or Connect
Styleforum › Forums › Men's Style › Classic Menswear › **The Official Shoe Care Thread: Tutorials, Photos, etc.**
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

**The Official Shoe Care Thread: Tutorials, Photos, etc.** - Page 723

post #10831 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by mediahound View Post


I think they're infused with wax/oil. The thing is almost like a candle or something. 

It begs the question though...what kind of oil or wax is the bone stuffed with? What if it is mineral oil? Are you OK with that?

Oil tends to be a bit fugitive over time...do you have to buy another bone when it gets dry?

Fundamentally, all that is happening here is that the oil is acting as a lubricant to allow the bone to slide on the leather without abrading the surface. As pB said why not use a reliable conditioner like Bick4....which has some lubricating properties...and a spoon?

Don't get me wrong, if the oil is not mineral oil, there's probably nothing wrong with using the oil bone but it's not magic either.

On the other hand, a cow bone that has been polished with 4000grit Abralon and some rouge or tripoli, has no equal for burnishing or chasing wrinkles
post #10832 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post


It begs the question though...what kind of oil or wax is the bone stuffed with? What if it is mineral oil? Are you OK with that?

Oil tends to be a bit fugitive over time...do you have to buy another bone when it gets dry?

Fundamentally, all that is happening here is that the oil is acting as a lubricant to allow the bone to slide on the leather without abrading the surface. As pB said why not use a reliable conditioner like Bick4....which has some lubricating properties...and a spoon?

Don't get me wrong, if the oil is not mineral oil, there's probably nothing wrong with using the oil bone but it's not magic either.

On the other hand, a cow bone that has been polished with 4000grit Abralon and some rouge or tripoli, has no equal for burnishing or chasing wrinkles

 

Apparently, it's unprocessed deer bone marrow:

 

"Abbeyhorn uses bone from Scottish Red Deer, a large UK deer species. Sourced as a natural by-product of the Scottish deer farming industry, the bone is unprocessed and still contains its fatty marrow, which is essential for helping care for fine leather." http://www.leatherfoot.com/artisans/abbeyhorn

 

Which I guess helps nourish the shell cordovan: 

 

post #10833 of 19072
There are so many problems with the first video posted (post #10818) that it makes me nervous.

First what "welting?" when applied to a shoe the term "welt" has a specific meaning.

Second, the commentator refers to cordovan as a skin. It isn't. It's a membrane/layer that resides between the skin and the muscle.

Third, the speaker says the bones have been soaked in oil.

And maybe most nervous making of all is that there is a scratching sound every time the bone is rubbed on the shoe. When you rub an un-soaked, polished cow bone on leather with, or without a lubricant (but preferably with), there is no sound whatsoever. Scratching sounds are an indication that something is not right--from boning to chasing to clicking (cutting), a scratching/skritching sound is an indication that something is tearing or breaking or being abraded.

--
Edited by DWFII - 10/3/14 at 7:29am
post #10834 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by mediahound View Post

Apparently, it's unprocessed deer bone marrow:

"Abbeyhorn uses bone from Scottish Red Deer, a large UK deer species. Sourced as a natural by-product of the Scottish deer farming industry, the bone is unprocessed and still contains its fatty marrow, which is essential for helping care for fine leather." http://www.leatherfoot.com/artisans/abbeyhorn

Which I guess helps nourish the shell cordovan: 


Here's another suspect issue: if the bone is dense enough to be a polishing bone or rub stick, the marrow inside is not going to come through with that much alacrity. It may be a slow seep but very slow indeed. I am ready to believe that the bones are soaked, but marrow coming through...??

[As a side note you'd think that after nearly 10, 000 years of shoe (and shoe care) evolution if deer bone marrow was that essential for caring for "fine leather" it would be the prime ingredient in all shoe conditioners...or at least sold as a premium conditioner all on its own.]

And it has to be said that the description of the deer bones on the Leatherfoot website are not consistent with the description of the deer bones on the Abbyhorn site. Nowhere it is mentioned on the Abbyhorn site that the marrow is soaking through. "Marrow" isn't even mentioned. What's that about?

A good rule of thumb is to never extend unreserved trust to any information provided by Internet websites...esp. those that have a vested interest in selling a particular product.
post #10835 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post

Here's another suspect issue: if the bone is dense enough to be a polishing bone or rub stick, the marrow inside is not going to come through with that much alacrity. It may be a slow seep but very slow indeed. I am ready to believe that the bones are soaked, but marrow coming through...??

[As a side note you'd think that after nearly 10, 000 years of shoe (and shoe care) evolution if deer bone marrow was that essential for caring for "fine leather" it would be the prime ingredient in all shoe conditioners...or at least sold as a premium conditioner all on its own.]

And it has to be said that the description of the deer bones on the Leatherfoot website are not consistent with the description of the deer bones on the Abbyhorn site. Nowhere it is mentioned on the Abbyhorn site that the marrow is soaking through. "Marrow" isn't even mentioned. What's that about?

A good rule of thumb is to never extend unreserved trust to any information provided by Internet websites...esp. those that have a vested interest in selling a particular product.

