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Nigel Cabourn - Page 188

post #2806 of 4636
Well the selvage workers trousers arrived and I won't be altering them. The fit is full, but with the full on 30's style high waist works for me. I need to figure out the best shirting to wear with them - it's going to have to be something fairly slim in the chest, although Ideally full in the arms... They're the SS12 versions, so a little bit light for the current weather which gives me a while to figure out how to wear them.
post #2807 of 4636
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManofKent View Post

Well the selvage workers trousers arrived and I won't be altering them. The fit is full, but with the full on 30's style high waist works for me. I need to figure out the best shirting to wear with them - it's going to have to be something fairly slim in the chest, although Ideally full in the arms... They're the SS12 versions, so a little bit light for the current weather which gives me a while to figure out how to wear them.

Sounds like you like them - you will be trying to find the jackets to match them next!

One hell of a bargain
post #2808 of 4636
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Gill Sans View Post

Sounds like you like them - you will be trying to find the jackets to match them next!

One hell of a bargain

Yes - they're different, but in a good way.

The seller has had odd Cabourn bit before - generally the small end or the large end of the size scale - nothing much in the 50/52 size 2/3 range
post #2809 of 4636

In case anyone might be interested, I did a blog-post about the Cameraman:

 

http://welldresseddad.com/2013/03/01/icons-nigel-cabourn-cameraman-jacket/

post #2810 of 4636
Nice write-up. The actual mix of the vintage jackets is very interesting. Nigel is wrong though (or the interviewer made a mistake) in calling the top part a British Naval jacket. It´s clearly a US Navy ´Parka, wet weather, spec 288b´. I have one of those and a cameraman, if people are interested I could take some photographs tonight comparing details.
post #2811 of 4636
I was drawn in to the H&M cameraman yesterday while at the mall. I previously knew off the authentic version but not much about the details. After purchasing the rip-off I went home and educated myself more on the heritage of the original NC cameraman. After my research I realized that my conscious will not likely let me keep the cheap rip-off...so it will be going back to the store.

But I did manage to take a pic this morning for any interested parties. Fit seems good, details and quality are surprisingly solid as well. The top blue part is pretty bright though.
post #2812 of 4636
sorry double post
post #2813 of 4636
Quote:
Originally Posted by taiAtari View Post

Nice write-up. The actual mix of the vintage jackets is very interesting. Nigel is wrong though (or the interviewer made a mistake) in calling the top part a British Naval jacket. It´s clearly a US Navy ´Parka, wet weather, spec 288b´. I have one of those and a cameraman, if people are interested I could take some photographs tonight comparing details.

I'd find the photos interesting.

I suppose it's possible the same or extremely similar garments could have been produced for both forces. The clips were certainly adopted by the US Navy for several garments, although I think they were first used by the British Army in the late 30's/early 40's.
post #2814 of 4636
Quote:
Originally Posted by taiAtari View Post

Nice write-up. The actual mix of the vintage jackets is very interesting. Nigel is wrong though (or the interviewer made a mistake) in calling the top part a British Naval jacket. It´s clearly a US Navy ´Parka, wet weather, spec 288b´. I have one of those and a cameraman, if people are interested I could take some photographs tonight comparing details.

Some great posts regarding the Cameraman 

 

This is really interesting and we need more contribution here but if you look at the video it is the US Navy wet weather smock spec 288b just as you say, folded laying on top of a field coat.

 

Nigel mentions in the interview that he used photographs of his archival garments to piece the jacket together which in 2003 predated the exhibition which was in 2009 - he might not have used the same jackets - it could have been a British smock which had similar, button or tie fastenings with just the clips used off the US coat -  I guess we might never know.

 

This is the smock shown in the exhibition - US Navy 288b

 

 

 

here it is in the case from the 2009 exhibition (6 years after the design or the first release of the Cameraman)

 

 

LEAD Technologies Inc. V1.01

 

 

The 'male' prong is the same as the Cameraman but the 'female' part is different to the ladder type part used on the Cameraman

 

Where the ladder type design comes from I don't know - it haven't seen this on any vintage garments. It may be an original NC design - does anyone know ?

