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Management Consulting Discussion - Page 16

post #226 of 496
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbharris88 View Post
How is this any better than IB? I think people often underestimate the amount of hours for MC when comparing the two.

I did both (Lehman, Citi, McKinsey). Ibanking is worse. Ibanking culture is worse. Ibanking learning is worse.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joel_Cairo View Post
I liked her observations about the perverse incentives created by the law-firmization of the structure of consultancy and the therapist-ization of the actual service being sold. Makes me wonder if a "just the facts ma'am" business model could even survive anymore.

I think these elements are only true to a partial extent. Yes partners and directors at McKinsey can be a therapist of sorts but all the executives I know would only participate in such activities as long as results were gained. They are under a lot of pressure to meet KPIs.
post #227 of 496
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artisan Fan View Post
I did both (Lehman, Citi, McKinsey). Ibanking is worse. Ibanking culture is worse. Ibanking learning is worse.


do people often go the other way? that is, from MC -> IB, especially at post-MBA levels when said candidate has little finance/biz background otherwise?
post #228 of 496
Quote:
Originally Posted by kxk View Post
do people often go the other way? that is, from MC -> IB, especially at post-MBA levels when said candidate has little finance/biz background otherwise?
Yes and no. I-bankers certainly have more monetary incentives than consultants, especially at the lower levels.
post #229 of 496
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kxk View Post
do people often go the other way? that is, from MC -> IB, especially at post-MBA levels when said candidate has little finance/biz background otherwise?

Yes, all the time. A mentor of mine at McKinsey went to Merrill then Deutsche. Did well.
post #230 of 496
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Metlin View Post
Yes and no. I-bankers certainly have more monetary incentives than consultants, especially at the lower levels.

In my view, the pay is better in banking but still not worth it.
post #231 of 496
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artisan Fan View Post
In my view, the pay is better in banking but still not worth it.

All b/c of the culture? What if I am a self-proclaimed asshole - would that not be better for me? I know IB i s not all 'models and bottles' glam, but still respectable. If you are going to be working 80 hour weeks regardless, might as well go for what pays the most, no? I'm still debating the switch from consulting to IB post-MBA...
post #232 of 496
would welcome any advice on this ... I have a good friend who's an APD at a top school. very interesting background in my opinion, yet admittedly weak on business experience. got a 3rd round interview for an associate internship at McK last year but no offer. this year for FT interviews no 3rd round with McK and B & B did not even grant an interview. job search was poorly planned and derailed after these poor results... now this person needs to regroup.

i have a hard time thinking of other career options that offer the same breadth and quality of experience, as well as resume-building and future options. but the response from MBB seems like a pretty definitive no... or is it? would it be possible to somehow network into a job at one of these firms? the prestige drop-off for other consulting firms makes it pretty hard for a new grad to get as excited about them... getting a job with them doesn't create the instant credibility that the big 3 offer. what would the gameplan be if pursuing boutique firms?

would be happy to discuss in more detail offline if anyone was inclined
post #233 of 496
yes, I have such a... uhm... friend as well. Some insight from the 'insiders' would be greatly appreciated, but the following is how I understand it. Obviously MBB are rather picky, so putting all your eggs into this basket is risky. There are many smaller firms out there, but I think they can be even pickier when somebody doesn't fit the standard MBA mold. I think the way it works with MBB is that they want to see something new and exciting on your resume before they give you another chance (though the logic behind it is strange if you just messed up a case in your interview). So maybe your friend should get a job at a brand-name company for two years and try again as experienced hire?
post #234 of 496
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redwoood View Post
yes, I have such a... uhm... friend as well.
Some insight from the 'insiders' would be greatly appreciated, but the following is how I understand it.

Obviously MBB are rather picky, so putting all your eggs into this basket is risky. There are many smaller firms out there, but I think they can be even pickier when somebody doesn't fit the standard MBA mold.
I think the way it works with MBB is that they want to see something new and exciting on your resume before they give you another chance (though the logic behind it is strange if you just messed up a case in your interview). So maybe your friend should get a job at a brand-name company for two years and try again as experienced hire?

