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**The Official Shoe Care Thread: Tutorials, Photos, etc.** - Page 774

post #11596 of 19233
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick V. View Post

Some of whats being reported here is precisely why I recommend cream polishes over wax.
High-grade skins are not tanned to look like mirrors. They are tanned and should be maintained to reflect the integrity and beauty of the skin itself. A high gloss shine, to me, cheapens a skin that you paid a lot for to look like what it is meant to look like. Of course this is a cosmetic issue and just my opinion.

Cream polishes and conditioners penetrate deeper into the pores and nourishes the leather leaving it with a healthy, well fed (maintained) look. We all know that when using wax on a regular basis every so often the wax has to be stripped off, the pores exposed and, conditioners applied. Why? Because the wax builds up and seals the pores suffocating the skin not allowing it to breathe.

So, ask yourself after the wax builds up and seals the pores what is it that is really shining? Is it the leather? IMO it's the wax that's shining. So, how can that be healthy for the leather? It's like waxing a car. The more coats properly applied the higher the gloss. But, that's not the paint glowing it's the wax. If you take it a step further.....What's happening to the liner of the shoe?

If you sealed the uppers with wax that prohibits the liners to function as intended. Your perspiration is absorbed in part by the liners. If the upper leather is able to breathe it will help release some of the moisture. If it's sealed by wax the liners will wick the perspiration only to be repelled back to the inside of the upper leather and into the liners.
This is why an upper and -or- lining is more likely to crack or rot using wax rather than cream polish. Add to that the problems you my incur stripping the built up wax.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post


Good points--what you're talking about is the wax occluding the leather...suffocating it. .
post #11597 of 19233
Quote:
Originally Posted by TweedyProf View Post
 

 

Sharp, sharp point, dear sir. 

post #11598 of 19233
Quote:
Originally Posted by laufer View Post

Man, he does sound like David.

PCK1 is right on money. Creams are not necessary unless you want to change the color of the shoe. I learned the hard way, I wish I did not buy so many creams. I said this before and I will say it again Saphir excellent products but Saphir marketing is even better than its products. All you need to know that Saphir has "an expiration date" on their products.

GlenKaren started its shoe care line because he disliked the smell of regular shoe care creams and waxes. I tried Glen products, I do not think they are better than Saphir or Kiwi but they smell nice.

With shoe care products you really need very little.

If there is something you need to readjust, then it'll be your level of prejudice. Just because someone sound young does not mean the individual is dave copeland. I don't seek no further comparison of myself and that man, and for whatever he did, it was, and is, not my fault, and I deserve no comparison. It is because of this kind of comparison that you make someone less likely to carry the will to learn. 

 

Look back at the pages. I never feel offended when I speak to veteran shoe enthusiasts like DW, and you know why? Because he told me to learn, and more than that, he taught me without giving me offensiveness.

 

To all fellow SFers, please. If dave copeland did something to you, it's him, not me. My name is Travers, not dave.

post #11599 of 19233

I should say, I'm not trying to immerse myself in the recent debate. I was just struck by that point of agreement between DWF and Nick V who are sometimes at odds on most other things and one just has to balance the diversity of experiences by members of this forum.

 

Brushing is the only thing I am certain of at this point.

post #11600 of 19233
Quote:
Originally Posted by TweedyProf View Post
 

I should say, I'm not trying to immerse myself in the recent debate. I was just struck by that point of agreement between DWF and Nick V who are sometimes at odds on most other things and one just has to balance the diversity of experiences by members of this forum.

 

Brushing is the only thing I am certain of at this point.

Brushes are shoes and leathers' best friends, after all.... Those were even in the record.

post #11601 of 19233

I started to buy different stuff about recently because of some inputs of this forum.  I believe Ron rider was the one that quote most of the following statments (sorry in advance if I am mistaken or are any other forum members involve in the quotations).  This is a recopilatory I have from the SF.

