'fashion' line suits at the same price, with about a quarter of the craftsmanship. i've always considered canali a great product.
post #7 of 25
I would agree about Armani Collezioni. At a grand, I would suggest that most people would find Canali pretty ching-ching, construction and materials notwithstanding. Most people would also balk at $160 for a pair of jeans too. My point was that just because we love our loot (and who are we kidding, we love it) shouldn't make us snobs, that's all. The only thing more annoying than an pretentious fashionista is an uppity fashionisto. There really isn't a point in upping the ante. I mean, one could assert that $150 PDC jeans are entry level, that $330 Gucci styles are "midrange", and that only $600+ Yamamoto styles are truly "couture", but who would we be kidding?
post #8 of 25
I don't know anyone who would call Canali a cheap suit, but as far as high quality suits go, it's entry-level i suppose... Like others have said, it's relative. To some people, high end is Canali. To others it's Kiton. If you look at the whole spectrum of suits and make a car analogy, we might say that Canali is a BMW M3 and a Kiton or Brioni is a Diablo. The M3 might be "cheap" if you put it beside a Lamborghini Diablo, but the M3 performance figures won't be that far off from those of the Diablo and you're paying 40-50k instead of 200k. The Diablo accerlates to 60mph a second faster, it's top speed is higher and it looks flashier, but you're paying 200k for it so it's not the bang for your buck that an M3 is. Having said all that, there aren't too many people that'll turn their nose down at an M3 or a Canali
post #9 of 25
All of us have a limited income. That limit might be high, it might be low, but within your limit you can spend your money as you please. You can buy clobber, spend it on a holiday, pay into a pension plan or donate it to charity. The choice is yours and as long as you don't hurt someone else (kids starving because dad needs a Kiton suit), there is nothing wrong with it. This is a forum for fashion fanatics, go to a forum for hi-fi or golf fanatics, you will hear similar opinions expressed about hi-fi or golf. There are many things that carry a high price tag and I wouldn't know what special about them. What's the difference between a cheap and an expensive golf club or fishing rod? I practice neither of these sports, so I have no idea what makes one of these items ordinary, special or extra-special. Yes, if you think of the starving kids in Africa it is obscene to spend $ 1000 on an "entry level suit". The clothes you wear are just a bit of frivolity (and in the working of the universe they are of no importance) but if you like your clobber they add a bit of sparkle to someone's life and, let's be honest, we all need a bit of fun in our life. To Wallis Simpson's dictum: "One can never be too rich or to thin" I might add: "Or have too many shoes".
post #10 of 25
Point well taken. I did not mean to say that it was obscene to spend your money as you see fit (I personally love my loot), only that it is in poor taste to posture.
post #11 of 25
Quote:
My point was that just because we love our loot (and who are we kidding, we love it) shouldn't make us snobs, that's all.  The only thing more annoying than an pretentious fashionista is an uppity fashionisto.
Absolutely. Snobbery is not becoming. (Be it fashion, art, hi-fi equipment or whatever.) Looking down on those less fortunate or savvy is stupid and inconsiderate. But, the fact is that we all judge ourselves and others by appearances, there's no way around it. Our appearances speak volumes about us, and most people are fairly accurate at interpretating what they hear. Things like socio-economic status, hobbies, place of residency and so on. To a certain extent. When it comes to any area which requieres expertise, there are going to be people who are clueless, those who have a general understanding, those who know a bit more, those who know a lot. Fashion is no exception. IME most have a general understanding about most things. Those with a general understanding of fashion might spend a few hundreds on a suit and think it's a fair price or even a bit expensive. They don't see the need to spend more as they don't appreciate the finer points. If you're going to judge quality you need a trained eye, you need exposure to the better things. Maybe they haven't learnt enough or aren't interested, who knows? Should we care? IMO, a $ 1000 suit is not cheap. It may be worth its price, but cheap and affordable it's not. Like LA Guy said "There really isn't a point in upping the ante.  I mean, one could assert that $150 PDC jeans are entry level, that $330 Gucci styles are "midrange", and that only $600+ Yamamoto styles are truly "couture", but who would we be kidding?"
