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** Quintessential Crockett & Jones Thread ** (reviews, quality, etc...) - Page 501

post #7501 of 12811

Yeah, brings the suspicion to me as a buyer, though I am sure everything is fine. But just the fact they won't disclose the supplier is making me cold ..

post #7502 of 12811
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoit1981 View Post

They are definitely C&J, but it is strange that they won't admit it.

id email the Crocket and jones factory and ask if they will re-sole it (what ever shoe/boot you suspect is made by Crockett and Jones), if they say no then they wont have made it
post #7503 of 12811

I'm not sure why people expect them to name their supplier.

 

I know it's a slightly different situation regarding people on this forum but if a normal customer asked and were told they were made by Crockett & Jones then what is to stop them just going to C&J. They don't see it as using a good name to sell 'their' boots, they just see it as a potential cutting out of the middle man as C&J sell to the marketplace themselves.

 

I'd say that was normal practice in any industry to never name a supplier.

post #7504 of 12811
It helps with the sizing due to last differences between makers. Dropping that much money, at least you want to have some assurance regarding fit.

Edit: You would still go through BB for their unique design and makeups, a lot of BB's models can't be found on the C and J website or stores.
post #7505 of 12811
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeninety View Post

id email the Crocket and jones factory and ask if they will re-sole it (what ever shoe/boot you suspect is made by Crockett and Jones), if they say no then they wont have made it

Good idea, however, I use C & J to work on my shoes/boots and they'll happily work on my old Grensons etc
post #7506 of 12811
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleav View Post

Good idea, however, I use C & J to work on my shoes/boots and they'll happily work on my old Grensons etc

but they wont do a factory recraft, they will look into it and if they didnt make it tell you so but that they can resole it and that they will send to a approved cobbler (Koko if in london)
post #7507 of 12811

C&J name is trademarked...there are legal ramifications for them to use their name, especially on a private labeled shoe...beyond what you consider to just be 'stupid'. You don't know what is involved in their contracts...and you shouldn't assume.

 

And most companies I have seen that private label C&J...do not use the C&J name.

 

The only time I ever see a company using a C&J name...is when they are 'selling C&J's',..an example of this would be Ben Silver...as opposed to companies like Purdey or BB selling private labeled 'C&J's with the Purdey or BB or etc. name...

 

Just like Ralph Lauren has shoes made by C&J, EG, & G&G...but these are private labeled and with the Ralph Lauren name...they never declare who makes them...just that they are made in England, etc.

post #7508 of 12811
Quote:
Originally Posted by andermt View Post
 

I'm not sure why people expect them to name their supplier.

 

I know it's a slightly different situation regarding people on this forum but if a normal customer asked and were told they were made by Crockett & Jones then what is to stop them just going to C&J. They don't see it as using a good name to sell 'their' boots, they just see it as a potential cutting out of the middle man as C&J sell to the marketplace themselves.

 

I'd say that was normal practice in any industry to never name a supplier.

 

I agree. This is a typical and acceptable business practice across industries. Brooks Bros, Ralph Lauren, et al do this with shoes. In the U.S., Sears does this with appliances. "Kenmore" doesn't make washers/dryers/etc. They re-label machines made by others.

 

We have no idea what goes into these business agreements. A retailer may tell C&J, "we'll buy X amount of your shoes, but we want to keep our name on it." Branding is important. Purdey may want to have some exclusive makeups and attach their names to it. You can likely find someone who will unofficially reveal their suppliers. BB sales associates (some of them at least) will admit which Peals are C&J. A Sears repair person is the one who told me that GE made my Kenmore refrigerator.

 

Again, this is normal business practice, and it's nice to have options. I like that BB, Ralph Lauren, etc. carry models that I can't find elsewhere. Variety is good. If you like Purdey's shoes, buy them. If you need 100% certainty that it's C&J because of fit, last, refurbishment, etc. reasons, buy directly from them. 

post #7509 of 12811
^^^ Fair enough. Not my experience but fair enough.

