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NBA 2016-2017 Season Thread - Page 587

post #8791 of 27050
Originally Posted by edmorel View Post

Its telling to me that Chandler and Amare have not really said anything publicy about Lin.

I found this curious as well. Melo really has a stranglehold on that team. I guess I just didn't realize the extent of it.
post #8792 of 27050
Thread Starter 
Every vid on ESPN involving Lin has Stephen A. SMith slandering him to make it seem like NY made the right decision it not matching. I mean seriously NY, if you're going to let the kid go, at least be decent about it and try not to smear his name.
post #8793 of 27050
Stephen A. Smith = facepalm.gif
post #8794 of 27050
Thread Starter 
Hah, what the fuck has Felton done to think he can talk like this? Dude is a fat, fucking failure at Portland last year.
A source close to Felton said that he wouldn't have come to New York to play behind Lin.

"He loves New York, but he wouldn't have agreed to come back to sit on the bench," the source said.

He is no more than a 2nd string PG at this point in his overweight career. I want to say he is the next Baron Davis but BDiddy has more talent in his pinky than this dude.
post #8795 of 27050
well, from the media's perspective, its a no brainer to say he is not worth it. If he goes to Houston and does well, you can always fall back on "no way anyone could tell he was going to be this good with only 25 games under his belt", "too much money for an unproven/drafted player" . If he does not do well, they'll all say "told you so!" and seem like basketball geniuses in their minds. All you need to read to know where the (NYC) media is on Lin, you just need to read how they keep falling back on the Miami game, how they made him look awful. Because no good player in the league has ever been made to look bad in a game. They quickly discount the LA game and the Dallas (Jkidd schooled) game, the clutch shots, the making your teammates better. They talk about how he can't go left (and we all know that is impossible to work on in the summer rolleyes.gif). They forget about Felton being outplayed by him, because Felton was unhappy in Portland so its OK for him to gain weight and play bad. Nothing like having two starters on your team (Melo, Felton) that have shown you that they will give up if they are unhappy with the team/coaching.

The larger issue here, bigger than Lin and bigger than whether Lin sucks it up in Houston or turns into John Stockton, is the insistence by Dolan and his cronies that the Knicks are a consistantly contending team. They refuse to blow up and rebuild, the wisdom being that NYC would never put up with a rebuilding team. Well, we've been playing like a rebuilding team for 11 years now and the team could have saved themselves about $200 million dollars and actually had a future if they had stuck with some of the young talent that has come through rather than trading for these duds. Instead we have a team that basically has a year or two to win it all, a team that has gotten worse and older while their competitors have gotten better. All of our eggs in the basket of Melo, a guy who so far in his career has been the consumate selfish player, who scares away guys like Phil Jackson from even considering coaching the Knicks. Melo has the ability to have the type of year Lebron had last year. He has the skils to carry this team over the top, yet we have one playoff win in the last two years to show for it.

Lin is a guy that is not going to complain on the court or to his coaches. He has made teammates play better and harder. He works his butt off to improve his game. He doesn't have the skills of a lot of guys, but has a lot of heart and has shown the unteachable ability to not back away from a big shot. I can't think of one current knick that I would describe in that manner, Chandler would come the closest.
post #8796 of 27050
Quoting Felton's agent:
“My gut is, with or without Jeremy, I think Raymond is the better point guard,” Dutt said earlier this week. “I think he’ll be the starter regardless.

I wonder if Melo's ego can be overshadowed by this guy's.
post #8797 of 27050


post #8798 of 27050
Thread Starter 
post #8799 of 27050
Jeremy Lin made this announcement on his Facebook page after the Knicks failed to match the Rockets offer.


This is what followed.







via Buzzfeed
post #8800 of 27050
Thread Starter 
The tax on Lin's deal might be much easier to handle if they weren't also paying a combined $7.2 million in guaranteed money to Camby, Kidd and Felton that season, even though the first two will be in their 40s and the third might be 300 pounds by then.


Hollingers Insider Full Article to those who might be interested in reading.
Knicks pick bad time to be frugal
After years of not worrying about money, fit, New York passes on Lin deal

So let me see if I got this straight:

NOW the New York Knicks are worried about financial prudence? Not when Amare Stoudemire signed a five-year, $95 million deal that nobody else was coming close to offering. Not when they burned any chance of a do-over by using the amnesty on Chauncey Billups. Not when they just agreed to spend over $10 million a year on Marcus Camby,Jason Kidd and Raymond Felton, even though none of them were any good last season.

And NOW they're talking about how well the pieces fit? Not when they traded for Carmelo Anthony to play with Stoudemire. Not when they had Mike D'Antoni coaching both of them. Not when they added other questionably fitting parts -- the aforementioned Camby and Felton, as well as Baron Davis and J.R. Smith -- and hoped the talent would offset their Frankensteinian fusion of non-complementary abilities.

But NOW?

The shocking thing about New York's decision not to match the Houston Rockets' three-year, $25.1 million offer sheet to Jeremy Lin -- and, to a lesser extent, not to match the Toronto Raptors' three-year, $20 million offer sheet to Landry Fields -- is that it flies completely in the face of their entire rationale in building this team.

Money wasn't supposed to matter. They were going to keep spending to build a champion.

Well, apparently now they care. By not keeping Lin and Fields, the Knicks have essentially yanked a half-baked cake out of the oven. They're over the luxury tax with no starting-caliber backcourt players and an uneasy Amare-Melo alliance up front. If they're trying to go 44-38 and still pay tax each of the next three years, they're off to a great start.

Of course, this was a money decision, and keeping Lin was going to cost some serious cash. I'm sure some small-market teams are high-fiving now that they've finally made a luxury tax punitive enough for a big-market team to care about it.

