Here's a picture of my three month old SD in dress brown leather. You can see the area that "peeled" back and had to be glued after a light scrape against something when they were less then a week old. I've read how tough this leather is and was wondering if the dress brown is more prone to this then other "softer" leathers or maybe the leather needed to relax as they were so new. I haven't seen mention of this so I thought I'd share.
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Custom White's Boots ... Thoughts? - Page 111post #1651 of 91006/15/13 at 3:06pmpost #1652 of 91006/17/13 at 5:48ampost #1653 of 91006/17/13 at 8:29ampost #1654 of 91006/17/13 at 10:15ampost #1655 of 91006/17/13 at 10:30ampost #1656 of 91006/17/13 at 1:20pmpost #1657 of 91006/17/13 at 1:20pmpost #1658 of 91006/17/13 at 4:29pmAT83 -- I first made a tracing of my foot and took measurements. I then called Baker's and talked to Andrew who decided I would probably need something close to a 12.5 D. I ordered my boots at that time, and Andrew arranged to send me a pair of 12.5 D Smokejumpers to check the fit. The Smokejumpers arrived, and I tried them on. They seemed to fit okay in the ball but were far too wide in the heel. The boots had the soft toes, so I could check for spacing around my toes and measure accurately for length. I then took pictures with my foot and ankle flexed in the boot and the laces tied tightly to show how much extra material there was in various places around my foot and ankle. I then called Andrew and emailed him the pictures so we could look at them together and discuss the fitting problems. Andrew asked me to retrace my feet while seated with my ankles flexed slightly forward then take measurements of my feet, ankles and the tracings of my feet, all while we were on the phone. I then emailed all the tracings and measurements to Andrew, so he had those along with the pictures and our conversations. I called back several days later and talked with Kyle Baker, who was also very helpful. He looked at all the information I had emailed and sent it on to White's. He also extensively talked about my feet and the fitting while he looked at my information. He called White's on another line while I was still on the phone and got their recommendation too after going over everything with them. In the end, the people at both Baker's and White's all agreed I needed a 12.5 length with a C width ball and a B width heel, and that a special custom last would need to be built to accommodate my unique feet. There was an up-charge for the custom last that I gladly agreed to pay. I sure hope the boots fit, but if they don't, it's not for lack of everyone doing his best to get the correct fit! Of course, the Smokejumpers were returned to Baker's after they did their job of assisting in determining the proper size for me. I have two pairs of custom Russell boots. The second pair was built with a narrower heel than ball width, like the White's will be, and it fit much better than the first pair. I also had a pair of custom Arrow Moccasins built with the narrower heel, and they fit very well too. So I'm sure we are on the right track with the White's too. I don't think you need to go to the White's factory to be fitted if you go through the same process I did with Baker's, but a trip to the factory would be nice if you are in the area. BTW, I have a low instep too, but my feet are almost exact mirror images, so no difference is needed between boots, something that would make custom boots a great thing for someone with different sized feet like yours, especially if you were paying for custom lasts anyway. The reason Baker's sends out the boots to try on is to adjust the sizing based on how the most likely sized boots fit on your feet. Not quite as good as trying on lots of shoes in a shoe store, but still the same idea. It's a nice service Baker's provides to help assure a foot fit in the boots you order.
Rok -- Sorry about that cut. I've had that happen before and hated it. I think it was more bad fortune than a problem with the leather, but what do I know? I don't think the oiled leather would have been as fragile.
Climbing -- Love those boots. They look almost perfect after two years. Better than new, even.
Edited by Okal - 6/17/13 at 6:48pmpost #1659 of 91006/17/13 at 10:03pmAllan
Thank you for your reply. I didn't get anywhere near that level of detail after trying on the whites that bakers shipped. I was very concerned about how they fit in the heel as my feet were swimming in them and not even touching the back until they lifted mid step up that rear curve. The response was to just order a swing last in a c width and they would break in, which I didn't think sounded right. I am hopefully getting a pair of Allen Edmonds made, should find out this week, and they would fulfill my boot needs for the time being. If the AE's fall through I may pursue the whites further, including a possible trip to Spokane. Thank you again for responding. I really hope you get some great boots that fit you perfectly.
ATpost #1660 of 91006/17/13 at 10:42pmpost #1661 of 91006/17/13 at 10:42pmAT,
I'm glad I got great service in custom fitting my SDs, and sorry you got something less. The advice you got on the swing last may very well be correct because that was initially what I intended to do until pursuaded otherwise by the folks at White's. At least the people I spoke with there did not seem as enamoured with the swing last. I will let you know how my boots end up fitting. Hopefully, VERY WELL, since the process has been time consuming and expensive and will only be worthwhile if I really like the boots and get an outstanding fit that is comfortable for all-day wear. If this works for me, then it ought to work well for you too, because we both seem to have similar feet, other than the symmetry of mine versus yours. I should have my HH boots within the next couple of weeks, so if you decide to wait on the Allen Edmonds, I may have some experience with the White's on my feet before long. I hope they are great and fit me perfectly too. I will know soon.
Allanpost #1662 of 91006/18/13 at 4:04pm
AT83 and Allen
I'm in no way discounting Bakers; they seem to provide a high level of service.
But I personally do not understand why a guy wouldn't just trace his foot and deal directly with Whites, if that is who's boot your buying? Specially if you have special needs in a last or at minimum concerns about needing a custom fit.
I have been dealing with Whites directly for over 15 years and have had nothing but top shelf service.My feet are significantly different enough that my left foot (due to a bad accident) requires some custom tooling. I have my 3rd pair of Whites on order as we speak, and although they have built (2) other pairs for me; I feel my feet and my hard earned money are worth waiting a little extra time for Whites to look at my current tracings and decide what would fit best.
I have not been to Spokane to the retail center, so I cannot personally speak to that segment of the business. It's a bummer to hear another person on this thread had a bad experience in person.
Your AE's will likely be awesome too!
But if you are truly interested in Whites, I recommend following the old style procedure they have and deal "directly" with Whites.
Scottpost #1663 of 91006/18/13 at 4:37pmpost #1664 of 91006/18/13 at 4:51pmScott,
I had the benefit of both Baker's and White's looking at my tracings and measurements, so I don't believe I sacrificed anything by going through Baker's. The boots Baker's sent for me to try on were a big help, especially because I am somewhat between sizes and have a low instep that requires some adjustments in the fitting. As long as the fit is perfect on the first pair of boots, I don't suppose it makes any difference whether you go through White's directly as opposed to ordering though Baker's, but I have seen enough people who didn't get a good fit through White's and had to deal with that issue on their next order. That's what happened to me with Russell's, and my first pair never fit properly. I'm glad you got a good fit right off the bat. Hopefully, I will too by going through Baker's. If I do, my first pair of White's won't be my last.
B-Ewing -- I think you may be right. Baker's told me they would take care of me on the fit.
Edited by Okal - 6/19/13 at 10:32pmpost #1665 of 91006/19/13 at 3:56pm
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