^^ PCK! re your last para - quite right, In that there is the fun. Spotting these for sale at hugely discounted prices because people don't realise what they are selling and/or buyers don't know what they are looking at.
post #7510 of 12811

I still think that such info should not be hidden from the buyer if asked. Me as a buyer would like to know more than just " Made in England" knowing that Purdey is not a shoe manufacturer ..

Not all are shoe experts to tell if the boots really worth the value and knowing who makes them might help with the decision and piece of mind. Of course, no one is forcing me to make a purchase ..

Take a look at this example: W.R company in UK they clearly stated in description Edward Green made the pair for them..

http://store.westleyrichards.com/edward-green-galway-rosewood-country-boot

post #7511 of 12811

It depends of the company. For example in BB site of my country most shoes can be categorized by the manufacter.

 

Also Sunspel mentions that their cashmere sweaters are made by Johnstons of Elgin.( more expensive than Johnstons btw)

 

Trickers make special models for many retailers but are easily recognisable , in most cases tha label is ''....by trickers'' ..

 

Now I prefer buying from the company that makes its own products in the most doable part of the process, like John Smedley that does the whole production on its own. 

post #7512 of 12811
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoit1981 View Post

They are definitely C&J, but it is strange that they won't admit it.

I have both the Coniston and the Purdey boot in question. I have no complaints about the Purdey boot despite the slightly thiner dainite sole.

Coniston is stamped:     8637  94B   8 U E  U21790   ( purchased in 2001 ). 

Pudey boot is stamped: 8637 99BE   8E     K1320  ( purchased 2013 ).

Make of that what you will.

For my part, they are equally excellent boots. My Coniston is much a lighter shade than the current model of that name, and for that reason I do find the Pudey in use more frequently.

post #7513 of 12811
Quote:
Originally Posted by embromides View Post

I have both the Coniston and the Purdey boot in question. I have no complaints about the Purdey boot despite the slightly thiner dainite sole.
Coniston is stamped:     8637  94B   8 U E  U21790   ( purchased in 2001 ). 
Pudey boot is stamped: 8637 99BE   8E     K1320  ( purchased 2013 ).
Make of that what you will.
For my part, they are equally excellent boots. My Coniston is much a lighter shade than the current model of that name, and for that reason I do find the Pudey in use more frequently.

the manager of the smaller c&J shop told me recently that if they made the shoe in question then the Knumber is what is needed to check the last etc, so it does look like they were made by crockett and jone
post #7514 of 12811
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nikola View Post
 

I still think that such info should not be hidden from the buyer if asked. Me as a buyer would like to know more than just " Made in England" knowing that Purdey is not a shoe manufacturer ..

Not all are shoe experts to tell if the boots really worth the value and knowing who makes them might help with the decision and piece of mind. Of course, no one is forcing me to make a purchase ..

Take a look at this example: W.R company in UK they clearly stated in description Edward Green made the pair for them..

http://store.westleyrichards.com/edward-green-galway-rosewood-country-boot

 

The example you gave is much more analogous to PCK1's Ben Silver example above.  Westley Richards is selling EG shoes, just as Skoak or Edwards of Manchester sells EG shoes.  They're not selling (at least not on this product) a private label.  It's a non-standard color but retailers frequently have exclusives.

 

Again, I don't see what the big deal is.  It's not like they're hiding some big secret.  Do you think RL should disclose which factory in Pakistan makes their shirts?

 

It all comes down to whether a retailer feels that they can maximize sales using their brand or using somebody else's brand.  RL, BB and Purdey clearly feel that their brand is more recognizable and/or more in line with the brand identity they want to project than C&J, hence the RL/Peal/Purdey branding on the products.  When J Crew markets shoes as being made by Alden or Alfred Sargent it's not because they're being more honest, it's because they feel that those two names have greater brand equity than their own and kick the offering upscale a notch.

post #7515 of 12811
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexSF View Post


Final Colour only depends from burnishing /finish process.

Probably they will call the factory asking to finish a pair darker or, if done locally, the "shoe doctor" will darken them with usual cream & polish, or maybe brush & dye (but I doubt)

 

My local shop has the equipment to be able to do it in-house. It came up in conversation a few months ago. It's more than cream and polish, because that could just be lifted off the shoe or boot by using renovateur. Some kind of dye option, from the sounds of it.

.

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