 

Interestingly there are photos of Wilfrid Noyce wearing the British equivalent smock which in the 30's, 40's and 50's had string ties for the army version or in one photo the unusual 5 button throat fastening on the Naval equivalent both of which Nigel Cabourn has recreated in past seasons.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not that Nigel has ever said that the Cameraman is a replica of a garment Wilfrid Noyce wore - it has always been inspired from various photos and his talent as one of England's greatest climbers and the first to get to the South Col in the 1953 expedition.


Edited by Eric Gill Sans - 3/4/13 at 10:15am
post #2815 of 4636
Here some pictures of my Cameraman and the American Parka. Sorry for the poor quality, but the light is very bad right now.

They share some obvious design details, such as the clips (four instead of three on the parka and like Eric says a simpler non-adjustable system) , the covered ear-holes (two grommets on the NG, one on the parka and a slightly different shape of the outside cover) and the cuff, where the Cameraman has a much nicer but similar button arrangement.

Although the cameraman has a much nicer execution it seems to follow the general design in such a way I'd wager this particular parka is the inspiration for the top part of the jacket.


Edited by taiAtari - 3/4/13 at 10:23pm
post #2816 of 4636
Quote:
Originally Posted by taiAtari View Post

Here some pictures of my Cameraman and the American Parka. Sorry for the poor quality, but the light is very bad right now.

They share some obvious design details, such as the clips (four instead of three on the parka and like Eric says a simpler non-adjustable system) , the covered ear-holes (two grommets on the NG, one on the parka and a slightly different shape of the outside cover) and the cuff, where the Cameraman has a much nicer but similar button arrangement.

Although the cameraman has a much nicer execution it seems to follow the general design in such a way I'd wager this particular parka is the inspiration for the top part of the jacket.


comparison Cameraman usn parka 266k .jpg file

Thanks for those - it's certainly a close match.
post #2817 of 4636
Great photos and post - I think you are right and your wager is safe. I think youve proven beyond doubt that this is indeed the source garment

The reference to it being 'British' may be an interview innaccuracy or it may have been issued to British forces.

I am assuming Nigel knew the origin was the US as he has done a garment called 'US navy clip jacket' which is a jersey hooded top with these fastenings.

Interestingly I've just looked in Nigel's 'Ascent of Cabourn' book from the 2003 collection and the clips used on the first photo of the Cameraman are exactly as the US smock and there is a page featuring this clip describing as a 'naval clip with rivets'





The garments photo'd in the book were samples which were made to look worn and I do know there were modifications made on some garments when they were first released so was there a Cameraman first released which had the same clips or was the 'ladder' type adjuster specially designed for this jacket from its first release?

I now think that the ladder type adjuster is a NC design but can't be sure - need more research
Edited by Eric Gill Sans - 3/5/13 at 4:21am
post #2818 of 4636
The earliest (military) garment I know off with those clips, is British. The coat tropal lined, which seems to be the rough inspiration for the Beetham Duffel.

post #2819 of 4636

I really like the Beetham Duffel and wearing it quite often. The clips and the collar show the resemblance to the garmet above nicely. 

post #2820 of 4636
Quote:
Originally Posted by taiAtari View Post

The earliest (military) garment I know off with those clips, is British. The coat tropal lined, which seems to be the rough inspiration for the Beetham Duffel.

Thanks for this - Great post. Never knew about a clip version of the Tropal Coat. For some reason I've only seen a button version.

 

You are right the collar is exactly as the New Beetham Duffle

 

Here is a another photo of the same coat that shows an under flap - the proportion of the collar and detail is spot on

 

 

Processed By eBay with ImageMagick, R1.1.1.M1

 

love it !

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