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RM Williams Boots - Everything You Wanted to Know - Page 10

post #136 of 3887
What is the price difference between the NYC Store and online vendors?
post #137 of 3887
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beckwith
What is the price difference between the NYC Store and online vendors?
NY store is about twice as much (or nearly so, depending on the model, etc.) as the Australia-based online vendors mentioned above in this thread.
post #138 of 3887
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beckwith
What is the price difference between the NYC Store and online vendors?

Well the difference between Nungar and Ben Silver is about $250. Of course, had I ordered the boots from Ben Silver in mid October, they'd be here by now
post #139 of 3887
Quote:
Originally Posted by edmorel
Well the difference between Nungar and Ben Silver is about $250. Of course, had I ordered the boots from Ben Silver in mid October, they'd be here by now


Yeah, I'm starting to get anxious about my Australian order too. In the meantime, I've gotten two pairs from STP...
post #140 of 3887
Thread Starter 
Custom orders take ages - up to about 8 weeks. Shipping to the US can add another 2 weeks onto the order too.
post #141 of 3887
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sator
Custom orders take ages - up to about 8 weeks.

Shipping to the US can add another 2 weeks onto the order too.
The thing is, mine _shipped_ four weeks ago. Not from nungar, tho.
post #142 of 3887
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by grimslade
OK, here, hopefully, are some pictures of the 10.5H and 11.5G Craftsmen, as compared to each other and to 11.5 EEE Park Avenues and 12 EEE AE Harrisons. I was struck that 11.5 RMWs, which should be the equivalent of 12.5 AEs, are still measurably shorter than the 11.5 AEs, and that they are no narrower than even the widest AEs, although I had trouble conveying this fact in pictures. I hope someone finds these useful in trying to figure out sizing.

Same two shoes again, showing (hopefully) that they are pretty much the same size:



If I could take a picture with the soles right against each other, the size similarity would be even clearer. Anyway, I thought this might interest those still struggling with RMW sizing issues.

Great post.

In other words to get a fit like your PAs you've had to go up in size and drop down in width. If I showed a pic of Sz 8D PAs vs Sz 7G (standard width) Craftsmans you would see that the AE was longer but the RMW was a bit wider.

It just confirms a couple of things:

1. RMWs run short and wide (RMW standard width is like an AE E fit)
2. PAs on the Nr 5 last are made on an elongated last (though even then RMWs run shorter and wider than AEs made on other lasts).
3. US size minus 1 in standard width is a rough formula that really accounts poorly for width
4. Conversion with: US size (in D width) minus 0.5 + dropping down two RMW widths often works better than the quick and dirty formula of US size minus 1 in a standard width.

I find this to be the case for me as well. But I avoided recommending it up front because it is so complicated. However, I am beginning to wonder if I should rewrite my post to recommend doing it more strongly. The other problem is that there is only one last you can drop down 2 widths in - and the chisel toe last for the Craftsman isn't one of them. If you wear EEE width shoes already, it is easier to do however.

I might have to recommend different conversion formulae for different lasts and models. Tricky!
post #143 of 3887
I have a pair of 10.5G French Veal Craftsmen on the way from Nungar. I normally wear either an 11.5D or 12B in Park Avenues, and 12B in most other shoes. Steve recommended I stick with the 10.5G, rather than move up to an 11G, but now I'm concerned that the boots are going to be too short.

I'm fairly certain these were custom ordered from the factory. If they don't fit, am I shit out of luck, or should I be able to exchange them?? (I know I could ask Steve this question, but you all seem to be better about responding than he is)

Thanks
post #144 of 3887
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexP415
I have a pair of 10.5G French Veal Craftsmen on the way from Nungar. I normally wear either an 11.5D or 12B in Park Avenues, and 12B in most other shoes. Steve recommended I stick with the 10.5G, rather than move up to an 11G, but now I'm concerned that the boots are going to be too short.

I'm fairly certain these were custom ordered from the factory. If they don't fit, am I shit out of luck, or should I be able to exchange them?? (I know I could ask Steve this question, but you all seem to be better about responding than he is)

Thanks

I don't want to ignore your query, but I have no idea what steve's return policy is, so I can't help, either. I don't think it's a foregone conclusion that the 10.5s won't fit you, but I wouldn't say you're out of the woods, either. Let us know what happens.
post #145 of 3887
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sator
Great post.

In other words to get a fit like your PAs you've had to go up in size and drop down in width.


Thanks, Sator. I would just clarify a bit. The 11.5s are, if anything, a trifle long/loose. It may be that an 11G (RMW sizing) would be perfect, but I tend to like my shoes on the large size and the 11s are not readily available at comparable prices. I will certainly keep the 11.5s and find them quite comfortable.