 

 

"True shoe aficionados can argue for hours over whether wax or cream is the most effective polish for their prized footwear. Both are effective, and the use of one or the other is certainly necessary for the proper upkeep of your shoes.
 

IV.-Paste (Wax) Polish

Finding the "˜recipe' that manufacturers use for their paste, or wax, polish is as difficult as prying a BBQ sauce recipe from a Texan - can't seem to be done. Nevertheless, in examining the Material Handling Safety Datasheets that the government requires of these concoctions, it appears that the overwhelming ingredient is Stoddard Solvent (Naphtha) which, in the case of Kiwi (division of Sara Lee) and Kelly's (Fiebings, Inc. in Milwaukee) exceeds 90%. The two other popular shoe polish brands here, Lincoln and Angelus, do not make their MSDS as readily available, so I cannot speak to their main ingredient, but both seem to contain more pigment/waxes than the more popular Kiwi*. A notable exception is the Avel wax polishes (Saphir and Medaille D'Or) which both use a turpentine (natural) base. All use some combination of Carnauba and Beeswax as a binder.

Despite this information, which would seem to counter-act the marketing messages of these products, all are useful in the general upkeep of the finish of fine dress shoes. A personal observation is that Lincoln and the Avel polishes are the most effective in regards to coverage, protection and filling/fixing minor scuffs and cuts.



III.-Cream Polish


Available in a huge variety of colors, CREAM Polish is very similar to the harder WAX polishes with the main difference being some subtraction of solvent and a corresponding addition of mineral oil, or similar ingredient. While equal in it's ability to impart color, the cream polishes generally do not have the same ability to cover the inevitable scuffs and cuts that a leather shoe is prone to experience. In addition to the above manufacturers, others of note are Urad (Italy), Colonnil (Germany) and Smart (Turkey).


II.-Conditioner/Cleaners

The most under-used products in the shoe care market might very well be the neutral, more natural "˜cleaner & conditioner' products. In my opinion, the continual use of these products on a weekly (or more often) basis is far more important to the overall "˜health' of a fine leather upper than even the regular use of colored waxes and creams. Easy to apply, these products all go a long way in keeping leather supple, protected and, in the case of the brown tones, help to bring out that all important "˜patina' that can only develop naturally thru time and attention. Containing little or no harmful chemicals, any of the following are worth investing in: Allen Edmonds Conditioner/Cleaner, Crema Alpina (Italy), Renovateur by Avel (Spain/France) and Lexol (USA).



The Process

start by applying a liberal amount of one of the conditioner/cleaners mentioned above. Allow a few minutes and promptly rub briskly with a cotton or felt rag. The shoe bags that often come in the box with "˜better' shoes are ideal for this...simply cut into large strips for your polishing use.

 

Next, apply the appropriate shoe cream to areas that are showing the most wear. It is not necessary for the colors to match exactly (except for black, obviously), but to either blend in, or to highlight at your choosing. For example, a "˜cognac' colored shoe might see "˜tan', "˜mahogany', "˜light brown' or "˜mid-brown' polishes; or maybe all four. Experiment.

 

 After the cream hazes over, apply another coat of cleaner/conditioner and let sit for a few minutes. Take a high quality horsehair brush (the best are from Frank-Brushes, in Germany) and brush along the sides and across the vamp (top to the tip).

 

Next, apply your choice of wax/paste polish and, again, allow to haze over. After 5 minutes or so, brush off as before.

 

Finally, re-apply one more coat off cleaner/conditioner, allow to dry for a minute or two, and brush again.

 

You can stop now, or continue to a "˜spit-shine' step, which really just involves taking and old necktie (or nylon hose), misting a little water onto your shoe, and rapidly buffing with the silk rag. The heat from the quick motion combined with a little water will "˜build' another protective layer onto your shoe.

 

A final step, though one I do not really recommend for most, is to use a "˜edge dye' (we simply use leather dye from Fiebings) to dye the sole/welt edge and trim. This is tricky, and it is easy to ruin an upper if you do not do this carefully with the included dauber, so I would leave this to the cobbler, but the leather dye is readily available from Fiebings."

