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Trump is #2 in GOP Field - Page 416

post #6226 of 8748
Well then it is ok, if no bleach was involved.
Quote:
Originally Posted by otc View Post

Or suggesting that people in finance are the ones who actually know what's going on:
Yes, the "revolving door" idea can be problematic...but so is trying to regulate without knowledgeable professionals.

As an example, I'd point to Tom Wheeler, head of the FCC. He may have come from a telecom and lobbyist background (and even got the John Oliver insult treatment a few years ago), but he's shown that he's completely willing to put forth regulatory schemes that the big telco players *do not like*

There's a difference between corruption in the revolving door and people coming from industry and being willing to actually play the regulator's role. Heck, I've worked for and against the same clients at different times--I'm perfectly capable of doing good work for whoever pays my bills, without thinking I have to fudge the numbers in favor of my old boss.

This is so naive.
post #6227 of 8748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibonius View Post

How does it compare?

Fraud is next level. Blaming fraud for a loss, especially preemptively, is calling into question the basic fairness of elections and the rule of law. There's a difference between saying "hey these people are trying to use the law to prevent you from voting" and "voting doesn't matter because the results are fraudulent."

I cannot count the number of times I've heard Bush "stole" the election from Gore. As I said, this ship has sailed. Y2K took the genie out of the bottle in terms of alleging presidential elections are now subject to fraud to such an extent things are basically rigged.
post #6228 of 8748
post #6229 of 8748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piobaire View Post

I cannot count the number of times I've heard Bush "stole" the election from Gore. As I said, this ship has sailed. Y2K took the genie out of the bottle in terms of alleging presidential elections are now subject to fraud to such an extent things are basically rigged.

Who is saying that though? Some moron on the street is not exactly equivalent to the titular head of a political party.
post #6230 of 8748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ataturk View Post

Apparently this is real.




Please tell Ataturk is wrong and this is fake. I'm dying here. lol8[1].gif
post #6231 of 8748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piobaire View Post


I cannot count the number of times I've heard Bush "stole" the election from Gore. As I said, this ship has sailed. Y2K took the genie out of the bottle in terms of alleging presidential elections are now subject to fraud to such an extent things are basically rigged.


Yeah, no, I wish I could agree that the ship has sailed but people show time and again how they forget history (if they ever bothered to learn it) and come back to the same trips and traps again and again.  To the contrary, I think Trump and his supporters may make the Bush/Gore thing pale in comparison. 

post #6232 of 8748
I've already posted about it before, but the BleachBit thing is idiotic, and that's really an insufficient fact check to what trump is actually saying.

Not only does he say they acid washed the emails, he says it's an expensive and involved process. Trying to conjure up the image of some extra shady behavior. Makes it clear that Trump doesn't actually know what he is talking about...it's not just a slip of the tongue or a metaphor gone wrong--just saying "acid" instead of "bleach" maybe, but not if you start going around and insisting on further details.

BleachBit is free. It is easy to use (as in, specifically designed to be a nice user friendly GUI vs most linux admin tools).
It is not even a very aggressive deletion program. It only does a single-pass wipe...Although the verdict is out on effectiveness, most people insist on at least the old DoD standard of 3 passes, while others use 7 or 35 pass wipes.
post #6233 of 8748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibonius View Post


Who is saying that though? Some moron on the street is not exactly equivalent to the titular head of a political party.

