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**The Official Shoe Care Thread: Tutorials, Photos, etc.** - Page 575

post #8611 of 19072
Well speaking to the creator who I trust, yes. The factors that led to my shoes cracking and such could have nothing to do with reno in reality, but it was a constant for me so I am trying something different. We will see in five years or some down the road when I start complaining about my current stock of shoes.

Glen has, in this thread spoken a lot about the science behind using coconut oil, orange oil and so on. It makes sense to me.
post #8612 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by RIDER View Post

Are you sure about that?

+1
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post


Glen has, in this thread spoken a lot about the science behind using coconut oil, orange oil and so on. It makes sense to me.

I would be interested to know what sort of r&d has been done and I would like to hear more about the science behind it.

I do commend Glen for taking the initiative.
post #8613 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by RIDER View Post

Are you sure about that?

The thing is--that's dirty pool. If you are going to suggest that Glen or anyone is using ingredients that run counter to his own statements and/or claims, then you ought to be prepared to elaborate.

Maybe you are...so don't leave us hanging.
post #8614 of 19072
I've been meaning to share these for a while now. Some of the old timers might remember the hubbub about J&M Handmade shoes. These were a line of hand-welted shoes made by Johnston & Murphy from Freudenburg Calf. Rumored to be made for dignitaries and the Rat Pack, the line has been defunct for years. These in particular were referred to as Detroit Spade or shovel sole shoes. Pretty unique design shape with a distinctly vintage feel.

I've been wearing them 10 years, they were new deadstock when I bought them. Soles are still going strong, though, admittedly, I don't wear them as often as some others. Some pron and a question below.

You can see the original silk ribbon laces that came with these.





The stitching is very fine. You can see a little bit of the cracking referenced below in this picture. Top stitches on the sole are vertically channeled (I think that's what it's called).




Tapered heel. No back seam.




All leather heal. Beveled sole (subtle).





So my questions. There's been some superficial cracking at the toe. This is obscured when I polish, but they come right back after wearing. Any thoughts on what causes this? As an aside, I had always wondered what kind of leather this is. It's pretty shiny. I wonder if it is some type of corrected grain. French calf? Who knows, but it sure takes a beating. Only very minor maintenance required.




A bit of toe spring. The outer lip of the sole has turned up a little over time as well.
post #8615 of 19072
I don't see any cracking, but I see creasing. Putting trees in them helps, but it is totally normal. Nice shoes you have there.
post #8616 of 19072
Those look very similar to my US made ConleyII from the Crown Aristocraft line.


post #8617 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post

I don't see any cracking, but I see creasing. Putting trees in them helps, but it is totally normal. Nice shoes you have there.

I didn't do a good job photographing it, but you can see it just to the left of the flash reflection. It's on the toe. Not the normal creasing across the vamp.
post #8618 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post

The thing is--that's dirty pool. If you are going to suggest that Glen or anyone is using ingredients that run counter to his own statements and/or claims, then you ought to be prepared to elaborate.

Maybe you are...so don't leave us hanging.

Oh, I'm not saying he is using anything that runs counter to what is discussed......I am saying that if we examine some products we should examine all. Glen is more than capable of posting the msds for his products here. No one would expect him to post his formula, but since he seems to knock Saphir in his thread I'm sure he wouldn't mid the same evaluation of his products. Since they are shipped outside of his neighborhood and to other countries, he would have to have them to be within legalities.....that pesky CFR-49 and all. Since they are offered for consumer consumption, he would also have these readily available as he would have had them processed to register with his local 24 hour poison control center, or with Chemtrec which is who most of us use and ER's call first after your child accidentally eats it or gets it in their eyes and you take them there. I do think it's interesting that folks buy into 'natural, non-toxic' when there is a big orange X on the jars......at least I hope there is since they are highly flammable and fall under HAZMAT labelling regulations.

Anyway, it should be a simple thing to post the msds's here.
post #8619 of 19072
I think DW said it best. Essentially there is seedy stuff in shoe care products, or things that are contrary to the health of leather, but what it comes down to is the effectiveness of what other ingredients is in the stuff that is going to matter in the end; how much these ingredients are offsetting some of the other necessary ingredients. To me most conditioners seem to behave more like neutral polishes and don't seem to offer much in terms of conditioning. That, plus some poor experiences just leads me to believe manufacturers want to offer a product that is easy to use and gets a fast result. The result is generally something cosmetic, and who knows, maybe at the expense of what is actually best for the leather.
post #8620 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickBOOTH View Post

Over the years I have done a lot of different things in order to protect and shine my shoes. Some of those things was rather complex in order to keep my leather shoes supple and maintain a brilliant shine. Using much of Lear's (not the ugly one) advice I used to maintain a mirror shine on the top caps and heel quarters, however as my collection has expanded my time for the obsessive art has greatly diminished. I have begun using a ritual that I feel is pretty foolproof, yet yeilds an excellent result.


I start, by just buffing the shoe to get the dust off with an old cotton tee shirt and I Saphir Renovateur, the whole damn thing. I let it sit a few minutes and then I lightly buff with the cotton shirt again. I then use Saphir wax on the toe in repeated small swirls and work back towards the vamp. Doing this puts most of the wax on the toe and only the remnants end up on the vamp. This is crucial so you don't get build up in the creases. I am also aware of some people saying that wax polish dries out leather, but with Saphir I have found that it doesn't ever really dry out like kiwi and some others do, it stays gunky and maliable. I then add some wax to the heel counters and work towards the center of the shoe once again. After the whole shoe has this thin layer of wax let it dry and buff fast, yet lightly with a horsehair brush. Many people stop here, however I feel in order to bring out a really nice glow and remove excess wax it is a good idea to let the shoe dry with its shine for a bit, say 10 minutes, then apply another light coat of Saphir Renovateur, let sit and buff with the same horsehair brush in the same manner. For some reason this last application of renovateur seems to bring out a better glow then if you hadn't used it. I think the renovateur really smoothes out the finish and helps the wax penetrate into the pores more. Anyway, I feel that this ritual is a great alternative to the labor intensive and highly sought after mirror shine.