We all have friends like these.....

when you say MBB want to see sth new and exciting on the resume before giving you another chance, what would you considering new and exciting? an internship, recent completion of a degree, another publication(probably not?) or sth else? please enlighten me
post #235 of 496
Quote:
Originally Posted by scientific View Post
would welcome any advice on this ... I have a good friend who's an APD at a top school. very interesting background in my opinion, yet admittedly weak on business experience. got a 3rd round interview for an associate internship at McK last year but no offer. this year for FT interviews no 3rd round with McK and B & B did not even grant an interview. job search was poorly planned and derailed after these poor results... now this person needs to regroup.

i have a hard time thinking of other career options that offer the same breadth and quality of experience, as well as resume-building and future options. but the response from MBB seems like a pretty definitive no... or is it? would it be possible to somehow network into a job at one of these firms? the prestige drop-off for other consulting firms makes it pretty hard for a new grad to get as excited about them... getting a job with them doesn't create the instant credibility that the big 3 offer. what would the gameplan be if pursuing boutique firms?

would be happy to discuss in more detail offline if anyone was inclined
I have the impression that boutique/smaller firms are even pickier.
post #236 of 496
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacecowboy View Post
I have the impression that boutique/smaller firms are even pickier.

Sometimes yes, sometimes no.
post #237 of 496
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacecowboy View Post
I have the impression that boutique/smaller firms are even pickier.

pickier in a different sense, i think.

i'm also an APD. i applied to basically every MC firm on the Vault 50. I only got interviews from M/B, an invitation to have lunch with an associate at Booz, and that's about it. A couple firms had their recruiters "write" back saying that they either want MBAs or people with a bit of (non-consulting, whatever that may be) experience and invited me to give them a call in a couple years.

Now, that might have to do with the fact that my grades were pretty shitacular, but I think the smaller/lower/boutique firms have (1) less resources to train (2) less patience for your mistakes/less margin of error and (3) less utility for whatever you may bring to table as an APD.

unless you happen to be like a BME PhD and want to work for LEK or something.
post #238 of 496
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artisan Fan View Post
Yes, all the time. A mentor of mine at McKinsey went to Merrill then Deutsche. Did well.

how? the opportunity just popped up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Artisan Fan View Post
In my view, the pay is better in banking but still not worth it.

thanks for the responses. i don't have delusions of becoming a wall st billionaire through banking. i think what i'd really like to do at the end of the day is VC or PE, and was wondering if banking might be a reasonable detour if there are no opportunities when it comes time to leave. the problem is that i have no finance/quant background whatsoever, and being an APD, already starting in a post-MBA role and pushing 30 soon--taking b-schools largely out of the equation.
post #239 of 496
Quote:
Originally Posted by kxk View Post
pickier in a different sense, i think.

i'm also an APD. i applied to basically every MC firm on the Vault 50. I only got interviews from M/B, an invitation to have lunch with an associate at Booz, and that's about it. A couple firms had their recruiters "write" back saying that they either want MBAs or people with a bit of (non-consulting, whatever that may be) experience and invited me to give them a call in a couple years.

Now, that might have to do with the fact that my grades were pretty shitacular, but I think the smaller/lower/boutique firms have (1) less resources to train (2) less patience for your mistakes/less margin of error and (3) less utility for whatever you may bring to table as an APD.

unless you happen to be like a BME PhD and want to work for LEK or something.

Your situation is similar to my friend's. He only had a shot with M/B too but it didn't work out. And I totally agree with what you said about boutique firms.
A question here: what about a BME PhD? Because they are familiar with medical device industry or sth else? How about LEK? i know they recruit life sciences phd, is that what you are referring to?
post #240 of 496
Thread Starter 
Some people call me a space cowboy, some call me the gangster of love, some people call me Maurice...
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