Well, until Trump that is.

post #6234 of 8748
Here are some of his acid wash quotes:
Quote:
You see what’s going on with her emails. It’s a disgrace. It’s a disgusting situation where she pretends like she doesn’t know. I mean, she had her emails — 33,000 emails — acid washed. The most sophisticated person never heard about acid washing. Acid washing is a very expensive process and that’s to really get rid of them.
I agree, a sophisticated IT person probably *hasn't* heard of acid washing your emails.
Quote:
But why do you acid wash, or bleach, the emails? Nobody even heard of it before. Very expensive. Just ask yourself.
Good thing his supporters don't actually ask for themselves.
Quote:
How about the acid wash of the e-mails that didn’t mean anything? How about the 33,000 missing e-mails that were acid washed — acid washed. And Rudy was telling me, nobody does it because it’s such an expensive process. OK, 33,000.
Ah yes, good old Rudy the IT wizard.
Quote:
and you get a subpoena, you get a subpoena, and after getting the subpoena, you delete 33,000 e-mails, and then you acid wash them or bleach them, as you would say, very expensive process.
Oh hey, someone tried to correct him and tell him it was just some free software called BleachBit...he at least marginally heard what they were saying!
post #6235 of 8748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibonius View Post

Who is saying that though? Some moron on the street is not exactly equivalent to the titular head of a political party.

Moron on the street? Nice attempt to frame here. High ranking Dems, civic leaders (particularly in the AA community,) pundits like Krugman.

I think sadly think Buda has a point though in the short term attention span of the majority. I see it too often to disagree.
post #6236 of 8748
Quote:
Originally Posted by otc View Post

Here are some of his acid wash quotes:
I agree, a sophisticated IT person probably *hasn't* heard of acid washing your emails.
Good thing his supporters don't actually ask for themselves.
Ah yes, good old Rudy the IT wizard.
Oh hey, someone tried to correct him and tell him it was just some free software called BleachBit...he at least marginally heard what they were saying!

Except she had $1000/hr lawyers doing the deletion for her, so I imagine it was very expensive after all.

ETA:

IIRC the IT administrators of her e-mail server had no concept of secure deletion, because the FBI was able to recover many of the older e-mails from "retired" servers they just left lying around somewhere. But that's separate from the ones Clinton gave to her lawyers (who destroyed the "personal" e-mails, many of which turned out to not be personal at all, which is what Trump was referring to).
post #6237 of 8748
What?

The emails were deleted by a Platte River Networks employee...

And it seems like part of the reason this is a big deal is because that employee fucked up and forgot to actually delete the stuff that that her cheif of staff said she no longer needed. The employee realized his mistake months later and deleted them then.

If this shit was intentional, they probably would have had a $1000 an hour lawyer overseeing it, and they would have made damn sure those emails were actually gone back in 2014 rather than letting them sit untouched in an archived PST file for four months.
post #6238 of 8748
The way I heard it, the law firm sorted the e-mails and destroyed the ones they decided were personal. Apparently they actually say the destruction was an accident based on a miscommunication. Interesting. But it wasn't done at the time the server was active. It was long afterwards, well intro the controversy.

It's amazing that the FBI was willing to accept all these coincidences and mistakes at face value.

Oops, we missorted the e-mails. Oops, we deleted them. Oops, I forgot what the classified symbol looks like. Oops, I forgot I was supposed to treat sensitive information like it was classified even if it hadn't been formally classified. Etc.
post #6239 of 8748
FWIW, the Platte River Networks employee sounds like an incompetent hack



He couldn't figure out how to archive the emails properly, so he created a fucking gmail account to use as an intermediary?

Honestly, that's probably the worst thing I've read about the whole controversy. I don't really care if a handful of email chains veered into classified territory when they should have switched communicaiton methods...but the guy they assigned to the Secretary of State's account is this bad at his job? That's the real problem.
post #6240 of 8748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ataturk View Post

The way I heard it, the law firm sorted the e-mails and destroyed the ones they decided were personal. Apparently they actually say the destruction was an accident based on a miscommunication. Interesting. But it wasn't done at the time the server was active. It was long afterwards, well intro the controversy.

This article describes the chain of events up to the deletion:
http://www.denverpost.com/2016/09/03/fbi-report-platte-river-network-employee-bleachbit-delete-clinton-e-mails/

Sounds like the deletion was intentional (and was after they selected the "relevant" emails for production).
But the timeline of the deletion is a comedy of errors.
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