Leffot + EG complaint



zippyh said:

I was wondering about the prices too.
It sounds like EG quoted the MTO price for calf, not cordovan.

From 2008 http://asuitablewardrobe.dynend.com/2008/04/dry-comes-at-price.html

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I'd love to hear the OP respond to this. Plus, the fact that some funds from the sales were given to Japan tsunami relief efforts.



Jangofett said:

Er, why should Leffot and EG make the effort to make OP happy?
If it doesnt cost Leffot a cent, why not?
But if Leffot is gonna take a hit, why should they? Because OP fiddled on the internet?
EG goofed, EG should do something, not Leffot. But since EG make no mistake, so they need not do anything.
I think in this relationship, Leffot cant kick EG's ASS.

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Technically - Leffot did nothing wrong - but their business partner EG did (by quoting a price to a customer for a product that EG apparently did not have the legal right to sell directly to a customer.) The unforunate reality of business relationships is that sometimes you have to eat your partners mistakes in order to maintain good client relationships. In this case EG's mistake has become Leffot's PR problem.

Leffot is totally in the moral right to simply turn their back on the client if they wish - but that would be a silly business move - as it would damage their reputation. One must accept the fact when doing business that sometimes long term good will is more important than short term profit. Yes - the OP will end up getting his shoes for less than Leffot should have received from them.

Of course Leffot can kick ass with EG - that's what business partners do with each other all the time. They can pull EG from their store's offerings, demand EG honor their right to exclusive designs, negotiate a better discount to continue the contract, etc. etc. all things are negotiable between business partners - that's just life.

The 'problem' with this situation is that none of the parties actually had all of the information at the exact time that each made their decisions. And no one is taking a longer term view of the situation - I don't expect the OP to necessarily - but the businesses involved should be expected to most definitely - they are about to lose a customer for life.

I'm not so sure I respect the OP's decision to attempt to buy direct if he had originally seen the shoes at Leffot - but really - don't we all want to shop around for the best price. I certainly wouldn't have faulted him if he shopped other brick and morter stores. At which point he would have found out that he couldn't this exact shoe anywnere else and would have had to go back to Leffot to get it if he wanted it. It's all about SUPPLY and DEMAND - not actual cost or percentage markup.

As to those who feel the markup is extreme I say 'grow up'. The simple fact of the matter is that a business has the right to offer products at any markup they choose - and you as the customer have the right to purchase or not - plain and simple. For most clothing at department stores the markup can be up to 100%. You cannot expect to go into a retail store - enjoy their beautiful displays, use up their time and money, enjoy their free expresso service, put wear on their products by trying them on, etc. etc. and then go online to order them cheaper. It's just not right and if everyone did this there would be no brick and morter stores to offer such services.



Nicola said:

Really? How many companies make shoes? How many retailers currently stock EG in the US? Nothing forces Leffot to not switch to a more pro retailer supplier.

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Sure, Leffot can dump EG but would EG cry over it?
Its Leffot. Not Saks or NM.
Leffot aint a big player. Sorry.
If EG wants to do their own retail in NY or LA, they can do it.
They are not gonna miss Leffot.



Jangofett said:

If EG wants to do their own retail in NY or LA, they can do it.
They are not gonna miss Leffot.

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If that was true they would be doing it. Ask yourself why they aren't. Will they miss it? Maybe not but the people who want to buy EG would.

It probably cost them a bit to set up their store, hire their staff, do marketing etc.
Its cheaper to get people like Leffot to do all that for them.

But I think Leffot are not their sole distributor and if Leffot is really a pain in the neck by screaming at them for not knowing what they are doing by selling to Patek, then EG can simply say screw you Leffot and set up their e-store to sell to North America. If not, they wont sell to North America unless someone asks them to. I don't think Leffot sales form a big part of their bottomline.

I'm kind of indifferent to the plight of all parties listed. But...

jrd617 said:

I'd love to hear the OP respond to this. Plus, the fact that some funds from the sales were given to Japan tsunami relief efforts.

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..ouch. They probably could have put that money to good use.

I am indifferent to the situation because I feel for all parties. However, PR is important to a business and I am sure that Leffot has lost some sales due to this debacle. With that in mind I would try to make ammends with the OP. But who am I to make suggestions or demands? All I know is vendors have rights but so do the customers.....wonderful thing about commerce in the USA as we always have options.