post #12 of 25
As others imply, "cheap," "expensive" and "worth the money" are relative concepts. I am one who would have to budget carefully to buy $1,000 suits, but who would find them worth the cost if they were high-quality and nicely styled. Don't forget, too, that the cost of a suit has to be amortized. A $1K suit that is well-built and timeless enough to wear for ten years ends up costing about the same as a $500 suit that has to be sent to Goodwill after five. Meanwhile, the more expensive suit will probably make you look and feel better every time you wear it which, as Mastercard will tell you, is priceless. (By the way, anyone who puts a modicum of care into his appearance these days, regardless of cost, is going to look good to 99.9% of the U.S. population). Cheers.
post #13 of 25
Now being relatively new to this forum, I feel like I am speaking out of place. But from my standpoint, I could never afford to buy a suit of that stature, and would feel uncomfortable in such a thing. But I have to agree that if you are nuts about fashion it is well worth it. Anyone that is like this is able to appreciate the quality and workmanship of such a product. Now I have never heard of these brands before coming here, and now that I have checked them out, I can say that I have goals of one day owning one or two suits like this. My question is this: pstoller has a quote that says something along the lines that fashion is following someone else, but style is someone who everyone else wants to dress like. What about the person who can take nothing and make it something. Could that be seen as style as well? Although a well educated person in clothing could know the difference, is it still possible? Being that I have no money to spend on articles like that (I am currently paying my own way through school, and even worse my location limits me from even seeing a store that carries these brands), I am curious to know if there is a way that I could walk into a room with everyone else wearing these suits, and myself not, and still  be looked at in the same way as someone wearing the higher quality item? I know how critical people can be, and I would like to know if it is that big a deal and if so if I need to start saving.
post #14 of 25
In response to bsmith:  people who know clothes will know clothes (yours and theirs), and there's not much to be done about that.  However, (1) not everyone who wears expensive clothes really knows clothes, and (2) not everyone is judgmental enough to condemn somebody because of what they're wearing, within bounds of reasonably good taste and propriety.  If they are that snobbish, they aren't people you should worry about impresssing or even befriending.  That being said, if you are worried about what impressions you make, remember that carriage can count for much more than accoutrement.  That means being polite, standing up straight, looking people in the eye, and projecting confidence -- not to be confused with arrogance, as other posts have explained.  In other words, be a man, and good people will respect you for it no matter what clothes you wear (unless you wear tennis shoes with your suits, in which case I can't help you until you stop). I'd say buy the best you can afford, and take time to plan your purchases so that you buy things that you like and that look nice.  Buying something just because it's on sale or inexpensive is a big waste of money if you end up not wearing what you've got.  From what you've said about your situation, it makes no sense to strap yourself over clothing.  Work on the intangibles, and the rest will come in due course.
post #15 of 25
Quote:
What about the person who can take nothing and make it something. Could that be seen as style as well? Although a well educated person in clothing could know the difference, is it still possible?
It's certainly possible with casual wear. Designers tend to look at what street kids are wearing, and copy it. They also raid thrift shops, and copy what they find. Yes, they put their own twist on it, but so does the person who buys the originals and figures out how to wear them. In my opinion, it is the most stylish people who make something enviable out of nothing.
Quote:
I am curious to know if there is a way that I could walk into a room with everyone else wearing these suits, and myself not, and still be looked at in the same way as someone wearing the higher quality item? I know how critical people can be, and I would like to know if it is that big a deal and if so if I need to start saving.
I haven't much to add to HappyDog's response here. I am, however, curious why this should be a big concern, since, as you say, you're working your way through school and stores near you don't even carry the big names we drop. It sounds to me like someone in your position and location wouldn't be expected to have, say, a Canali suit, let alone Brioni or Kiton. If your suit is tastefully, conservatively styled, fits well, and is in good shape, that's going to be all you need for a while. Anything beyond that should wait until you have"”or are interviewing for"”the salary to warrant it. Aside from your bearing, which HappyDog rightly identifies as the most important part of making a good impression, you can "make something out of nothing" to a limited extent by accessorizing. Good shoes are important, and should be a budgetary priority, but I wouldn't go "fashion-forward" with your footwear. Your choice of ties and pocket squares is where you can get creative without breaking the bank.
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