 


Thats what we are doing here, discussing on the Shoe Care issue, so please lets put personal things aside.  

 

Thanks both Travercsao and PCK1 for your personal experiences and contributions. It seems I am at the starting point..:violin:

post #11602 of 19233

Gents:

 

Quick reminder on the consensus here as to how to deal with road salt on shoes? I know this will vary with the type of leather so, instructions for all types except for shell (which I don't have).

 

I have a pair of scotch grain shoes that I'm breaking out for the first time to deal with the snow. Just wiped quickly with a damp cloth to remove the salt. The scotch grain seems to be perfect for this sort of weather. I suppose shell is ideal too?

post #11603 of 19233
With all due respect...and in an attempt to bring some perspective to this discussion...I don't think the age of a person or their physical or intellectual resemblance to someone else has any bearing on any of this.

I've encountered many people...from my POV, a discouraging number of people...on this forum who simply are not willing to listen or to defer to experience and/or objective knowledge. And it doesn't matter how old or how easy going or popular they are.

And yes, it's an immature...if not young...way to behave.

When we talk about these issues the only things that matter are a respect for objective analysis and a willingness to listen to people who bring something more than a singular, insular POV to the issue.

When the issue becomes the way someone says something--the words they use, the "tone of voice"--rather that what is being said, the whole discussion devolves into a pettiness that smacks of personality and personal attack. Attacks which are, in fact, all too often inversely proportional to the the expertise of the attacker and any purpose or element of constructiveness.

I don't say this at or to anyone. Just an observation drawn from experience. FWIW.

--
post #11604 of 19233

I personally don't like shell in wet conditions.

 

I don't think it handles it well and then is a pain to clean off everytime.

post #11605 of 19233
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCK1 View Post

I personally don't like shell in wet conditions.

I don't think it handles it well and then is a pain to clean off everytime.

I am getting to the same conclusion. I have been wearing my only pair in very wet conditions for about half a dozen of times. The shell cordovan rain or water repelling tributes have been over-hyped.
post #11606 of 19233
dudes i have two pairs of dress shoes (non-shell), bean boots, and the JCP Stafford Deacon dress boots.

how can i make sure these are all prepped for winter? i don't plan on wearing anything but the bean boots in REAL inclement (NYC) weather. but the others will be exposed to rain/snow/sleet on occasion.

all i have right now is Lexol. and i know, or at least think, that won't help at all in this case.

thanks. icon_gu_b_slayer[1].gif
post #11607 of 19233

Shell is not on my horizon, but salt is. Best practices (i.e. any consensus on this thread)?

post #11608 of 19233
Quote:
Originally Posted by TweedyProf View Post

Shell is not on my horizon, but salt is. Best practices (i.e. any consensus on this thread)?
If I recall correctly @patrickBOOTH
Mentioned a white vinegar solution to remove salt stains. Hopefully he can chime in.

@thefastlife you'll likely want to winter proof them with something like sno-seal or Obenaufs hdlp. (I think sno-seal might contain silicone tho)
post #11609 of 19233
Quote:
Originally Posted by TweedyProf View Post

Shell is not on my horizon, but salt is. Best practices (i.e. any consensus on this thread)?

post #11610 of 19233
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post


NOOOOOOOOOO! :) 
But let's say I am obstinate in not wearing SWIMS and the like (I might do it, but let's just say I don't...hypothetically). The scotch grain seems to repel water better (it has a commando sole so seems also good for gripping). Not clear to me that a damp cloth was the best way to remove the salt, but that's what I did (it will solubilize the salt, though I wiped a few times immediately). The issue is less salt stains (thanks for the thought, Ozzy), but just getting them off the shoe. It's not slushy and gross today, but light snow, and lots of salt on the sidewalks. So, if I were to persist DWF, the next best thing? 

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