The luxury tax hit on Lin's $14.9 million salary in 2014-15 was going to be enormous; depending on your assumptions, it was likely to end up close to $30 million, bringing the total cost of employing Lin that season to $45 million. You could argue that Stoudemire or Anthony's contract is costing just as much, so it's not fair to say that Lin's deal is the one pushing them over. But given the money they've already sunk, an economist would rightly describe the $45 million figure in 2014-15 as the marginal cost of matching the Lin deal.

The Knicks, as our Larry Coon pointed out, could have reduced that bill to an extent by using the stretch provision on Lin, but that's almost as bad -- it's perhaps $25 million instead of $45 million, depending on which years the Knicks are in the tax, but you're paying Lin not to play and still need to spend more money (and tax) on somebody to play point guard.

Matching Fields and Lin would have produced an even more obscene wage bill that year; the Knicks' starting backcourt would have cost around $75 million in salary and tax, which is more than nearly every team's payroll in the NBA right now.

But again, the Knicks operated like this wasn't a problem. The tax on Lin's deal might be much easier to handle if they weren't also paying a combined $7.2 million in guaranteed money to Camby, Kidd and Felton that season, even though the first two will be in their 40s and the third might be 300 pounds by then. That's half of Lin's 2014-15 salary and nearly two-thirds of his tax hit right there, on players who likely will give the Knicks little or nothing that season.

That's not all: In the preceding two years, Camby, Felton, and Kidd will make $21 million to Lin's $10 million, and the Knicks are in the tax both seasons. Do the math and you'll see that the Knicks will pay just as much to Camby, Felton and Kidd over the next three seasons as they would have paid for Lin, even allowing for the two minimum salary players that would replace Camby and one of the guards.

Which leads to only two conclusions: Either (A) the Knicks thought they were actually better off over the next three seasons with Kidd, Camby and Felton, or (B) the Knicks front office thought it had permission to spend freely and would match Lin anyway, and then was blindsided by ownership. I don't have inside information as to which one happened, but it strikes me that A isn't the way to bet.

Instead, the Knicks will lose Lin without any compensation, which is nuts since he clearly had huge trade value.

(Side note: A sign-and-trade was not realistic in this scenario; because of the bizarre "Arenas rule" in the league's collective bargaining agreement, Lin stood to get a much bigger contract by signing an offer sheet than he could have made in a sign-and-trade and thus had zero reason to agree to one. Ditto for Fields.)

(Side note to my side note, for Lin fans making the "he's an expiring contract in 2014-15!" case: This is the one argument for keeping him that is actually pure nonsense. Expirings don't just vanish into the ether when they're traded; they're dealt for somebody with an even worse contract. Whether it was by paying Lin or paying somebody else, his final year was going to be phenomenally expensive.)

As for fit, I agree Lin is not a great one with the rest of the Knicks' roster. Of course, nobody on the Knicks is a great fit with the rest of the Knicks' roster, with the exceptions of Chandler andSteve Novak. Felton isn't a great one either. He's not much of an outside shooter, and like Lin his best results came running a pick-and-roll offense with the ball in his hands under Mike D'Antoni. Except the results weren't as good as Lin's, and he's heavier and older now. Good luck with that.

Meanwhile, this is only going to look worse once next season starts. Lin wasn't a great fit in New York, but my goodness does he fit in Houston. Kyle Lowry and Goran Dragic had the best seasons of their respective careers last season as point guards in Kevin McHale's system. The same thing will happen with Lin: They're going to give him the rock, get out of his way, and let him create to his heart's content. He'll be better with the Rockets than he ever would have been in New York.

Finally, a tip of the hat is due to the Rockets' front office. They've brilliantly exploited the fact that the third year of an "Arenas rule" contract could bring massive pain to a luxury tax team -- even one as rich as the Knicks -- and are going to clean up at the cash register as a result. Houston is already an immensely popular team in China as a result of the Yao Mingera. Now Lin can pick up where he left off. And as our J.A. Adande noted, this also may make them more alluring for Dwight Howard's global marketing ambitions.

All of this, however, gets back to one simple truth: The Knicks stopped following their own script just as the play reached its climax. It's great that they care about money and fit, but if that's the case they might have wanted to heed their own advice at some point between the Melo trade and yesterday.
post #8801 of 27050
Stay classy Knicks fans!
post #8802 of 27050
Thread Starter 
Originally Posted by Neo_Version 7 View Post

This is what followed.

via Buzzfeed

Dumb idiots who don't know shit. He signed the one and only offer he got. The Rockets were smart to alter it to a 3year deal because it did make NY reconsider matching. It was simply brilliant as Hollinger said.

The Knicks would not make a formal offer to Lin -- not then, or, ultimately, ever -- instead opting to steer him toward the open market so he could assess his own price.

...the Rockets came back with a revised offer: three years for $25.1 million, with the money rising from $5 million in the first season, to $5.225 million in the second, to $14.898 million in the third. (The relatively low values of the first two annual salaries are as mandated by the Collective Bargaining Agreement's "Gilbert Arenas" provision.)

By this point, Lin had no real idea what the Knicks would do. But there also wasn't much choice: He had all of one offer sheet in front of him to consider.
post #8803 of 27050
Originally Posted by Neo_Version 7 View Post

Jeremy Lin made this announcement on his Facebook page after the Knicks failed to match the Rockets offer.

Those are Melo socks.
post #8804 of 27050

I believe this guy knows something we do not. What say you, RFX?
post #8805 of 27050
I kind of wish Lin would be brash and outspoken and say something like:


but the reality is... Lin's being all subservient/silent AZN about this whole ordeal, and now theres actually a portion of peon brained NY Knick fans are starting to believe Dolan/Stephen A. Smith quasi racist hate sauce.

I'm so glad the Nets moved to brooklyn.
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