I suspect, however, that 11G(RMW)=11.5EEE (AE PA) -- for me, at least. That is, down half a (nominal) size and a width or two. In some AE lasts, I find that
12s fit me better than 11.5s, but the 5 last is, as you say, elongated by AE standards.
post #146 of 3887
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexP415
I have a pair of 10.5G French Veal Craftsmen on the way from Nungar. I normally wear either an 11.5D or 12B in Park Avenues, and 12B in most other shoes. Steve recommended I stick with the 10.5G, rather than move up to an 11G, but now I'm concerned that the boots are going to be too short.

Thanks

I am pretty certain everything will be OK. You've chosen the safest option and there is a 96% chance things will work out well. I know more about how AEs fit than Steve or any other RMW seller in Australia will ever know. I spent a long time thinking about how to convert AE sizes to RMW.

The extra width in the toe box compensates for the shorter length. That's why the US AE size minus one in standard width usually works. In fact you'll probably notice that your RMWs feel a bit looser than your AEs. Part of the reason is that French veal calf is quite thin and soft, whereas the standard leathers from AE are a bit thicker and harder.

I wear 8D or 8.5C in a Park Avenue and I find a RMW 7G to have a looser fit. However, RMW 7.5E (extra narrow) fits me more like an AE 8.5C - a snugger fit. But fiddling around with lengths and widths like this to get an obsessively perfect fit is really quite hard.
post #147 of 3887
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sator
I am pretty certain everything will be OK. You've chosen the safest option and there is a 96% chance things will work out well. I know more about how AEs fit than Steve or any other RMW seller in Australia will ever know. I spent a long time thinking about how to convert AE sizes to RMW.

The extra width in the toe box compensates for the shorter length. That's why the US AE size minus one in standard width usually works. In fact you'll probably notice that your RMWs feel a bit looser than your AEs. Part of the reason is that French veal calf is quite thin and soft, whereas the standard leathers from AE are a bit thicker and harder.

I wear 8D or 8.5C in a Park Avenue and I find a RMW 7G to have a looser fit. However, RMW 7.5E (extra narrow) fits me more like an AE 8.5C - a snugger fit. But fiddling around with lengths and widths like this to get an obsessively perfect fit is really quite hard.

Thanks, Sator. My confidence is renewed. Now if the boots would just GET here already...
post #148 of 3887
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexP415
Thanks, Sator. My confidence is renewed. Now if the boots would just GET here already...

Actually if I did have a worry it is that the boots will be slight touch on the loose side.

I am trying to tweak my recommendations so that people get a proper snug fit. I think boots should be worn snug.
post #149 of 3887
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by grimslade
Thanks, Sator. I would just clarify a bit. The 11.5s are, if anything, a trifle long/loose. It may be that an 11G (RMW sizing) would be perfect, but I tend to like my shoes on the large size and the 11s are not readily available at comparable prices. I will certainly keep the 11.5s and find them quite comfortable. I suspect, however, that 11G(RMW)=11.5EEE (AE PA) -- for me, at least. That is, down half a (nominal) size and a width or two.
Actually this is almost my experience exactly!!! To get the same snug fit I do on AE PAs what you have to do this: AE PA size minus 0.5 but drop down on 2 widths down from your usual width ie if you wear AE EEE width you should wear RMW H width (2 widths down from usual*). This means that if you are an AE 11.5EEE you should wear RMW 11H In summary then: If you wear AE 11.5EEE your best RMW size is 11H If you wear AE 11.5E = RMW 11F If you wear AE 11.5D = RMW 11E If you wear AE 11.5C = RMW 11D In my case I wear AE PA 8D so my best RMW size is 7.5E. There is one last which comes in D, E, F, G, H and I widths. I have a pair of 7.5Es on order now. The result is an amazingly snug fit, especially around the ankle but also a much sleeker look. Problem is that the Crafstman comes on a last for which they only have F,G, and H fits. So this won't work for everyone wanting boots on the chisel toe last but it works well in cases where you wear wide fit shoes to start with. For example if your AE PA size was 10EE then you could order RMW 9.5F * By usual width I mean if that AE D width is normal width and RMW G is normal width. 2 widths down from normal width is E in the RMW system. If your normal AE width is EEE then the equivalent RMW width is H - but only if you use the AE size minus 0.5 formula.
post #150 of 3887
Thread Starter 
If you like the Craftsman on the chisel toed last and due to its limited range of widths you can't use the AE size minus 0.5 formula, this is the alternative: AE PA size minus one - but drop down just one width AE PA size 11.5EE = RMW 10.5H AE PA size 11.5E = RMW 10.5G AE PA size 11.5D = RMW 10.5F If you wear AE C widths or AE EEE widths then: AE PA size 11.5EEE = RMW 11H (assumes you can also fit an AE PA 12EE) AE PA size 11.5C = RMW 10.5F (assumes you can also fit an AE PA 10D) The results are more satisfying if you use the first forumula of AE PA size minus 0.5 & drop 2 widths - but this is pretty good too. If you are happy with the rounded toe lasts where a wider range of widths are available then you can do this: AE PA size 11.5EEE = RMW 10.5I AE PA size 11.5C = RMW 10.5E
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