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Management Consulting Discussion - Page 22

post #316 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChicagoRon View Post

It's low-ish pay, but the people who stick it out (and I'm one of them) do it because the career advancement / learning curve is much faster/steeper.

As I said, it isn't a bad move depending on your career aspirations. But I wouldn't do 2-3 years of Deloitte or Accenture work just as a learning experience.
post #317 of 488
Not sure about all the consulting groups at Deloitte, but I know someone in their 2nd year getting paid 75k base.

They also will sponsor MBA's... so that's a draw if you want an MBA.
post #318 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by delirium View Post

Not sure about all the consulting groups at Deloitte, but I know someone in their 2nd year getting paid 75k base.
They also will sponsor MBA's... so that's a draw if you want an MBA.

75K base is fine but as I said, it's a lot of work and it isn't necessarily interesting work. It's mostly IT, short term outsourcing, and a very little bit of operations. I wouldn't log 60-70 hour weeks to do that shit for 75K a year.
post #319 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord-Barrington View Post

75K base is fine but as I said, it's a lot of work and it isn't necessarily interesting work. It's mostly IT, short term outsourcing, and a very little bit of operations. I wouldn't log 60-70 hour weeks to do that shit for 75K a year.

I think you're right and being pretty fair. Although, I'm getting paid less and working 50-65 hours at a small (non-VC-funded) tech company. Then again, I know I'm getting severely underpaid, but even if one knows what they're doing, tech is a hard market to break into without a solid technical background.

What's the expected pay for gov / NGO work? Industry I imagine at least in tech is about the same as Deloite/ Accenture for same amount of hours.

I also wonder how much I'd learn at a gov/NGO job. Any suggestions on what to look for?
post #320 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by delirium View Post

I think you're right and being pretty fair. Although, I'm getting paid less and working 50-65 hours at a small (non-VC-funded) tech company. Then again, I know I'm getting severely underpaid, but even if one knows what they're doing, tech is a hard market to break into without a solid technical background.
What's the expected pay for gov / NGO work? Industry I imagine at least in tech is about the same as Deloite/ Accenture for same amount of hours.
I also wonder how much I'd learn at a gov/NGO job. Any suggestions on what to look for?

BIG GOV (i.e. federal) is often around 55K after about a year for many positions, but that's for around 37.5 hours a week, 3 weeks - a month off per year and very, very good benefits. It's a pretty sweet gig out of the gate.

However, pay hits a ceiling pretty quickly and the very top of the payscale is very low compared to the private sector. Civil servants running agencies or departments with thousands of employees probably make around 200K per year, which sounds like a lot but is really peanuts considering the responsibility.

I would never advise anyone to do government (local, state, or federal) or NGO work for salary reasons. It will always pay OK but never enough to make it worthwhile. What does make it worthwhile is stability, flexibility, and time off. Especially in the US where paid time off is mostly terrible, it can be a nice gig for people who like to travel.

Also, industry hours are almost always 40 hours per week with minimal travel. And business travel (especially in the continental US) sucks balls so that shouldn't be considered a drawback.
post #321 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord-Barrington View Post

BIG GOV (i.e. federal) is often around 55K after about a year for many positions, but that's for around 37.5 hours a week, 3 weeks - a month off per year and very, very good benefits. It's a pretty sweet gig out of the gate.
However, pay hits a ceiling pretty quickly and the very top of the payscale is very low compared to the private sector. Civil servants running agencies or departments with thousands of employees probably make around 200K per year, which sounds like a lot but is really peanuts considering the responsibility.
I would never advise anyone to do government (local, state, or federal) or NGO work for salary reasons. It will always pay OK but never enough to make it worthwhile. What does make it worthwhile is stability, flexibility, and time off. Especially in the US where paid time off is mostly terrible, it can be a nice gig for people who like to travel.
Also, industry hours are almost always 40 hours per week with minimal travel. And business travel (especially in the continental US) sucks balls so that shouldn't be considered a drawback.

would you say going from public to private is impossible?
post #322 of 488
Not at all - in fact it's often quite easy because private companies want the connections. However, the benefits you give up make it a difficult decision.
post #323 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by yjeezle View Post

would you say going from public to private is impossible?

