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**The Official Shoe Care Thread: Tutorials, Photos, etc.** - Page 645

post #9661 of 19061
I'd try to use a 50/50 vinegar/water solution to try to get rid of them. Water acts as litmus paper on leather because it is more alkaline than the leather fibers themselves. Something acidic might work.
post #9662 of 19061
Quote:
Originally Posted by chogall View Post

Water stain CANNOT be removed on light colored leathers.

Best save is to conceal using dark shoe creams. Or paint the shoe darker.

I've tried renomat, acetone, dye preparer, deglazing liquid, and even diluted bleach. None of them made water stain on a pair of very light brown shoes go away.

Again, the stain is the result of leather exposed to water that is higher ph than the normal condition of the protein fibers. They want to be in the 3-5 range in the ph scale. Acetone is a ph of 7 and non-polar, bleach is even higher ph, and wouldn't help the situation. I'd give some diluted vinegar a shot. It might take some work to get it out, but I'd venture a guess that saturating the stains in some diluted vinegar and putting a paper towel over it, wetting the paper towel in the solution and putting like cling wrap over it to control evaporation and leave it for a day or two might lift the stain off of the leather and into the paper.
post #9663 of 19061
I've tried to soak and submerge the whole pair of shoes in water overnight and change the water twice in the interim. Dried at an indoor, airy, but no sunlight area. No cigar. Once the dye and impurities sets in, they are set in for good.

Maybe dark colored shoes could be salvaged but definitely not light colored ones.
post #9664 of 19061
Soaking in water isn't going to do it, you need something acidic to shift the protein fibers of the leather to ionic positive.
post #9665 of 19061
My learned friend....
post #9666 of 19061
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post


Probably not going to happen. This is always a risk with lighter coloured leathers and it happens usually during lasting. When a maker decides to use water during lasting or expose the shoe to moisture for any reason, it is always best to expose the whole shoe to an equal amount of water, apply a conditioner immediately, and let the shoe dry slowly.

Once a water stain occurs, however, it is often set permanently...simply because a water stain is essentially a residue of dyestuffs and chemicals (including tanning salts) that have dissolved, been transported, and then left behind as the water evaporates.

If you ever get your shoes soaking wet (I mean soaking wet) you might remember to heavily condition them with something like Lexol or Bick4 and let them dry really slowly. that might work and it might not but I would not advise trying it as a direct remedy.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chogall View Post

Water stain CANNOT be removed on light colored leathers.

Best save is to conceal using dark shoe creams. Or paint the shoe darker.

I've tried renomat, acetone, dye preparer, deglazing liquid, and even diluted bleach. None of them made water stain on a pair of very light brown shoes go away.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post

I'd try to use a 50/50 vinegar/water solution to try to get rid of them. Water acts as litmus paper on leather because it is more alkaline than the leather fibers themselves. Something acidic might work.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post


Again, the stain is the result of leather exposed to water that is higher ph than the normal condition of the protein fibers. They want to be in the 3-5 range in the ph scale. Acetone is a ph of 7 and non-polar, bleach is even higher ph, and wouldn't help the situation. I'd give some diluted vinegar a shot. It might take some work to get it out, but I'd venture a guess that saturating the stains in some diluted vinegar and putting a paper towel over it, wetting the paper towel in the solution and putting like cling wrap over it to control evaporation and leave it for a day or two might lift the stain off of the leather and into the paper.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chogall View Post

I've tried to soak and submerge the whole pair of shoes in water overnight and change the water twice in the interim. Dried at an indoor, airy, but no sunlight area. No cigar. Once the dye and impurities sets in, they are set in for good.

Maybe dark colored shoes could be salvaged but definitely not light colored ones.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post

Soaking in water isn't going to do it, you need something acidic to shift the protein fibers of the leather to ionic positive.

 

Lots of great info guys thanks!

 

I might give the 50/50 vinegar water a try and see how it goes, will post results.

post #9667 of 19061
You probably have to let it dwell a bit and control for some evaporation. Worth a shot, make sure you condition afterwards.
post #9668 of 19061
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post

Well, Goodman, if shiny shoes is something that you want then go for it because it will make your shoes shiny, but it doesn't mean there aren't better alternatives. Also, take people's advice with a grain of salt. Some people who post they have great experiences with a product maybe have two pairs of shoes they have had for a year. Their opinion and experience means little.

So far, based on my personal experience, my boots are not shiny. I prefer a matter shine to a spit shine on all my shoes/boots so I will keep an eye out for that. I care for my shoes sparingly and use a small amount of product when I do. Perhaps that has something to do with it. If, 5 years from now my boots are ruined, I will issue a mea culpa. But, for now, I have had great success taking care of my shoes and will continue to trust my intuition. As far as using on Cordovan, when I purchased my first and only pair of cordovan boots a few months ago I inquired about maintenance and the manager stuck a jar of renovaetur in the box (as a gift) and said that is all you need.

post #9669 of 19061
Beware of salespeople. They usually don't know all of the facts about their products. Then again I thought we were talking about VSC?
post #9670 of 19061

A

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post

Beware of salespeople. They usually don't know all of the facts about their products. Then again I thought we were talking about VSC?


