man, if you feel that way, it's way over your head but that's not what I intended. It's too bad, because this is all a google search away, and your style and world would blow way open. I'm trying to get people more in touch with their personal style here, instead of languoring in some sort of styleforum/messageboard groupthink du jour type thing - there's actual groupings and better curated genres for this stuff.
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The new official TOJ thread, 2011 - Page 1154
post #17297 of 30804
3/20/12 at 1:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by impolyt_one 
JOKER has no elements of Onii-kei, man. JOKER is basically a magazine like Mens Non no without the yearly inclusions of high and low, and the pricepoints of JOKER stuff tends to be just a tad lower than the nicer stuff in Non-no. Onii-kei is not mainstream enough to warrant more than the flashiest, most dedicated magazines like Egg. It's not something that Japanese guys really 'sort of' do or try to incorporate into other styles. Onii-kei exists there, floating in the middle really, it shouldn't particularly overlap with Men's Non-kei besides the shared age demographic, but socioeconomically, they are disparate. Onii-kei is sort of yankee/NEET style, a group rejecting higher education or proper work, whereas Mens Non-no guys tend to be locked into the more conventional societal ideals that Japan puts on them - they tend to be high school or college students, with aspirations of working at a company, etc.

JOKER has no elements of Onii-kei, man. JOKER is basically a magazine like Mens Non no without the yearly inclusions of high and low, and the pricepoints of JOKER stuff tends to be just a tad lower than the nicer stuff in Non-no. Onii-kei is not mainstream enough to warrant more than the flashiest, most dedicated magazines like Egg. It's not something that Japanese guys really 'sort of' do or try to incorporate into other styles. Onii-kei exists there, floating in the middle really, it shouldn't particularly overlap with Men's Non-kei besides the shared age demographic, but socioeconomically, they are disparate. Onii-kei is sort of yankee/NEET style, a group rejecting higher education or proper work, whereas Mens Non-no guys tend to be locked into the more conventional societal ideals that Japan puts on them - they tend to be high school or college students, with aspirations of working at a company, etc.
IDK man, clearly you know a whole lot more than I do about the scope of this but 5351 did collab items with Joker last year and Kiryuyrik, Shellac, Galaabend, Attachment and others are featured in SENSE constantly? Basically you're saying I belong in the onii-kei bucket even though I don't buy anything from any of the brands in those magazines whereas I actively buy and follow brands in the non-kei mags but I don't fall into that bucket at all because ... what, I like snakeskin and have "flashy" hair?
I relate a lot more to this:

Than this:

post #17298 of 30804
3/20/12 at 1:02pm
post #17299 of 30804
3/20/12 at 1:02pm
post #17300 of 30804
3/20/12 at 1:09pm
Quote:
Even if you remove the magazines entirely and just look at it from a style categorization point of view, I still think it's pretty cool. Then again, I've read way too many studies on culture.
You said there were scans available, where?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brad-t 
IDK man, clearly you know a whole lot more than I do about the scope of this but 5351 did collab items with Joker last year and Kiryuyrik, Shellac, Galaabend, Attachment and others are featured in SENSE constantly? Basically you're saying I belong in the onii-kei bucket even though I don't buy anything from any of the brands in those magazines whereas I actively buy and follow brands in the non-kei mags but I don't fall into that bucket at all because ... what, I like snakeskin and have "flashy" hair?

IDK man, clearly you know a whole lot more than I do about the scope of this but 5351 did collab items with Joker last year and Kiryuyrik, Shellac, Galaabend, Attachment and others are featured in SENSE constantly? Basically you're saying I belong in the onii-kei bucket even though I don't buy anything from any of the brands in those magazines whereas I actively buy and follow brands in the non-kei mags but I don't fall into that bucket at all because ... what, I like snakeskin and have "flashy" hair?
Like I said man, I feel it's not about the brands so much as the 'coordi' and the look, and you wear makeup and have the hair, etc - if you stepped into Shibuya you would not be identified as Onii-kei, no. Real Onii-kei is extreme and very hard-edged, those guys look like they don't even bathe that much. You'd possibly be labeled Visual-kei.
Keep in mind that in Japan, people don't necessarily buy these mags and take them home - they're reading them for free for about 10-15 minutes at the 7-11 and the takeaway is just very braindead visuals, pictures only usually. Readers don't pore over the brands, prices, socioeconomic structures normally. That's the editorial side of the job. ANyway, people do get some sort of takeaway from it, and they figure out their style. They probably go for the same magazine on the rack each time, and ignore others, thereby enrolling in a 'zoku' if they're committal enough.
Kiryuryrik, Shellac, GalaabenD, Attachment - disparate labels, also kind of bottom-mid fodder that a lot of magazines kinda pass around within Mens Non-kei, maybe lower filler for the Mode mags (SENSE, as you said, but SENSE 'specializes' in 'black mode' - focusing only on items that come in black) - but I don't think you'd get identified as either Men's Non-kei or Mode, your taste is too extreme and you go for items that have embellishments, themes, or some sort extreme design twist. Men's non-kei is 'cute' and fairly clean style, and nowadays it gravitates towards pseudo-Americana leanings. Mode-kei encapsulates truly luxurious fashion - expensive, luxurious looks, straight off the runways of Europe. I don't know how to best explain this but you have a way of basically rejecting everything that is normally considered mainstream(? maybe not the best descriptor here) or normal (? again).
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post #17303 of 30804
3/20/12 at 1:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by impolyt_one 
man, if you feel that way, it's way over your head but that's not what I intended. It's too bad, because this is all a google search away, and your style and world would blow way open. I'm trying to get people more in touch with their personal style here, instead of languoring in some sort of styleforum/messageboard groupthink du jour type thing - there's actual groupings and better curated genres for this stuff.