Not at all but it highly depends on what move you plan on making. Moving from enforcement in an agency to industry is not only easy, it's also lucrative and widespread. Similarly, transitioning from something like government procurement or contracting to industry is fairly widespread as well because you're basically going from the buy side to the sell side, so to speak.

Other areas are difficult to transition out of because the equivalent position either doesn't exist in the private sector or there is way less demand for it. HR and Policy folks are particularly at a disadvantage because both of these areas are bloated in the public sector and small/non-existant in the private sector.
post #324 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChicagoRon View Post

Not at all - in fact it's often quite easy because private companies want the connections. However, the benefits you give up make it a difficult decision.

That's why some people try to enter federal work, get "permanent status" and then aren't too afraid to leave. Basically because they're 401k and pension are vested and they get priority status when/if re-applying for government work.
post #325 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joffrey View Post

That's why some people try to enter federal work, get "permanent status" and then aren't too afraid to leave. Basically because they're 401k and pension are vested and they get priority status when/if re-applying for government work.

That's true, but it's still usually tough to get back in even if you have "first dibs" because your dibs are usually second to a whole other group of applicants (veterans, for instance) and federal hiring processes are almost comically long.

If you want to switch from public to private the good play is to build up a decent expertise in a certain enforcement or commercial area, then leave and not come back. You'll be forfeiting some benefits but by that time the salary you gain by leaving should make up (or close) for it.

The thing I would have trouble giving up if I switched to the private sector would be the ability to take month long vacations with no negative blowback. I can't think of too many places in industry where that flies.
post #326 of 488

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Edited by merkur - 4/19/12 at 11:56pm
post #327 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by merkur View Post

Is it hard to move between the MBB's once you're in? Also, is it possible to move between MBB's (eg from Bain to McKinsey) after only a year as an associate/business analyst or is this frowned upon? puzzled.gif

I doubt this will be much of an issue for anyone on this forum because this type of employment is totally off their radar.
post #328 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord-Barrington View Post

BIG GOV (i.e. federal) is often around 55K after about a year for many positions, but that's for around 37.5 hours a week, 3 weeks - a month off per year and very, very good benefits. It's a pretty sweet gig out of the gate.
However, pay hits a ceiling pretty quickly and the very top of the payscale is very low compared to the private sector. Civil servants running agencies or departments with thousands of employees probably make around 200K per year, which sounds like a lot but is really peanuts considering the responsibility.
I would never advise anyone to do government (local, state, or federal) or NGO work for salary reasons. It will always pay OK but never enough to make it worthwhile. What does make it worthwhile is stability, flexibility, and time off. Especially in the US where paid time off is mostly terrible, it can be a nice gig for people who like to travel.
Also, industry hours are almost always 40 hours per week with minimal travel. And business travel (especially in the continental US) sucks balls so that shouldn't be considered a drawback.

where do you find these kind of jobs - websites, networking, school job fairs, etc...?
post #329 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by easy_golfing View Post

where do you find these kind of jobs - websites, networking, school job fairs, etc...?

A lot of government agencies and departments do a type of recruitment for graduating seniors. If not, I would look directly on agency and departmental websites as well as those of cities, counties, states, etc. Networking is always a good road so if you know anyone who already works in the public sector, see if you can leverage that relationship to at least get an interview.

USAJobs is a piece of crap, btw, so don't even bother unless you're a veteran. I don't think anyone in the history of the world has landed a job through USAjobs.
post #330 of 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by merkur View Post

Is it hard to move between the MBB's once you're in? Also, is it possible to move between MBB's (eg from Bain to McKinsey) after only a year as an associate/business analyst or is this frowned upon? puzzled.gif

This is pretty unusual. Occasionally you have someone who joins us from one of the others - but that is normally due to mobility (moving from another country, and we can offer more in that location). There are very few good reasons for moving. Internal networks are incredibly important - and by moving you would completely reset these.
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