Every party in this scenario has some degree of fault. I think other forumites have articulated how both EG and Leffott could have handled the situation better. But, I think the OP has escaped his share in this blame game. The OP knew the navy cordovan double monk was a Leffot "exclusive" by EG, yet he tried to work the system by placing a seemingly innocuous special order to an EG representative with the exact specifications of the Leffot "exclusive" model. Had he mentioned this fact to whoever took his order (who likely would have no reason to know anything about this model/exclusivity agreement), I suspect he/she would have looked into this matter and the order would have been cancelled straight away, citing the exclusivity agreement. Once successful with his end-around, the OP chose to announce it online to anyone who reads this forum or chooses to do an online search of "Edward Green" or "Leffot". Any resulting negative consequence is due to his "Hey, guys. Look what I'm about to pull off. I'll show Leffot what I think about their markup." post on this forum. Even the OP admits, had he kept this to himself (at least temporarily), he'd be enjoying his blue (non-)suede shoes right now.

Bargain-hunting/price-comparing is one thing, but blatantly working around an exclusivity agreement to save a few hundred bucks (not to mention at the loss of a charity), then bragging about it before the purchase is in your possession, is quite another.

Further down the culpability ladder, to me, are EG, who should have sorted this out with Leffott behind the scenes, then Leffot, who was, indeed being a bit petty and vindictive, though they do have a right to protect their exclusivity agreement.



hossoso said:

1. Yeah, you started talking about cars.
2. I live in Seattle for two months of the year, still get the NYT, even finds its way down to Mexico City... mind ****, I know.
3. Free market goes both ways, agreed. No, no one is right, is that how the expression goes? Or is it...? The customer is always... .... .... something? One syllable? Little help? Anybody?

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1) It is called an analogy. Because 3 pages of saying the same thing by various other people seems to have difficulty getting through to some posters. So I figured to use another example of essentially the same thing. Buying car is essentially the same thing as buying shoes - at least in this instance. Could have made the same example with coffee, jacket, ties, buckles, belts, house, or even slippers.

I'll try one more time to explain the point

Shoe/Car/Coffee/Tie/Furniture/House/Watch/Anything is given to Retailer A as exclusive by Manufacturer B
Customer C went to Manufacturer B and said... I want this Shoe/Car/Coffee/Tie/Furniture/House/Watch/Anything made for me.
Manufactuer B said sure we can do it...
Customer C says "Great!!" and goes to cancel his order with Retailer A
Retailer A finds out what Manufacturer B is doing and said.. "Wait a minute? I thought we had the exclusive?"
Manufacturer B said "Oh crap... you do!"
Manufacturer B cancels Customer C's order
Customer C goes to forum and posts that "Retailer A is a whiny ass"

That is essentially what I see happening.



2) Odd ... so because you have something that means everything else have? Or do you automatically associate with .. "well because you don't have it, it is a mind **** because you must not know it could be done." What odd assumptions.

3) .... sure Carry on. To believe customer is always right is as archaic as believing that no one makes mistakes. The sense of entitlement from some people is amazing.



jumpinjeffd said:

I am indifferent to the situation because I feel for all parties. However, PR is important to a business and I am sure that Leffot has lost some sales due to this debacle. With that in mind I would try to make ammends with the OP. But who am I to make suggestions or demands? All I know is vendors have rights but so do the customers.....wonderful thing about commerce in the USA as we always have options.

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+1, although I agree with most that EG should bear the brunt of frustration.

Btw, OP - if you really want those shoes still, just get a UK proxy to order them for you.

He will have to pay the VAT and the shipping...



TRINI said:

Btw, OP - if you really want those shoes still, just get a UK proxy to order them for you.

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I think there maybe a few questions asked of anyone ordering those bugga's now

What I've learned after 10 pages of this...

1. Dont ever deal with Edward Green directly, have an intermediary to absorb the pain, with the end goal being a pair of shoes only and avoiding the bullsh*t
2. Expect to pay $$$ to get said shoes and avoid the bullsh*t hassles
3. There are a lot of cheapskates, small-timers on Styleforum who desires luxury product but are too poor to afford and ***** and moan all day long about the price
4. Leffot is an awesome establishment deserving of my planned patronage for some MTM soon.



kev777 said:

I think there maybe a few questions asked of anyone ordering those bugga's now

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Not to mention they are fast becoming a part of forum lore, along the lines of the:

-The Pink Cashmere Attolini Tie (PCAT)
-The Green Hermes "Breast Wallet"