man, if you feel that way, it's way over your head but that's not what I intended. It's too bad, because this is all a google search away, and your style and world would blow way open. I'm trying to get people more in touch with their personal style here, instead of languoring in some sort of styleforum/messageboard groupthink du jour type thing - there's actual groupings and better curated genres for this stuff.
i was annoyed with this at first tool but I only because I have no familiarity with these pub's... I'm curious how these are such a big factor in Japanese style subculture while in the US it seems we had only a few menswear/style magazines that were directed at wealthier/older demographic and perhaps the scattered zines that covered local skate/music/art scenes (don't jump on me if I'm missing something). piqued an interest now.
post #17304 of 30804
3/20/12 at 1:15pm
post #17305 of 30804
3/20/12 at 1:24pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike1445 
i was annoyed with this at first tool but I only because I have no familiarity with these pub's... I'm curious how these are such a big factor in Japanese style subculture while in the US it seems we had only a few menswear/style magazines that were directed at wealthier/older demographic and perhaps the scattered zines that covered local skate/music/art scenes (don't jump on me if I'm missing something). piqued an interest now.

i was annoyed with this at first tool but I only because I have no familiarity with these pub's... I'm curious how these are such a big factor in Japanese style subculture while in the US it seems we had only a few menswear/style magazines that were directed at wealthier/older demographic and perhaps the scattered zines that covered local skate/music/art scenes (don't jump on me if I'm missing something). piqued an interest now.
Yes, and that's exactly the point - America has no publications that cater to this many style genres, looks, lifestyles - just doesn't exist anywhere outside of Japan still. There's enough on that graph to show you that you could be picking up like 10 magazines (or more) a month filled with (and Japanese mags are like phone books, like ceoceo said) clothes you'd be interested in. That's like $100+ layout on mags, I actually do pick up all the relevant mags every month because I'm interested in the content but I like to keep a hold on the spread at any given time.
Try that in America, just can't happen. Style is confused in America still. At the most, the internet will fill in the blanks for the obsessed in the USA, rather than print mags, which are somewhat archaic in the US, and also basically dug their own grave in terms of usefulness. Different business model as well, the mags are almost cover to cover paid editorials that look like genuine magazine content (it's a tight cooperative thing) , whereas the tradition in the US to pay for large 1 or 2 page ads, like the first 50 pages of a GQ mag would be. The Japanese didn't really uptake on the internet until much later than the USA, they're not as interested as sitting and surfing the net all day for info intake. Also, like I said, standing at the Japanese 7-11 reading mags is a pasttime, it's called 'tachi-yomi' (standing+reading) and part of the magazine culture. Includes porno mags in the tachi-yomi culture, but all mags are fair game for that.
post #17307 of 30804
3/20/12 at 1:27pm
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I gave Dan, before I left Korea, like 2 100L trash bags full of Japanese mags, most of them from the Mode/Mens Non-kei/Italian and AMerican-keis. I'd say there was like 300-500 in there, haha. Collected over the span of 3 years. I have lived in Japan for 6 months but I have about 100 mags stacked up in a corner of my bedroom already, they're obviously easier to get over here....
post #17309 of 30804
3/20/12 at 1:29pm
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I think you are confusing what is your 'aspirational look' vs the final product, we all have aspirational looks and desired stylings, but you know, from a quick glance and without giving it too much thought, I think many would say you do resemble something closer to the left guy on the cover of Men's Knuckle, rather than the styling at the top from SENSE.
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