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The Official Artisanal "streetwear" footwear (boots, shoes, sandals) thread (Guidi, CCP, Augusta, M.A.+, M Moria, Carpe Diem, etc..) - Page 520post #7786 of 222738/16/13 at 11:49pmpost #7787 of 222738/17/13 at 3:12ampost #7788 of 222738/17/13 at 6:45amseems like an interesting debate, but really, if jun/IS/ma+ look similar to cdiem, it's because they WERE cdiem.
of course work should evolve with the times but i gotta say, cdiem's shapes are hard to beat, although ma+ has managed a very sleek look too.
i will look at some IS's in person tomorrow and cry at the pricepost #7789 of 222738/17/13 at 7:40amQuote:
Nobody's trying to say that Carpe Diem didn't have influence on shoe shapes in menswear; it obviously did. But their designs were also refinements of existing ideas, as every other designer continues to do. I don't understand the purpose of proclaiming every shoe with a rounded, raised toe box as being a Carpe knock-off. It's really unproductive and worse, it's unfair to the designers.post #7790 of 222738/17/13 at 7:43amQuote:Originally Posted by fistinyoface
Or try the IS S14 five hole boot and the CDiem S23M work boot. For m.a+ and Carpe, just take a look at the back zip. Really just compare any two pairs and you'll see the similarities. I've got multiple pairs of each and have many owned others. Perhaps if you're just judging from online pictures you're having difficulty making the connection.
Try asking on SZ. Even if that place is maligned here it's still the best source of info on these brands and the similarities are hardly unnoticed.
I'd say the toe shape on those are quite different,
As for MA+ and C.Diem back zips, all C.Diem back zips have a narrow toe and MA+ have the slight bulb shape. For me the shape of MA+ boots is nothing like C.Diem at all.post #7791 of 222738/17/13 at 10:37ampost #7792 of 222738/17/13 at 10:48amQuote:Originally Posted by brad-t
Nobody's trying to say that Carpe Diem didn't have influence on shoe shapes in menswear; it obviously did. But their designs were also refinements of existing ideas, as every other designer continues to do. I don't understand the purpose of proclaiming every shoe with a rounded, raised toe box as being a Carpe knock-off. It's really unproductive and worse, it's unfair to the designers.
Do you honestly think Vadel hasn't produced a Carpe knock off with these? As stated by shady_2001, they even copied the emblem from the bottom. It's not simply the rounded and raised toe box. It's the entire shape of the thing; and decreasing the raised toe box incline a few degrees isn't forging an entirely different design.
The toe is slightly more bulbous. Slightly. Hardly a world apart. Look at a pair of those side by side and then something like CCP, Rick, Augusta, Layer-0, Guidi, Incarnation, BBS, etc. Now there's a big difference. Here not so much.
It's pretty amazing that you guys don't get this. I'm not prescribing scorn on drawing any influences. Hell, I love Augusta and Simone likes reinterpretations more than anyone.post #7793 of 222738/17/13 at 11:31ampost #7794 of 222738/17/13 at 11:43ampost #7795 of 222738/17/13 at 12:20pmpost #7796 of 222738/17/13 at 2:22pmpost #7797 of 222738/17/13 at 3:26pmQuote:
dude dont discourage people from having a conversation. i am following the discussion even though i've had it before several times.post #7798 of 222738/17/13 at 8:40pmQuote:
Yes. The emblem is the only clearly ripped part and strikes me as more homage than knock-off. Those two models are not really similar ... just look at the stitching from the front.
In addition, the toebox is actually squared off slightly.
You're essentially saying any shoe with a wide, rounded, upturned toe box is a Carpe knock-off, even though all the Carpe models have taken way less trivial details from their predecessors. Carpe's shoes are, in and of itself, a reinterpretation of many basic shoe models.
It's not my intent to bore anyone, so I'm going to leave it at that.
Edited by brad-t - 8/17/13 at 9:15pmpost #7799 of 222738/17/13 at 11:08pmpost #7800 of 222738/18/13 at 12:47am
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