This finish I feel lasts a long time as well. After each wearing I just give the shoes a good brush with the horsehair and they clean up very well. Every now and again a light coat on renovateur seems to bring out the shine and nourish the leather. It also helps to gradually pick up the old polish while conditioning as to not create any build-up. If I do this I will apply the renovateur right as I take off my shoes and put in the trees. Since the leather is still warm from my feet the reno penetrates better and picks up some of the loosened polish.


Just thought that I would share. Best of luck.

it seems like your sentiments have changed drastically. i spoke with Glen via email and will be putting in an order.



@RIDER And in my OP i meant superficial cracking/creases. I will try to get some photos up this weekend, and also catch up with the 87 pages...

I actually scuffed my Meermin dark brown cap toe oxford last December and its been bothering me for a long time; hence, my curiosity in this thread. The scuff still has a pigment of leather that sticks up, and I am not sure at this point whether I should take a pair of tweezers and yank it off then apply product. As noted I already tried applying Reno for the first time last weekend and though it darkened the area upon application, brushing and rubbing with cloth only made the imperfection visible again. FWIW it does not bother me as much when on foot compared to when stored. I did bring it to the cobbler and he mentioned 1) Why didn't I apply any "protection" prior to first wear and 2) The blemish will only stand out more as the shoe builds a patina. What he did was apply a little bit of wax and brushed it...

BTW, I believe @Renault78law meant the superficial cracks indicate in the circled area below, which is also what I am curious about granted mine is on a very small region of the toe and more compacted. As stated, I only noticed these marks after using Reno (I only used one layer):

post #8621 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by RIDER View Post

No one would expect him to post his formula, but since he seems to knock Saphir in his thread I'm sure he wouldn't mid the same evaluation of his products.

To be fair I don't think Glen has knocked or been derogatory about Saphir, certainly not to my knowledge. He did quote something about his wife not liking the smell, but he himself quite liked it IIRC. And he has always said Saphir was one of the best polishes he had tried, before his own creation of course.

My personal position is that of curiosity, how the product was developed, what tests if any were done, what informed his development and of course an msds helps. I suppose it's the old two bob mentality, when we buy something for a couple of dollars or pounds we give it less thought, as a more expensive and hopefully finer option you kind of wanna know what is so special about it to help justify the cost to yourself.
post #8622 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renault78law View Post

I've been meaning to share these for a while now. Some of the old timers might remember the hubbub about J&M Handmade shoes. These were a line of hand-welted shoes made by Johnston & Murphy from Freudenburg Calf. Rumored to be made for dignitaries and the Rat Pack, the line has been defunct for years. These in particular were referred to as Detroit Spade or shovel sole shoes. Pretty unique design shape with a distinctly vintage feel.

I've been wearing them 10 years, they were new deadstock when I bought them. Soles are still going strong, though, admittedly, I don't wear them as often as some others. Some pron and a question below.

This looks to be the surface acrylic finish cracking than the actual leather.
post #8623 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by sstomcat View Post

This looks to be the surface acrylic finish cracking than the actual leather.

That or there's just too much wax on the forepart of the shoe. Either way, given the photos, I don't see any really cracking of the leather itself.
post #8624 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post


That would be more your "shtick" than mine. I have never, and do not ever, pretend to knowledge or experience that I don't really have...and more importantly, haven't earned.

"Pretense" is your last name...even if you don't spell it out.

--

 

Rant and rage all you want D - I won't get dragged into another thread derail.

post #8625 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renault78law View Post

I've been meaning to share these for a while now. Some of the old timers might remember the hubbub about J&M Handmade shoes. These were a line of hand-welted shoes made by Johnston & Murphy from Freudenburg Calf. Rumored to be made for dignitaries and the Rat Pack, the line has been defunct for years. These in particular were referred to as Detroit Spade or shovel sole shoes. Pretty unique design shape with a distinctly vintage feel.

I've been wearing them 10 years, they were new deadstock when I bought them. Soles are still going strong, though, admittedly, I don't wear them as often as some others. Some pron and a question below.

You can see the original silk ribbon laces that came with these.





The stitching is very fine. You can see a little bit of the cracking referenced below in this picture. Top stitches on the sole are vertically channeled (I think that's what it's called).




Tapered heel. No back seam.




All leather heal. Beveled sole (subtle).





So my questions. There's been some superficial cracking at the toe. This is obscured when I polish, but they come right back after wearing. Any thoughts on what causes this? As an aside, I had always wondered what kind of leather this is. It's pretty shiny. I wonder if it is some type of corrected grain. French calf? Who knows, but it sure takes a beating. Only very minor maintenance required.




A bit of toe spring. The outer lip of the sole has turned up a little over time as well.

Nice looking shoes I do agree ! Just a maybe stupid question. There is a visible mark on the first two photos, a pressure mark on the outside of the left shoe welt. Are you by any chance a city bike rider ? I've seen similar marks on shoes used to ride to work on bicycles - the pedal or toe clip made them. If so, this could explain the creasing and the turned-up front part of the welt ? In fact, as I am warming to my detective work, there is also a flattened mark on the very front of the welt at the toe, indicating some similar unusual use - the position of the front part of the toe strap may be ?. Well, just a longshot.


Edited by thelonius - 3/27/14 at 1:55pm
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