So I shouldn't use renovateur on cordovan?

 

Unfortunately I have nothing more to say about VSC. My real name is not Larry Venetian so I really don't care if people choose to compliment or disparage the product. If people have had issues with the product they should post their experience here so we can learn from there misfortune. I'm sorry the product has worked for me so far and that I have fallen outside of SF orthodoxy.

post #9671 of 19061
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodman View Post

A



So I shouldn't use renovateur on cordovan?

Unfortunately I have nothing more to say about VSC. My real name is not Larry Venetian so I really don't care if people choose to compliment or disparage the product. If people have had issues with the product they should post their experience here so we can learn from there misfortune. I'm sorry the product has worked for me so far and that I have fallen outside of SF orthodoxy.

People have opinions which is why we come here, to express them. People often become so entrenched in their positions that they refuse to listen to the suggestions of others. It happens a lot here so accepting that fact is paramount to participating in threads. The only thing I can offer is that reno and lexol have worked for me, I also have picked up some bick 4 and will report back on that later.

Speaking for myself, I was simply asserting that people often have motives and no one is beyond reproach.
post #9672 of 19061
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodman View Post

Unfortunately I have nothing more to say about VSC. My real name is not Larry Venetian so I really don't care if people choose to compliment or disparage the product. If people have had issues with the product they should post their experience here so we can learn from there misfortune. I'm sorry the product has worked for me so far and that I have fallen outside of SF orthodoxy.

Oh, for crying out loud...it's not about SF orthodoxy. If anyone is expressing SF orthodoxy...where VSC and Saphir products are revered for no other reason than brand name cachet or the endorsement of high end manufacturers and public relations campaigns...it's you. SF tends to be a place where unfounded opinions and "intuition" often trump objective fact...and the primary reason a product has a following here is that it's made in France, comes in a fancy package, or costs more than all reason or logic would suggest it is worth.

GlenKaren and Bick4 and a few others are the new kids on the block--they're certifiably unorthodox

Turpentine is not good for leather. Period.

--
Edited by DWFII - 6/18/14 at 8:35pm
post #9673 of 19061
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodman View Post

A



So I shouldn't use renovateur on cordovan?

Unfortunately I have nothing more to say about VSC. My real name is not Larry Venetian so I really don't care if people choose to compliment or disparage the product. If people have had issues with the product they should post their experience here so we can learn from there misfortune. I'm sorry the product has worked for me so far and that I have fallen outside of SF orthodoxy.

Go back and re-read our conversation. The topic of conversation was VSC. I told you why I wouldn't use it. What does this have to do with Saphir Renovateur? On the topic of Renovateur, I do feel that it is more of a polish and had less conditioning properties than other products out there by both Saphir and other companies.
post #9674 of 19061
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post

Oh, for crying out loud...it's not about SF orthodoxy. If anyone is expressing SF orthodoxy...where VSC and Saphir products are revered for no other reason than brand name cachet or the endorsement of high end manufacturers and public relations campaigns...it's you. SF tends to be a place where unfounded opinions and "intuition" often trump objective fact...and the primary reason a product has a following here is that it's made in France, comes in a fancy package, or costs more than all reason or logic would suggest it is worth.

GlenKaren and Bick4 and a few others are the new kids on the block--they're certifiably unorthodox

Turpentine is not good for leather. Period.

--

I would take this further and say that nobody can really say whether they have "success" with these products yet as not enough time as gone by to accurately assess them. Glen's products haven't been around that long, and I don't think you have been using Bick4 all that long either. You can put acetone on your shoes where one would use a conditioner, but if you don't do it over a period of time, using the shoe, exposing it to the elements, it won't really show harmful in the short run.

Also, people confuse something as being harmful to shoes with something that is just not simply helpful. I'd say a large amount of products are split between these categories.
post #9675 of 19061
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post

I would take this further and say that nobody can really say whether they have "success" with these products yet as not enough time as gone by to accurately assess them. Glen's products haven't been around that long, and I don't think you have been using Bick4 all that long either. You can put acetone on your shoes where one would use a conditioner, but if you don't do it over a period of time, using the shoe, exposing it to the elements, it won't really show harmful in the short run.

Also, people confuse something as being harmful to shoes with something that is just not simply helpful. I'd say a large amount of products are split between these categories.

I agree...a lot of shoe care products contain harmful chemicals--heavy occlusive oils, solvents, etc.--in small enough amounts that no immediate damage is readily apparent. That doesn't mean it isn't happening...just that by the time the damage is done, selective amnesia will kick in and make the effects of wear, environmental insults, and the abuse of indifference, seem more immediate. And the subtle connection between proper maintenance, the health of the leather, as well as its ability to withstand the rigours of use will never be made.

Of course, that's one of the problems with posting to a forum such as this one...on one level or another exposure to objective information tends to ruin a person--once you are confronted with the facts, it's hard to comfortably retreat back into ignorance. That's not to say you can't close your mind to information that unsettles your world view--plenty of evidence for that right here on SF--but there'll always be that niggling "itch" somewhere deep in your subconscious...

--
Edited by DWFII - 6/19/14 at 7:32am
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