It's a bit mysterious indeed and, it just works. Your choice to either believe those with direct experience with it saying it does a nice job, or not to.

I just look at it as another tool in the shoe care arsenal.
post #10836 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post


And maybe most nervous making of all is that there is a scratching sound every time the bone is rubbed on the shoe. When you rub an un-soaked, polished cow bone on leather with, or without a lubricant (but preferably with), there is no sound whatsoever. Scratching sounds are an indication that something is not right--from boning to chasing to clicking (cutting), a scratching/skritching sound is an indication that something is tearing or breaking or being abraded.

--

 

Now your really drawing at straws. Brushing with a horse-hair shoe brush is even louder. By your logic, because that makes  a noise, it shouldn't be done. 

post #10837 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by mediahound View Post

Now your really drawing at straws. Brushing with a horse-hair shoe brush is even louder. By your logic, because that makes  a noise, it shouldn't be done. 

Not really. it doesn't make logical sense that a polished surface...with oil as a lubricant...should make any noise whatsoever. What would cause such scratching noises? What would cause any noise?

Aside from logic, however, "direct experience" with using bones (deer bones included) as shoemaking tools for many, many, many years made me sit up and take notice when I watched/heard the video.
post #10838 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by mediahound View Post



It's a bit mysterious indeed and, it just works. Your choice to either believe those with direct experience with it saying it does a nice job, or not to.



I just look at it as another tool in the shoe care arsenal.

 



I've used deer bone on all my shells - it works a treat - and the bone is still oily after well over a year.

ALL information on the web should be filtered by the reader's own common sense and practical experience. Including any suggestion that one should presume that vendors are likely lying to you about the products they sell.
post #10839 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFII View Post


First what "welting?" when applied to a shoe the term "welt" has a specific meaning.

In this case "welt" and "welting" refers to the little raised dimples in shell cordovan, that can happen if the leather gets wet unevenly.
Best method to deal with those is getting the shoes uniformly wet (sponge and water) and letting them dry very gently.
post #10840 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by bengal-stripe View Post

In this case "welt" and "welting" refers to the little raised dimples in shell cordovan, that can happen if the leather gets wet unevenly.
Best method to deal with those is getting the shoes uniformly wet (sponge and water) and letting them dry very gently.

I understand. I know what the word welt means and that it can also mean raised stripes or marks often associated with a blow...probably derived from "weal." But in the context of shoes it is confusing and indicates that the speaker isn't really conversant with the subject he is addressing.

Parenthetically, the Oxford Dictionary as well as several others, define "welt" in the context of shoemaking or tailoring first and foremost and only reference "welt" as a raised surface as the second or third definition.
post #10841 of 19072

I have some new Iron Ranger 8111 boots.  I will wear them maybe 1-2 times per week and not very hard.  The leather is "oil tanned".  I don't think I need waterproofing since I don't spend time jumping around in the mud or anything.  Should I condition these in the first year (Obenauf's or something) or just let them age for a while before doing anything? 

post #10842 of 19072
^
^
^
^
All information...whether it be internet related or not...should be filtered for authenticity--for people posing as something they are not; for pretending to knowledge or experience that they do not have; for advice or instruction coming from people who have not earned (worked for, paid their dues) the right to instruct or give advice except in their own solipsistic imaginings; for people who are convinced that their own singular, personal experiences are, or ought to be, universal....

Who somehow never see the need to own up or take responsibility for the accuracy or authenticity of what they say or do.

--
Edited by DWFII - 10/3/14 at 12:52pm
post #10843 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by bengal-stripe View Post


In this case "welt" and "welting" refers to the little raised dimples in shell cordovan, that can happen if the leather gets wet unevenly.
Best method to deal with those is getting the shoes uniformly wet (sponge and water) and letting them dry very gently.

 

Yes, that is exactly what the term means in this context. I kind of thought everyone knew that.

 

I've never tried the approach of getting the shoes uniformly wet (but then fortunately I've only had this issue once).  I presume by letting them dry gently, you mean let them dry naturally, unaided by any external heat source?

post #10844 of 19072
Quote:
Originally Posted by dapperdoctor View Post

I have some new Iron Ranger 8111 boots.  I will wear them maybe 1-2 times per week and not very hard.  The leather is "oil tanned".  I don't think I need waterproofing since I don't spend time jumping around in the mud or anything.  Should I condition these in the first year (Obenauf's or something) or just let them age for a while before doing anything? 

Keep them clean and if you see that the leather is looking dry use a light conditioner. Since it's oil stuffed I doubt it will need to be oiled or waxed for some time.
post #10845 of 19072
Hello, all

I am a little confused about whether or not Saphir Renovateur is colored and needs to be bought in a color matching that of your shoes. I was under the impression that it was a general purpose white cream that could be used on leather shoes of any color, though when trying to find some a cobbler was asking me what color it was that I needed, and hence my confusion.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Classic Menswear
Styleforum › Forums › Men's Style › Classic Menswear › **The Official Shoe Care Thread: Tutorials, Photos, etc.**